Cornering ABS upgrade for existing 1199 owners?

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Ajaypappu

Joined
Aug 29, 2014
Messages
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Location
Austin, TX
Hey guys,

I was wondering if the existing owners will get the upgrade option for the cornering ABS of the 1299. Any possibility or will it not happen because it requires installing the lean angle sensors? :(


Cheers! :cool:
 
I do hope to see this offered. The 1299 features enough enhancements in other areas that doing so would likely not pose any considerable threat of cutting into new bike sales. I believe BMW and KTM are currently offering cornering ABS retrofit options for select models.
 
I think a retro kit would be unlikely, since Ducati clearly want to differentiate and distance 1199 and 1299 in the minds of buyers.

They are simply in the business of selling new units.

BMW situation - mindset, even logistical/dealer setup is completely different.
 
Wiring harness /Ecu/software compatibility issues to add-on sensing module.
Testing cost/effort for former model.
More revenue selling bikes than such add-on accessories.
 
Titaniumvalves said:
Wiring harness /Ecu/software compatibility issues to add-on sensing module.
Testing cost/effort for former model.
More revenue selling bikes than such add-on accessories.
Click to expand...

I imagine Bosch has already performed the majority of the testing and development grunt work for the 1199. I don't see it as a stretch that a retrofit option will become available at some point, whether through Ducati or directly from Bosch.
 
Highly unlikely. It's simply not in Ducati's interest to offer a retro kit. There's also the question of liability and warranty should such a kit be fitted to a bike/platform on which it was not destined or designed to be used. There is also the question of cost and whether it's actually financially viable as I would imagine the different ABS unit would need the IMU to work, as well as a different wiring loom, BBS and instrumentation to support the new functions such as the lean angle sensor. Add all that hardware up in terms of cost and labour and it would almost certainly be prohibitively expensive to consider, even if it were possible. As nice as a retro-fit would be, Ducati are not likely to dilute the appeal of a new model by watering down any perceived or real advantages they have over the outgoing 1199s and thereby reducing the margins of technology between the 1199 and the 1299 series.
 
I would say there's approximately a 0% chance that there will be an ABS "Upgrade" kit offered from prior models. Topolino hit the major points right on.
 
BMW is offering their retro-fit cornering ABS for under $500, which is certainly not anywhere near being cost prohibitive.

I'm sure the first order of business was for Bosch to have their system ready for the 1299 by the time of its unveiling; but considering the vast similarities between the two models, it's likely only a matter of time until they release a unit for the 1199. At the end of the day it comes down to profit potential, and both Bosch and Ducati are aware of the immense market awaiting a retro-fit option.
 
I like your optimism Duck41, but as I said, there are more issues than simply if it's possible or not. Possible yes, probable no. Cost effective? Well that's open to debate but by the time you have gone to all that trouble you'll still be short of many of the other new features the new models offer. If these are a selling point for you then you would be far better placed to trade your existing bike I for a new model, bearing in mind that there will always be an improvement further down the road on whatever is currently available. That's the nature of the industry.
 
As an aside, BMW may well have designed their system to mitigate marginalising current owners by enabling an aftermarket kit that would ensure their continued loyalty to the brand and thereby securing future potential sales. Given this, you would be forgiven for thinking why Ducati would not follow suit, but I'm not convinced they actually need to when you consider how many people seem ready to trade in their bikes at the mere notion they are somehow disadvantaged if they don't have the very latest toys to play with. In all probability the successor to the 1299 is already on the drawing board and that rate of progress is not likely to change.
 
topolino said:
I like your optimism Duck41, but as I said, there are more issues than simply if it's possible or not. Possible yes, probable no. Cost effective? Well that's open to debate but by the time you have gone to all that trouble you'll still be short of many of the other new features the new models offer. If these are a selling point for you then you would be far better placed to trade your existing bike I for a new model, bearing in mind that there will always be an improvement further down the road on whatever is currently available. That's the nature of the industry.
Click to expand...

Living on a prayer.

The feature is great, and it would certainly be a nice gesture on Ducati's part to consider making this available as a retro-fit, but I agree it may be very low on their priority list; that is, if it is even listed at this point.
 
Todays technology is amazing for bikes like traction control, electronics suspensions, Engine Braking control, RBW, etc but cornering ABS im not sure?. Can someone explain to me why cornering ABS is needed? Who would even lock up their brakes while leaned over in a corner? let alone touch their brakes. Will this prevent bikes from backing in on the track? Maybe I'm old school but chances are if you need to brake that hard in a corner one of two thing is going to happen

A. your going down due to the lack of traction
B. If you are going around a blind corner chances are you wont stop in time and you either hit the object or A is going to happen.

Maybe I'm wrong could someone enlighten me.
 
ScrapperX said:
Todays technology is amazing for bikes like traction control, electronics suspensions, Engine Braking control, RBW, etc but cornering ABS im not sure?. Can someone explain to me why cornering ABS is needed? Who would even lock up their brakes while leaned over in a corner? let alone touch their brakes. Will this prevent bikes from backing in on the track? Maybe I'm old school but chances are if you need to brake that hard in a corner one of two thing is going to happen

A. your going down due to the lack of traction
B. If you are going around a blind corner chances are you wont stop in time and you either hit the object or A is going to happen.

Maybe I'm wrong could someone enlighten me.
Click to expand...

Happens ALL THE TIME! Get into a turn too hot on the street or track, panic mid-turn and grab a handful of brake, and BAM you're on the ground. I'd venture the guess it's the leading cause of lowside crashes.
 
jarelj said:
Happens ALL THE TIME! Get into a turn too hot on the street or track, panic mid-turn and grab a handful of brake, and BAM you're on the ground. I'd venture the guess it's the leading cause of lowside crashes.
Click to expand...

Agreed...and if you are trail braking and then require even more stopping force knowing you have Abs that will actually work in this scenario would be awesome...

Now I just need to learn how to ride this bike properly...
 
I don't know about the Bosch system on the 1299 and R, however I was reading that the BMW only enables this option in wet and sport modes - it is disabled on race and slick modes.

BMW Motorrad UK

"The influence exerted by ABS control will depend on the riding mode configured. ABS Pro is available to its full extent in the modes "Rain" and "Sport". During the pre-ride check, the display "ABS Pro" in the instrument panel in conjunction with the modes "Rain" and "Sport" indicates to the rider that the ABS Pro function is available. By contrast, the "Race" and "Slick" modes for very sporty, experienced riders do not support the ABS Pro function since it is deliberately designed to be used on roads."
 
jarelj said:
Happens ALL THE TIME! Get into a turn too hot on the street or track, panic mid-turn and grab a handful of brake, and BAM you're on the ground. I'd venture the guess it's the leading cause of lowside crashes.
Click to expand...

ah,

I just read more on the cornering ABS. " It will not only prevent locking up the wheels (Max pressure) but it will also determine how smoothly the ABS system intervenes in the braking process, to enable the best possible stopping power under the circumstances. "The system pulls in data from the front and rear wheel speed sensors, brake pressure sensors, and the roll, yaw and transverse acceleration sensors from the bike's traction control system to get a very accurate picture of how fast the bike is turning, and how far it's leaned over". Incredible stuff. A whole new way of riding. Just hope those algorithms and look up tables are correct:D
 
Duck41 said:
I imagine Bosch has already performed the majority of the testing and development grunt work for the 1199. I don't see it as a stretch that a retrofit option will become available at some point, whether through Ducati or directly from Bosch.
Click to expand...

Corner ABS is a dynamic system best to be tested in situ.Would you validate the electronics ,on a different bike, which is meant for the intended production bike since moreover,the 1299 has different weight,rake & swing-arm.

The HW ECU could be the same for different bike/car model, but software and testing has to be vehicle specific, to protect the company, itself.

of course bosch could sell, but how many 1199 has been sold till date, how many owners will buy, who will train the distribution on installation/troubleshoot..

it has to be profitable by market study before efforts/$$/resource are spend in testing product & training distribution
 
Last edited:
I've had cornering abs via my right hand on my 1199's since December 2012 :D.

I remember at the 1199's initial release everyone wanted to know if ABS could be added to non base models. Everyone including me was a naysayer. Now that bikes have been crashed/stripped/stolen you can find all the parts you need to retrofit for next to nothing- harness, full bbs unit, abs pump, abs lines etc.

Give it time and I'd venture to say you'll be able to plug and play the necessary sensors/wires into a 12-14 1199. Maybe I'm being too optimistic, but way too many people put these bikes on some pedestal thinking everything is impossible to do on them. I used to be one of them. No longer.

Just an assumption, no facts about 1299-1199 cross-fit possibilities
 

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