V2 Stalling/Turning Off

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I just got off the phone with the dealer, who has had my V2 for a few days now. It was also due for its first oil change, so they did that. However, they ran a couple of tests and found an issue, which I wasn’t 100% following, but I thought I would share to the extent it is helpful.

It seems that one of the valves combined with the timing of the secondary system may be having an issue. So, they are going to look at it closer and possibly clean that area (I assume you have to dismantle the engine for that). The possible issues could be fuel/air flow/combination combined with a timing issue, but it is unclear to me with everything that was mentioned what the exact issue is, per se.

Either way, I was just sharing in case anyone else had experienced this with a V2 or other Panigales. Thanks again.
 
MaverickiB said:
That's exactly my point. In normal operation, it pulls fumes from inside the canister (hence it being called a purge valve) on startup. If your canister is flooded, as many often are when people are experiencing issues, it will pull gas through the purge valve instead of just fumes. This can cause the fuel mixture to be too rich on startup, and is sometimes why bikes with flooded canisters struggle to start.

Basically, if the bike is brand new and the canister is fine, then yeah, no need to plug the purge valve line. But the EVAP system is causing starting or running issues, it's at the point where you should plug the purge valve line and completely isolate the canister from everything else (removing it, ideally).

Smart-moto make a purge valve eliminator plug if you would like to remove the valve and terminate the hose sooner.
Click to expand...

I think you missed my point. It doesn’t get flooded from overfilling since the overflow line is routed outside of the bike. I think this is a carry over idea from previous models.

When I took a V4 tank off and tilted it a little too far forward I noticed the fuel only came out of the overflow tube, not the vent.

The issue with the surging and the hard starts is that the fumes from the tank are greater than the EVAP system can deal with. Simply opening the gas cap to vent it will solve the problem right up until the fumes build up again.

When my bike had the EVAP problem there wasn’t liquid gas in the canister; it was just getting vapor locked.

The Akra exhaust comes with a Y fitting and brackets for routing the wires which are retained by the canister’s bracket. If I ever go that route I’ll remove the canister but I would advise a rider who just bought the bike to go through all that.

Plumb the vent line right into the overflow with a Y fitting and button it back up.
 
I suspect the liquid gasoline @0260n25 observed dripping from his vent line is heated gas vapor which cooled in the line and condensed back to a liquid. I never observed this with any of my bikes which could be an altitude, temperature or even the specific gas being used.
 
Mine definitely had fuel in it that spilled out during removal. While the overflow line exists for a reason, fuel will also make it's way to the canister when overfilled.
 
bp_SFV4 said:
Right. The fuel in it came from vapor condensing back to liquid.

Not overfilling.
Click to expand...

I strongly doubt that much fuel could be recondensed into the canister with less than 600 miles on the bike, as it was in my case. I did accidentally overfill it at one point and it suddenly started having issues starting. Pure coincidence I guess?
 
I strongly doubt your doubt?! Maybe you were one of those kids that never distilled salt water to create drinking water.

They way my V4S boiled gas after riding was really surprising. 15 min after a ride it was still bubbling and generating vapor, all will condense back to liquid. With the super wide boiling temp of gasoline its easy to see why same is problematic for Ducati's EVAP canister design.
 
My V2 had stalled so may times that I got rid of it.
The LAST time it stalled was the last straw.
I was coasting into a corner, just as I was hitting the apex, POOF. Stalled.

I'm not risking my skin with a bike that makes something inherently dangerous far more so.

There's a CBR 1000 RR-SP in my garage now.
 
I am not sure if vapor condensing into liquid was the issue with my canister or currently with my drain line, but I will say that I never overfilled my tank. I have filled it up pretty high, which I thought was the issue. I started filling it up less, but gas continues to slightly appear at the drain nipple in the lower faring. I am okay with this, although I may put in a catch can. I suspect that the combination of a pretty full tank that gets sloshed around with hard riding, braking, and light wheelies, and the evaporation due to boiled gas from a hot engine and frame (and tank sometimes in the sunlight) are causing the issue. It is called an "evap canister", after all. ;)

One thing I am sure about is that I don't have starting or stalling issue since the canister was removed. :)

-0260
 
ducatiKat said:
My V2 had stalled so may times that I got rid of it.
The LAST time it stalled was the last straw.
I was coasting into a corner, just as I was hitting the apex, POOF. Stalled.

I'm not risking my skin with a bike that makes something inherently dangerous far more so.

There's a CBR 1000 RR-SP in my garage now.
Click to expand...

Hondas are solid. Did you ever remove the charcoal canister on the V2? What year was it and how long did you have it?
 
MikeyDucati said:
Hondas are solid. Did you ever remove the charcoal canister on the V2? What year was it and how long did you have it?
Click to expand...

It was a 2020, I had it for 16,400 KM of ownership. I’m sure they didn’t delete the canister. The dealer tried to deal with the stalling issues. I believe they updated the software a few times.

FWIW my 2019 Supersport S stalled too.

Also liking the RR-SP more.
 
Update on bike

Picked it up from the dealer after close to two weeks. They worked closely with Ducati and found an error with the AIS system (no idea what this is other than fuel/air mixture?). They tested the bike and found fuel in the charcoal canister and elected to remove it.

Hoping, like many of you have suggested, that the issue stops. Though, to those with a technical background, is there a relationship between the AIS system and the charcoal canister? If you remove the latter does it fix the errors? Thanks.
 
Different acronym but its the secondary air injection system, less the secondary part. It works to inject fresh air into the exhaust gas before the cats to burn any fuel still present. When you remove the cats it can lead to a lot of pops, backfires and flames shooting from the exhaust. It can also mess with the readings of air-fuel probes in the exhaust used by those tuning the bike on a dyno.
 
bp_SFV4 said:
Different acronym but its the secondary air injection system, less the secondary part. It works to inject fresh air into the exhaust gas before the cats to burn any fuel still present. When you remove the cats it can lead to a lot of pops, backfires and flames shooting from the exhaust. It can also mess with the readings of air-fuel probes in the exhaust used by those tuning the bike on a dyno.
Click to expand...

Any relationship to the charcoal canister? Just trying to understand the error and how it was fixed.
 
DCPanni said:
No. Separate system. But if the AIS is messed up the A/F ratio as read by the O2 sensor will be off.
Click to expand...

Yeah, the dealer paperwork says that AIS test found percent too low on horizontal cylinder. They cleaned the reeds. Upon inspection of charcoal canister they found fuel. They cleaned and fully sealed AIS and performed heat cycles to find bike performing good.

Hence that’s why I thought there was a relationship between both.
 
MikeyDucati said:
Update on bike

Picked it up from the dealer after close to two weeks. They worked closely with Ducati and found an error with the AIS system (no idea what this is other than fuel/air mixture?). They tested the bike and found fuel in the charcoal canister and elected to remove it.

Hoping, like many of you have suggested, that the issue stops. Though, to those with a technical background, is there a relationship between the AIS system and the charcoal canister? If you remove the latter does it fix the errors? Thanks.
Click to expand...
If you have any trouble with your dealer, you’ve got proof of them violating federal emissions laws
 

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