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Old Feb 10th 2013, 12:38 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Whoopazz View Post
The bike is in st catherines ON, I'm in edmonton Alberta... yeah shipping will be about $800, and I also have to get it crated by peninsula ducati.

There are none that are close to me, I've been checking the net for a used on for the past 2 months.... every day lol... I'll see how things go..



Thanks Gunny, I'm starting to think that way as well

I think for what the guy is asking for his base bike plus the crating and shipping you may be able to find a new 2012 for only a little bit more. Then you have the full 2 year warranty, no worries about break in, etc. One thing I didn't read in the ad for the Pani was whether it has ABS.
I know here in Ontario you can still pick up a new 2012 non ABS for a good price....just sayin'.
I am pretty sure Peninsula still has some new '12's, I was there yesterday. I deal with Colin at Apex Cycle in Waterloo. They are easier to deal with IMO.
Cheers, Brad
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Old Feb 10th 2013, 12:58 PM   #12
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Repost of running in instructions

RUN THE PISS OUT OF IT IF YOU WANT THE MOST POWER! Out of the box.
Run it up to top revs and let it engine brake back down or your valves will not seat. Also your piston rings will fit better from the compression. I talked with the President of Rexxer (ECU flash company, flashes Panigales, also runs Redline Ducati in VA), I have talked with many techs, read scholarly articles on this. Sorry if some of the information below is repeated from above.

Ducati:
Does not want you to take it over 7k for the first 620 miles and 8k up to 1000 miles not because it is broke in better, it is a legal issue. If the engine were to malfunction mechanically and break the odds that you could be seriously injured are greatly increased at higher RPM's, it's a safety requirement same as they have emission requirements which restrict engine power (just like the flat spot between 4-5k rpm). Because you're valves and piston rings are not fully seated it will continue to smoke. Sometimes may have a little on startup from condensation in the oil on well broken in engines.

What experts say:
Bike will have some condensation in the oil on startup so you may be seeing a bit of moisture especially in the colder weather. If you see a lot of smoke during warm/hot weather it is probably because your valves did not seat during break in. I have talked to many dealerships and mechanics, and read many scholarly articles on engine break in and here is what I have gathered-
1. Realize that the limitation they want you to keep is a legal parameter and not an engineering parameter.
2. To do a good break in, out of the box... run it to red line and then back down, the strong engine braking is what causes the valves to seat and proper seating means less unburnt fuel (causing smoke) and higher compression, therefore causing better performance out of your machine. As well as seating the piston rings to cause the same effects of smooth movement within the sleeves.
3. It is also normal for the Panigale and BMW S1000RR to burn roughly a quart of oil every 1,000 miles. (Called 2 dealerships and talked to the techs about why my bike needed oil every so often)

If anyone doesn't believe this, call a few well educated techs and ask them. Off the record of course. They can't legally tell you this information at work. Below is a dyno chart of a bike broke in by these methods. Look at the "stock" baseline
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Old Feb 10th 2013, 04:23 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Canduc View Post
I think for what the guy is asking for his base bike plus the crating and shipping you may be able to find a new 2012 for only a little bit more. Then you have the full 2 year warranty, no worries about break in, etc. One thing I didn't read in the ad for the Pani was whether it has ABS.
I know here in Ontario you can still pick up a new 2012 non ABS for a good price....just sayin'.
I am pretty sure Peninsula still has some new '12's, I was there yesterday. I deal with Colin at Apex Cycle in Waterloo. They are easier to deal with IMO.
Cheers, Brad
Thanks, I'd love to buy a new base, but there are none here in Alberta or BC or saskatchewan... only left overs are in ON. The bike is not a ABS, would be nice to have, but not necessary for me.

I'll phone apex tomorrow and see what they have. I know GP bikes had one non abs for $18,500 new and one ABS for a grand more left over.

Originally Posted by elitesoldier357 View Post
RUN THE PISS OUT OF IT IF YOU WANT THE MOST POWER! Out of the box.
Run it up to top revs and let it engine brake back down or your valves will not seat. Also your piston rings will fit better from the compression. I talked with the President of Rexxer (ECU flash company, flashes Panigales, also runs Redline Ducati in VA), I have talked with many techs, read scholarly articles on this. Sorry if some of the information below is repeated from above.

Ducati:
Does not want you to take it over 7k for the first 620 miles and 8k up to 1000 miles not because it is broke in better, it is a legal issue. If the engine were to malfunction mechanically and break the odds that you could be seriously injured are greatly increased at higher RPM's, it's a safety requirement same as they have emission requirements which restrict engine power (just like the flat spot between 4-5k rpm). Because you're valves and piston rings are not fully seated it will continue to smoke. Sometimes may have a little on startup from condensation in the oil on well broken in engines.

What experts say:
Bike will have some condensation in the oil on startup so you may be seeing a bit of moisture especially in the colder weather. If you see a lot of smoke during warm/hot weather it is probably because your valves did not seat during break in. I have talked to many dealerships and mechanics, and read many scholarly articles on engine break in and here is what I have gathered-
1. Realize that the limitation they want you to keep is a legal parameter and not an engineering parameter.
2. To do a good break in, out of the box... run it to red line and then back down, the strong engine braking is what causes the valves to seat and proper seating means less unburnt fuel (causing smoke) and higher compression, therefore causing better performance out of your machine. As well as seating the piston rings to cause the same effects of smooth movement within the sleeves.
3. It is also normal for the Panigale and BMW S1000RR to burn roughly a quart of oil every 1,000 miles. (Called 2 dealerships and talked to the techs about why my bike needed oil every so often)

If anyone doesn't believe this, call a few well educated techs and ask them. Off the record of course. They can't legally tell you this information at work. Below is a dyno chart of a bike broke in by these methods. Look at the "stock" baseline
Makes sense, much appreciated on the input.
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Old Feb 10th 2013, 09:52 PM   #14
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No problem. However, since he broke it in, the first 50 miles or so are the important ones. So since he has already long passed that point, I wouldn't worry too much about break in. Just ride the hell out of it from here on out if you do decide to get it. Make sure to have the first service done of course. Good luck! Welcome to the Ducati community!
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Old Feb 10th 2013, 10:13 PM   #15
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The way I see it there are two types of people re this subject... Those who talk about owning a Ducati and those who do it...

If the bike is being sold for the right money with the service history and warranty then stop talking and get on with owning one...

As for smoking... Both the S and base we have set up for racing this year had 300 KM's on them And then were flogged within an inch of its life "measurement given especially for our US brothers"

For those of you using metric that's approximatly 25mm

No major issues, an oil leak from the rear cam cover and a bit of fogging on the base dash... No more challenges than the yamaha's we raced...

Buy the bike and enjoy the "warm" content feeling of 1199 ownership... Get it "warm"

God I'm funny...
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Old Feb 11th 2013, 02:38 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Bowdy69 View Post
The way I see it there are two types of people re this subject... Those who talk about owning a Ducati and those who do it...

If the bike is being sold for the right money with the service history and warranty then stop talking and get on with owning one...

.
That about sums it up....pull the trigger already, where you live you'll appreciate the heated seat!
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Old Feb 11th 2013, 04:13 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by elitesoldier357 View Post
RUN THE PISS OUT OF IT IF YOU WANT THE MOST POWER! Out of the box.
Run it up to top revs and let it engine brake back down or your valves will not seat. Also your piston rings will fit better from the compression. I talked with the President of Rexxer (ECU flash company, flashes Panigales, also runs Redline Ducati in VA), I have talked with many techs, read scholarly articles on this. Sorry if some of the information below is repeated from above.

Ducati:
Does not want you to take it over 7k for the first 620 miles and 8k up to 1000 miles not because it is broke in better, it is a legal issue. If the engine were to malfunction mechanically and break the odds that you could be seriously injured are greatly increased at higher RPM's, it's a safety requirement same as they have emission requirements which restrict engine power (just like the flat spot between 4-5k rpm). Because you're valves and piston rings are not fully seated it will continue to smoke. Sometimes may have a little on startup from condensation in the oil on well broken in engines.

What experts say:
Bike will have some condensation in the oil on startup so you may be seeing a bit of moisture especially in the colder weather. If you see a lot of smoke during warm/hot weather it is probably because your valves did not seat during break in. I have talked to many dealerships and mechanics, and read many scholarly articles on engine break in and here is what I have gathered-
1. Realize that the limitation they want you to keep is a legal parameter and not an engineering parameter.
2. To do a good break in, out of the box... run it to red line and then back down, the strong engine braking is what causes the valves to seat and proper seating means less unburnt fuel (causing smoke) and higher compression, therefore causing better performance out of your machine. As well as seating the piston rings to cause the same effects of smooth movement within the sleeves.
3. It is also normal for the Panigale and BMW S1000RR to burn roughly a quart of oil every 1,000 miles. (Called 2 dealerships and talked to the techs about why my bike needed oil every so often)

If anyone doesn't believe this, call a few well educated techs and ask them. Off the record of course. They can't legally tell you this information at work. Below is a dyno chart of a bike broke in by these methods. Look at the "stock" baseline
I"m curious as to what the legal issues might be that you are talking about in regards to break in procedures. I'm not talking about the last part, I'm asking about your first comment that break in procedures are not to break the bike in better, it's for legal reasons.

I also am not sure I believe that valves need to be seated. Does that imply that they are not machined correctly from the factory? My mind is pretty simple (and I understand engines pretty well). All vehicles made have valves. Very few vehicles have engine problems related to valves not being seated properly. In fact, I can't remember reading of any engine problems related to it unless an engine has been seriously abused.

I also would not go by what racing teams do. Racing is a whole different situation. They run engines full bore with virtually no miles on them but then they also tear down engines and rebuilt them between every race. They don't have to worry about how an engine holds up for more than a few hundred miles. But they do have to find out very quickly in practice if everything is working properly at WOT before starting a race.
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Old Feb 11th 2013, 05:22 AM   #18
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My Ninjas, and most bikes, used to have stickers on the tach warning you of the break in period - remember?. And based on this forum, no perfect case has been made for not breaking in properly. I followed the manual, and I have no smoke - others oppisite. All the engines are breaking in differently. Ducati along with tons of other folks out there, say follow the manual. Doesn't mean you have to, or the bike won't work if you don't.
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Old Feb 11th 2013, 05:42 AM   #19
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JJ- just buy the bike dude ! You will not regret the choice. I am sure many concur here. Do I get a +1 anyone??????????
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Old Feb 11th 2013, 05:55 AM   #20
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I Ride: 1199 ABS, K1300S, ZX7R
+1
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