Differences between 1299 and 1299S

Street or track I've always found the Ohlins suspension to give a smoother more refined feel. Lighter wheels equate to lighter steering. I feel the difference and appreciate it.

Make the best deal that you can at the time of purchase, enjoy the hell of out it and remember the "must haves" and "could live withouts" for the next purchase.


Getting at it from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I bought the base on looks alone, I love the front forks, they are larger in diameter as well. And the fork tops have beautiful adjusters and no wires sticking out. I also prefer the wheel design....

ultra300x said:

As Chris said just get the Base for the street, unless you're doing some serious mountain road carving the difference will not be all that significant, and you can always upgrade the shock for $500 and revalve the fork later - not a big deal. Brakes/engine are identical

Where I disagree with Chris a little is I actually think the 1299 is an awesome street bike - light, quick steering, gobs of power everywhere - much more practical and fun than the "screamers" in my opinion

I like the look of the Base forks as well

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With my comments (about street), I was comparing the Panigale to bikes like the Monster, Multistrada, etc. When compared to bikes actually meant for the street, it sucks.

But when comparing sportbikes on the street, it isnt bad at all. I agree, I hate screaming ... motors on the street. I'll never own a 600cc I-4 for the street. I don't want to have to deal with no torque and the screaming ... motor all the time.

I prefer a Liter bike on the street with loads of torque, you can put it in 3rd gear and just ride.

Thamer said:

My argument would be the Base even if and especially if you race. You can get much better kit for the bike with the difference. Secondly, I don't think electronic suspension is legal in sports competition yet, so you may have to get it switched out anyway. For the occasional track day the S is a good choice.

In the end I'd get a 959. No SS swing arm, but a truely great choice

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The problem is that you can't change the wheels (or forks) and remain SS legal. That is why I went with the S for racing. If you get a base, then change the wheels, it renders the bike illegal for Superstock racing.

Yes - electronic suspension is legal as long as it came on the bike from the factory. You can't add it to a bike that didn't come with it, but you can use it if it is OEM.

What's your current thoughts on the electronic suspension for serious track use?

ultra300x said:

What's your current thoughts on the electronic suspension for serious track use?

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Personally, I have only tried it twice...but I actually liked it.

I know guys didn't like it on "older" bikes that had it, like the BMW...because the sample rates and processor were too slow. It was fine on the street, but it couldn't make changes quick enough to adapt on the track.

But with the new IMU based software, it is more predictive rather than reactive. It doesn't necessarily respond to the forks extending/stroking in, it response to the circumstances that will lead to the forks extending/stroking in.

The previous systems would react to what is happening with the suspension. But this new system takes into account throttle position, brake pressure, lean/pitch/roll, etc...which means it can gather that data and interpret what is about to happen, and make changes accordingly.

The thing is, you need a good base setup. Setup is always a compromise. You get the bike setup well for as much of the track as you can, then just deal with the remainder as best you can. It is impossible to get the bike working perfectly for every corner. That is where the EC suspension comes in. In theory, it eliminates the compromise.

But, you need to get the bike working good first. If the bike has poor geometry and spring rates, activating the Dynamic Suspension will just ensure the bike maintains that same ...... handling over the course of the whole lap. Haha. So the trick is to put it in Fixed and get the bike working well, THEN bring in the Dynamic once you are happy with the setup.

ultra300x said:

What's your current thoughts on the electronic suspension for serious track use?

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I thought I was going to HATE it and so had Dave Moss set up the bike in "manual" mode... Ran a few sessions like that and then got curious.. The 1299S suspension in dynamic mode at the track is freaking amazing! I rode my buddy's 1199R in dynamic mode (2013) and that was NOT GOOD!!

Ducati got it right with their new setup in dynamic mode on the 1299S.

Same here. I switched to fixed and had Robert from On-Road Off-road Cycles set up the suspension for me. He's well known in TX and probably sets up half of the CMRA bikes.

Went out for a session, came back, put it back to Dynamic. Set up on fixed was still good, but not great.

Well I disagree on the stock suspension for the base is not as good as the Ohlins IMO.

And LED headlights are very nice too.

Chaotic said:

The previous systems would react to what is happening with the suspension. But this new system takes into account throttle position, brake pressure, lean/pitch/roll, etc...which means it can gather that data and interpret what is about to happen, and make changes accordingly.

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The R model doesn't have it of course, do you expect this is the future of racing? As far as I know it's not used in WSBK or MotoGP, at least in the same way

JHTmcrider said:

Well I disagree on the stock suspension for the base is not as good as the Ohlins IMO.

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"Good" depends on the purpose/application.

ultra300x said:

The R model doesn't have it of course, do you expect this is the future of racing? As far as I know it's not used in WSBK or MotoGP, at least in the same way

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Nope, I seriously doubt it...unless there magically becomes a huge influx of money into the sport and motorcycles in general.

The trend over the past 5 years or so is to reduce costs. That is the reason for all of the restrictions. Even in Superbike and in some cases MotoGP, they have incorporated things like spec ECU's, engine mod limitations, caps on suspension costs, etc. They have eliminated GPS based traction control and things of that nature.

If EC Suspension had been this advanced 15 years ago, then it might have made its way into racing. But with the way things are now, I doubt we will ever see it. They are trying to make things cheaper and less complicated.

Nev3rL8 said:

Anyhow, what are the aux feature buttons for in the S model? I think I even saw a thread in a classified section that someone was selling.

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As no-one appears to have answered this question, the "aux" buttons is a reference (I assume) to the UP or DOWN buttons on the left bar control block. These are used to immediately change the triggering threshold of the currently associated function: traction control (DTC), wheelie control (DWC), engine brake control (EBC) (Only one function is associated at any one time via the settings menu). The associated function setting can be changed at any time while riding regardless of the throttle position, e.g. increasing or decreasing the traction control setting to suit the road/track condition.

The Aprilia RSV4/Tuono has similar buttons for adjusting ATC (=DTC).

Hope that helps - something else to add to the complexity (or not)


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Kent

Thank you Kent. I think I can live without that feature s well. Changing functions through the screen shouldn't be an issue.

Do you guys know if the ECU (or whatever the proper term is for onboard computer) programming has any differences / limitations between the base and the S model?
I only ask because on my streetfighter there is a difference. I found out later that some things cannot be programmed on base model. For example, I cannot install quick shifter on my base model but there are kits for S model because of programming issue.

Sky said:

Do you guys know if the ECU (or whatever the proper term is for onboard computer) programming has any differences / limitations between the base and the S model?
I only ask because on my streetfighter there is a difference. I found out later that some things cannot be programmed on base model. For example, I cannot install quick shifter on my base model but there are kits for S model because of programming issue.

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According to the spare parts manuals for each, the Engine Control Units have the same part numbers (to be expected?) however the Instrument Panels do have different part numbers (to enable the extra settings related to the semi-active suspension, etc., I'd think). More than that, I cannot say...


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Kent

80shilling said:

I rode my buddy's 1199R in dynamic mode (2013) and that was NOT GOOD!!

Ducati got it right with their new setup in dynamic mode on the 1299S.

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There was no dynamic mode on the first gen Panigales or any stock R...

The suspension is only electronically adjustable not semi-active.

BTrain5489 said:

There was no dynamic mode on the first gen Panigales or any stock R...

The suspension is only electronically adjustable not semi-active.

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Yes, you are correct, I remembered that after you posted. It was pretty horrible to be quite honest, he actually sold his R and went back to an 899 as his track bike, he put full Ohlins on the 899.

Chaotic said:

The lighter wheels and Ohlins stuff is unnecessary on the street.

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Yes, you don't need the lighter wheels on the street. The Ohlins... hmm, you don't need Ohlins as brand but the electronically controlled suspension is a highlight. The electronic control offers the possibility to switch very fast to a real comfortable setting (softest-softest) or a very sporty setting and allows it to ride a very soft setting without a deep diving fork during braking. Perhaps overkill but for me a reason why I can ride 500km on the Pani without any issues with my back or some other sensitive body parts...