Please God let someone, somewhere else on the planet do a comprehensive group test!

akalapovic said:

I wonder how would the base model fair considering the S isnt doing too wlel lol

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Yeah it be funny the STD Pani rates better in the match ups and handles better/ quicker track times when the testers do manual set up of suspention...not knocking the S at all, love em just the same

Xbox said:

Progressive is supposed to be for two-up riding.

My bike came in Flat mode, but even thought I don't find it overly hard, please let us know how you find Progressive.

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I personally believe that something is slightly lost in the translation for this section.

I've done 240 miles on the bike now.

I've adjusted the suspension settings no end to get a balanced feel on all road surfaces(before moving mount)

I did the flat to progressive change over today and the difference is like night and day!

The shock actually feels like it's damping rather than throwing me out of the seat!

I use a 35/40 mile route after my adjustments, fast and bumpy, twisty, long fast smooth curves too.

In my own opinion, the progressive setting is far superior for normal road surfaces.

I'll report back with more findings when I've done more analysis.


.See ya'll..!...

Beanflicker said:

I did the flat to progressive change over today and the difference is like night and day!
The shock actually feels like it's damping rather than throwing me out of the seat!
I use a 35/40 mile route after my adjustments, fast and bumpy, twisty, long fast smooth curves too.
In my own opinion, the progressive setting is far superior for normal road surfaces.
I'll report back with more findings when I've done more analysis.

.See ya'll..!...

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Great to hear your perspective on this, keep it coming! That way by the time I get my bike, I'll spend less time setting it up.

Just finished reading the article by Fastbikes, it was an interesting read and definitely talked about points that had not been addressed yet. As I was reading it I couldn't help but think how it was so juxtaposed from the other reviews that are already out there. For example: majority of other reviewers stated that the EBC was a fantastic feature while this author stated that he did not like it at all.


Everyone has a different perspective and is going to interpret the bike differently, but it seems to me that the Panigale has created a greater divergence of opinions compared to that of other manufactures and their associated reviews.

Performance bike magazine in uk pits the Pani vs BMW s1000rr

BMW beats the duke on most performance metrics but the Pani is the one they would buy if you take price out of the equation

Beanflicker said:

Look closely at the photo of the Pans shock mount position in the Fast Bikes article.

That mount is in the "track only" position, or flat, as it says in the handbook.

If they've been riding it like that on the road it'll feel rock solid compared to the "Progressive" setting.

It'll make it twitchy and as hard as hell unless on a super smooth bit of tarmac.

Check the manual, page 184, and look closely at the pics.

I spoke with Austin Racing today and I'm sure they're going to post up about this sometime later.

As I understand it, AR are trying to get info from Ducati direct.

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I wonder how the other mags had their 1199's linkage set. Perhaps the bike would have done better with the linkage set in the progressive mode?

From everything that I've read and heard Ducati had always said that the progressive is for street riding (inc pillion) and flat for track. They haven't deviated on this.

There is a comparative group test with the BMW and Aprilia done by Moto Journal, French magazine.

Bikes ridden on circuits and roads (slow and fast ones).

The result was they were all in love with the Panigale (rated first), the Aprilia and BMW begin second and third. The BMW was especially bashed because it was the less precise of three on road, and also too big.

I jumped on a BMW, and I thought I was on my Diavel. I have yet to confirm chassis issues, but many people thought the same.

CHarles foxtrot said:

I wonder how the other mags had their 1199's linkage set. Perhaps the bike would have done better with the linkage set in the progressive mode?

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Exactly, let's have a full group test with the correct suspension setting?!

And let's not forget that all riders weigh in differently and will have an effect on each bike they jump onto, so depending how each manufacture has their default setting set to, out of the factory, surely this could have an adverse effect on rider feel on bumpy twisty roads?! Which in turn could result in time and figure differences?! I'm open to suggestions and different views here?! If it would make any difference to the individual reviews etc..

So are we saying Ducati have messed up here or not, with regards to the default suspension setting out of the factory?!

mat1529 said:

Exactly, let's have a full group test with the correct suspension setting?!

And let's not forget that all riders weigh in differently and will have an effect on each bike they jump onto, so depending how each manufacture has their default setting set to, out of the factory, surely this could have an adverse effect on rider feel on bumpy twisty roads?! Which in turn could result in time and figure differences?! I'm open to suggestions and different views here?! If it would make any difference to the individual reviews etc..

So are we saying Ducati have messed up here or not, with regards to the default suspension setting out of the factory?!

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I think Sportrider's tests usually involve searching for better than stock suspension settings. Maybe RRW too.

Ultimately, I don't really care about the outcome of the tests, because on any given trackday there will be an expert level SV650 racer that will be seconds a lap faster than me on an 1199.

Does anyone doubt that the 1199 will be a complete thrill to ride? On or off the track?

As per the above post, there is always someone faster........ Always will be.

But who cares..?

Panigale's look "Fit"..........

Bummers look "Fat"..........

To some it's just a spelling mistake, to others it the end of the world..!...

...

cheeseyduc said:

fastbike has just done one against the ktm and aprilla

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Link please?? Thanks!

Spilly1199 said:

Link please?? Thanks!

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Look on first page of this thread

ttkarp said:

I'm really surprised it's not quicker (0-60) and in the quarter mile given the power/weight ratio. Hard to launch perhaps?

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I agree, I have a Harley fatboy with a moderately hotted up engine plus a quick shifter and a PCv which i recently discovered has a 'launch control' function. Launch control is for consistent fast starts, and allows me to hold in the clutch, full throttle, get the revs bouncing of the pcv artificial rev limiter (set to 3,200rpm on mine) and drop the clutch - the off you go without bogging or wheel spin (not much anyway!)

That bike weighs 325kg dry, without my 110kg, has 110hp at rear wheel and 105ftib TQ at 4,000rpm (90ftlb at 3,000rpm, rev limiter at 6,300), and the best I've ever managed is 0-60 is 3.47. (time using the built in Dakota digital dash timer)

I know launch control is cheating a little but a good (brave) rider (not me) could achieve the same. So I'm a bit surprised that they couldn't get the 0-60 lower given the power to weight ratio. Also worth mentioning the hog is pretty near impossible to wheelie.

But I also dont give a .... and I'm hanging out for my S.


http://www.flickr.com/photos/bertozzi/5309668819/ by cbertozz, on Flickr

CHarles foxtrot said:

I think Sportrider's tests usually involve searching for better than stock suspension settings. Maybe RRW too.

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You'd think... but in reality, I would be very surprised if they did nothing more than take what they're given and run it thru it's paces. Unless it was a long term review, like for 6-12 months.

Their logic would be..

"This is what the public gets when they buy one, so this is how we'll be testing it."

Unlike us peeps, who spend our hard earned $$$ on these toys with the intent of keeping it for a while. The rags get handed so many of these things that the excitement of a new model wears off in the first half hour.

littlejohn said:

You'd think... but in reality, I would be very surprised if they did nothing more than take what they're given and run it thru it's paces. Unless it was a long term review, like for 6-12 months.

Their logic would be..

"This is what the public gets when they buy one, so this is how we'll be testing it."

Unlike us peeps, who spend our hard earned $$$ on these toys with the intent of keeping it for a while. The rags get handed so many of these things that the excitement of a new model wears off in the first half hour.

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In each of their shootouts, they give suggesteds suspension settings for each bike.

My dealer just received their second bike. They had just PDI'd it and the shock was set to "F" as it came from the factory. I guarantee you that the majority of thes testers do not know how to adjust these settings. Or that the bike even has them. They probably just selected sport for the street and race for the track. Meanwhile, the rear shock linkage is still set to linear track specs no matter what the conditions!

srleadjb said:

My dealer just received their second bike. They had just PDI'd it and the shock was set to "F" as it came from the factory. I guarantee you that the majority of thes testers do not know how to adjust these settings. Or that the bike even has them. They probably just selected sport for the street and race for the track. Meanwhile, the rear shock linkage is still set to linear track specs no matter what the conditions!

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exactly ! and as Rich22 suggests on another thread "F" is way too harsh...unless you have perfectly flat smooth road all around the track.

He suggests set linkage to Progressive and then adjust suspention accorgingly...If you think about it, our dealers and service techs dont even know these little tricks...It's gonna take trial and error guy, learn all you can from these forums

ttkarp said:

In each of their shootouts, they give suggesteds suspension settings for each bike.

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Some do... but I can read a manual too.
I wouldn't count on them actually spending too much time working out optimal suspension set ups.

If they started doing that, they would need race teams specific to each bike to get the optimal set up before they did any comparison review.
Otherwise the reviews would really be useless.

Eg.
A reviewer may have owned a S1000RR for more than a year, and knows every trick in the book to get every last tenth out it. He is now given a 1199 to do a comparison review.
How on earth is he going to figure out the optimal set up in the time he has the bike. (which will most likely be no more than a week or two).
Any comparo he does will be heavily biased towards the S1000RR because it will set up with his preference.

Given all that has happened at Ducati over the past year, it wouldn't surprise me if the factory shipped 1199s with fairly average set ups, thinking that most buyers will end up doing custom set ups anyway.

IMO. Unlike buying an car, where the driver's weight is only a very minor percentage of the total kerb weight. When buying any bike, where the rider's weight can be almost 40% of the kerb weight, it's extremely important to have the suspension set up to each rider.
At the very least, sag, spring rate, basic compression and rebound damping. If you really want to go all out, then have your shocks re-valved. This is not specific to track use either. Having properly set up suspension will also make a world of difference on the road as well.

Wouldnt they just ride it in the default settings for the suspension? The computer controlled suspension has these programmed. It would be nice if the factory default settings worked for the most part. Also the progressive linkage would make the spring feel softer than the Linear setting but in either case the reviewer should still have the sag and or spring rate changed for the correct rider weight...sounds like a very hard rear spring...Who knows though. These settings and feelings are so subjective.

When I bought my 999 it was set for the previous owner by the "tuner guy"...I lasted about a day on it. The first set of train tracks I hit I nearly crashed. Now I can hit tracks one handed and not even flinch.

Kinda dont think the 1199 is going to be the king of the hill once the tests start however...grumblings already arent good.