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Old Jan 16th 2018, 05:48 AM   #31
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I know, I know

I've said in another thread, I'm not hating, just sceptical. I just can't get hyped up about it. I want to, I just hope the R is the dogs danglies. But I wanted the V4 generally, not just the R version.
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Old Jan 17th 2018, 07:56 AM   #32
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Well shit....... I was right about one thing. The V4 is not enough for me to trade in my current R.

However, I have to eat my words again. The V4’s a nice bike man. As in I was impressed, I like it. I’m small too and the seating position for me was great. The tank is massive but when you get your head round that it’s not intrusive. The weather wasn’t great and the pre delivery checks hadn’t been done on the demo bike, but I’ll be test riding Friday if it’s okay.

So I’ve been going on about a lot I didn’t like, but there’s more that I do like. It was actually growing on me as I was going round it.

So I may have an order in for a V4S to sit along side the R.......... I haven’t told the wife yet!!!
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Old Jan 27th 2018, 11:31 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Steve B View Post
Pretty much this same argument was made at the introduction of the original 1199. Less low end than the 1198, thus a worse bike. I made the point then that the gearing would effectively slide the 1199's curve at a given road speed/gear on top of the 1198's, but that at the point where the 1198 was signing off, the 1199 would be taking off. Which turned out to be the case. Same generally applies here. At a given road speed and gear, the V4 will be turning more RPM (a commodity it has more of to work with), so the fact that it makes less power at say, 6,000 revs is irrelevant. The flatter, broader power curve will make the power more accessible, which they would have been hard-pressed to achieve with a twin. Power to weight won't change significantly, but the useability of that power, plus better handling from the new chassis is what the V4 should bring.


My video doesn't purport the V4 to be an inferior performer. I clearly state the opposite to be true with regards to track capability, top end, and riding ease. As for wheel axis speed vs torque, these plots were presented at Valencia and the 1299 punishes the V4 when properly scaled. Notice that the two curves are centralized to reduce the apparent 1299 torque advantage. And the most insidious clue is in the absence of torque units in the vertical axis. The press is too drunk on mimosas to notice.IMG_6849.JPG


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Old Jan 28th 2018, 11:09 PM   #34
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I'll keep the 1299 as my preferred street and mountain road bike, but I'm sure the V4 is a superior track weapon
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Old Jan 29th 2018, 02:01 AM   #35
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Well that’s 17 odd minutes of my life I won’t get back. Aside from all the Star Wars crap it’s purely your assumptions of what the new engine will be. Not the bike, just the engine. No back to back comparison or real world data. Buy a H2R if all you’re interested in is HP.
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Old Feb 1st 2018, 09:18 AM   #36
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Area under the curve matters more than max torque. The V4 has enough torque that the slight bit less it has compared to the 1299 will be far outweighed by the fact that the v4 revs so much higher, giving a LOT more area under the curve.
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Old Feb 1st 2018, 11:09 PM   #37
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Panigale V4 vs 1299 Dyno Results

198.58bhp at the back wheel



Last edited by redfire; Feb 1st 2018 at 11:12 PM.
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Old Feb 2nd 2018, 05:12 AM   #38
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Ya that star wars crap was ridiculous i to felt I wasted 18 good minutes. I could have been watching some canadien superbike championship on my DVR. Speaking of odd and useless video I watched a video 2 nights ago on youtube.
It was titled something like first V4 road test. The dude rode a demo V4s at a UK dealership. Waste of time he didnt really compare the V4s to a 1299s. Just rambling...
I wonder if the engine and exhaust heat will be less of a annoyance with the V4. I hope so.
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Old Feb 2nd 2018, 06:57 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Ponyboy View Post
My video doesn't purport the V4 to be an inferior performer. I clearly state the opposite to be true with regards to track capability, top end, and riding ease. As for wheel axis speed vs torque, these plots were presented at Valencia and the 1299 punishes the V4 when properly scaled. Notice that the two curves are centralized to reduce the apparent 1299 torque advantage. And the most insidious clue is in the absence of torque units in the vertical axis. The press is too drunk on mimosas to notice.
Well, we don't have to depend on those vague press launch graphs anymore, and even using them, we can see that adding a bit of revs to the V4 relative to the V2 puts the HP at a similar or better level. Both bikes are geared for a shade over 190 mph in top gear, with the V4 doing 14K revs to the V2's 10.5K at that speed. The gearing's published for both and a few minutes with gearing commander shows unequivocally the revs at a given speed in any gear, and the V4 is geared to spin more revs throughout the range. Amazing how engineers figure that stuff out...

Twisting the right grip from say, 4K rpm will definitely get you more shove on the 1299 than the V4. Doing same at a given road speed/gear is not so cut and dry. But in any case, I don't think the V4 is about power. The 1299 had more than most mortals could use. It's about ease of use and accessibility.

Heck, even at the GP level all the guys who've come across to Ducati from other brands are remarking on that aspect of the Ducati. And it's not a small thing that Ducati have been pounding the heck out of the basic design of this motor for a long time now; it may be new to the consumer, but it's had a decade plus gestation period. We know that in full MotoGP trim the thing is making closer to 300 than 200hp, so the 214 it's shipping with, at 1100cc's, is a pretty mild tune.

Last edited by Steve B; Feb 2nd 2018 at 06:59 AM.
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Old Feb 3rd 2018, 08:08 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by Steve B View Post
Well, we don't have to depend on those vague press launch graphs anymore, and even using them, we can see that adding a bit of revs to the V4 relative to the V2 puts the HP at a similar or better level. Both bikes are geared for a shade over 190 mph in top gear, with the V4 doing 14K revs to the V2's 10.5K at that speed. The gearing's published for both and a few minutes with gearing commander shows unequivocally the revs at a given speed in any gear, and the V4 is geared to spin more revs throughout the range. Amazing how engineers figure that stuff out...

Twisting the right grip from say, 4K rpm will definitely get you more shove on the 1299 than the V4. Doing same at a given road speed/gear is not so cut and dry. But in any case, I don't think the V4 is about power. The 1299 had more than most mortals could use. It's about ease of use and accessibility.

Heck, even at the GP level all the guys who've come across to Ducati from other brands are remarking on that aspect of the Ducati. And it's not a small thing that Ducati have been pounding the heck out of the basic design of this motor for a long time now; it may be new to the consumer, but it's had a decade plus gestation period. We know that in full MotoGP trim the thing is making closer to 300 than 200hp, so the 214 it's shipping with, at 1100cc's, is a pretty mild tune.


As engineers we don't depend on gear commander to do 7th grade reduction calculations. You're talking in circles to arrive at my video's conclusions: V4 easier to ride fast on track, bigger top end. 1299 Better street and canyon bike and doesn't sound like a weed wacker over 7K. Until we ride it, we're all talking out our ass.


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