Dyno Results from 1199s

Ray916MN said:

W/Termi silencers and map.

178.9 hp,
89.4 ft. lbs

64.2F, 33.8% humidity.

Had a problem on the run, so the preceding reflects a peak average. Actual peak readings were 183.2 hp, 91.9 ft. lbs. Reading was done on the dyno at Lofgren Performance.

For reference an 1198S with Akra 2 into 1 into 2 produced 159.4 hp, 90.5 ft. lbs peak at 69.3F 35.2% humidity on the same dyno.

Bike will go back to the shop next week after it is completely broken in, to see if the fuel mapping can be improved. Lofgren has the ability to remap the Mitisubishi ECU for the Multistrada, and is going to work out remapping the Panigale Mitsubishi ECU. Should be able to get a more precise map without using a PCV.

Where was your bike dynoed?

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Was this with slip-ons or full system? Also in order to get proper numbers you would need the air increase that the factory gets on their million dollar dynoes. When your bike gets up to 100+ mph speed it needs that fast, strong wind of 100 mph to increase compression. But instead the bike is confused and ....... the fuel consumption because all its getting air from is a shop fan and some blowers, which help, but still arent to par with the expensive dynoes the factory uses. I guarantee the 1199 puts out every bit of the 195 hp it claims out on the road. If they can create it on their computers, it can do it out on the street or the track.

While putting a bike on a dyno will give you a useful benchmark, I'm always surprised by the horsepower arms race and that so many see dyno results as the definitive way to compare bikes. On the road or track so many other factors come into play that can't be simulated at the dyno:

1. Rider weight
2. Fuel load
3. Intake air pressure and airflow
4. Aerodynamics and drag
5. Air temperature and altitude
6. Road surface and rolling resistance
7. Cornering ability

I find the the size of my smile when I get off a bike is a much more reliable indicator

When is this HP war ever going to end? I can see it now 2015, I can't believe my bike only has 350 HP. Dude that sux! They claimed 380! Freaken POS!

This bike is a BEAST !

PaddockStand said:

While putting a bike on a dyno will give you a useful benchmark, I'm always surprised by the horsepower arms race and that so many see dyno results as the definitive way to compare bikes. On the road or track so many other factors come into play that can't be simulated at the dyno:

1. Rider weight
2. Fuel load
3. Intake air pressure and airflow
4. Aerodynamics and drag
5. Air temperature and altitude
6. Road surface and rolling resistance
7. Cornering ability

I find the the size of my smile when I get off a bike is a much more reliable indicator

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I agree. But Ive been trying to get my question answered. Are the slip-ons putting out power or arent they? I know what the past exhausts did, but I would like to know more specifically what it does for the 1199. The dealer tells me it gets a little better midrange, lighter weight, and louder sound with no gain in peak power.

I have seen a youtube video of a tricolore with slip-ons (at least they claimed they were in the description along with the 186 Hp that it made) But didn't show proof of the power by showing a sheet or the computer readout or anything? I would assume that the person isn't lying, but then again there are some shady people out there. I would like to get slip-ons if this is true, but I don't want to waste almost $2,000 for some sound. Get what I mean?

I'd like to compare and contrast the results from both exhausts. Not power hungry, but would like to go with a new exhaust if it's worth it. I never had the chance to put one on my 848, because I was going to be getting a new bike this year anyways and it would have been a waste of money. The power race will never end, I too believe in the thrill of riding a Duc is like almost no other bike. And that's why I live by them.

I put my Tri with full system on the dyno at a friendly shootout today. 177hp/93tq.

Only has 80 miles on it since the dyno break in. Yes, the system puts out power, but it's not top end bragging power. I have 10+hp gains from 4-7k rpm. worth it.

What kind of other bikes were in the shootout, and how'd they do for reference?

jjmontesanto said:

What kind of other bikes were in the shootout, and how'd they do for reference?

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A 2012 ZX14 with a Brocks exhaust and flies removed did 203. /shrug

elitesoldier357 said:

Was this with slip-ons or full system? Also in order to get proper numbers you would need the air increase that the factory gets on their million dollar dynoes. When your bike gets up to 100+ mph speed it needs that fast, strong wind of 100 mph to increase compression. But instead the bike is confused and ....... the fuel consumption because all its getting air from is a shop fan and some blowers, which help, but still arent to par with the expensive dynoes the factory uses. I guarantee the 1199 puts out every bit of the 195 hp it claims out on the road. If they can create it on their computers, it can do it out on the street or the track.

Click to expand...

Termi silencers only, with the fuel map that comes with the silencers.

Dyno are tuning tools. They are designed to show relative performance so that when you change tuning you can see the change it makes in performance. They are not designed to show absolute performance differences.

In general, each dyno reads differently. Some of this is due to production and set up variations in the dynos themselves, some is due to differences between the approaches different dyno makers take to measuring power, some of this is due to differences in atmospheric conditions and of course production variances in bikes themselves mean even bikes of the same model and from the same maker will not produce the exact same horsepower and torque on the same dyno on the same day.

The clearest way to understand the differences in power production between bikes is to measure them back to back on the same dyno. Failing that, it is pretty simple to get a relative good idea of differences between the power output of two bikes by asking the tuner running the dyno how your bike compares to another model of bike. Most dynos can store the run data and most tuners store the run data from the bikes they run, so many times you can get a side by side comparison of your bike versus another maker's bike from your tuner. When my last run was done I got a comparison of my bike to an 1198S.

Again, this doesn't mean that much, as you are comparing a single sample of one bike with another and production variances mean that you could be comparing a particularly excellent example of one bike with a particular poor example of another.

The dyno numbers I have are from a baseline run. My bike will go back to the tuner this week or next and we'll see if we can improve the fuel mapping and extract better running and performance. This will tell me, how good the map that comes with the Termi silencers is.

elitesoldier357 said:

I agree. But Ive been trying to get my question answered. Are the slip-ons putting out power or arent they? I know what the past exhausts did, but I would like to know more specifically what it does for the 1199. The dealer tells me it gets a little better midrange, lighter weight, and louder sound with no gain in peak power.

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I don't remember where I read the comment, but Austin Racing which will soon release an exhaust system for the 1199. The have made a comment that most if the power improvement from the Termi full system came from the silencers.

This would be expected since the Termi silencers bolt up to the stock headers and to the full system and if you look at how they do this, you can see that constriction at the point where the silencers bolt up is the same between the Termi headers and the stock headers. If the Termi headers were to produce significantly more power than the stock headers you would expect them to have less restriction versus the stock system at every point in the system.

Ray916MN said:

I don't remember where I read the comment, but Austin Racing which will soon release an exhaust system for the 1199. The have made a comment that most if the power improvement from the Termi full system came from the silencers.

This would be expected since the Termi silencers bolt up to the stock headers and to the full system and if you look at how they do this, you can see that constriction at the point where the silencers bolt up is the same between the Termi headers and the stock headers. If the Termi headers were to produce significantly more power than the stock headers you would expect them to have less restriction versus the stock system at every point in the system.

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So is it better than to just go with slip-ons in this case and have the ECU tuned?

elitesoldier357 said:

So is it better than to just go with slip-ons in this case and have the ECU tuned?

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The slip-ons provide the most power increase per dollar. The full system provides the most power increase, price be damned.

Whether the map that comes with the Termi full system or silencers can be improved upon has yet to be seen. My tuner is interested in seeing what can be done and so am I, so we'll probably see by the end of next week.

Ray916MN said:

The slip-ons provide the most power increase per dollar. The full system provides the most power increase, price be damned.

Whether the map that comes with the Termi full system or silencers can be improved upon has yet to be seen. My tuner is interested in seeing what can be done and so am I, so we'll probably see by the end of next week.

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Sweet! Thats what I wanted to know. I dont want to spend $3500 on a full system knowing it only gets a few more HP than a slip-on, but then again I dont want to blow $1600 on some slip-on's that wont give me almost anything either. If you get my drift. Gotta know the exact benefits and costs of both worlds

Ray916MN said:

The slip-ons provide the most power increase per dollar. The full system provides the most power increase, price be damned.

Whether the map that comes with the Termi full system or silencers can be improved upon has yet to be seen. My tuner is interested in seeing what can be done and so am I, so we'll probably see by the end of next week.

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There is definitely room for improvement, even down to everyday ridability. On the dyno this weekend, mine was rich EVERYWHERE, and in some spots REALLY rich. Eventually I'll get a PCV to piggyback and lean it out a bit.

Out of curisosity im taking it you all have had the 1st service and then taken the bike past the extra milage at 7k revs? or have you ignored the 7k bit??

JONAH said:

Out of curisosity im taking it you all have had the 1st service and then taken the bike past the extra milage at 7k revs? or have you ignored the 7k bit??

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Dyno break in. Seen 11k since it was first started.

PannyofDoom said:

There is definitely room for improvement, even down to everyday ridability. On the dyno this weekend, mine was rich EVERYWHERE, and in some spots REALLY rich. Eventually I'll get a PCV to piggyback and lean it out a bit.

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You may want to watch this thread Panigale remapping ecu - Ducati.ms - The Ultimate Ducati Forum .

The ECU tables have been cracked and tuners are starting to go at them this week. Direct re-mapping of the ECU gives finer fueling control than the PCV which remaps by fooling the sensors. My tuner goes to work on my bike next week.

One interesting aside is the speed sensor needs to be pulled to properly dyno the 1199. The fuel map richens with speed, to compensate for the additional air from the ram air intake. Of course on a dyno, there effectively isn't any ram air, so the engine runs rich.

Ray916MN said:

One interesting aside is the speed sensor needs to be pulled to properly dyno the 1199. The fuel map richens with speed, to compensate for the additional air from the ram air intake. Of course on a dyno, there effectively isn't any ram air, so the engine runs rich.

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YES. This is really important for people looking to dyno. We tried it plugged in for giggles and sure enough, it went WAY rich and lost crazy power. Unplugged 177/93.

Thanks, I'll check out that link.

Those figures (177/93) more than work for me. I'd be well satisfied if mine hits those numbers when the time comes. And yes I realize if I'm on the top of everest dyno testing, my bike (when it arrives) will not hit those numbers. Or conversely, if I have perfect conditions, it might do fractionally better. Also need to account for many other variables, etc.

dyno instructions for 1199:

Ducati’s four-page instruction guide on proper dyno preparation and procedure involves various steps, most important of which is disconnecting the rear wheel-speed sensor. The 1199’s ECU uses this sensor to “estimate the boost effect present in the air ducts at high speed” via ram air. With the sensor connected and the rear wheel spinning at a high rate, the ECU thinks the ram-air effect is high and reacts by sending an overly rich fuel mixture to the cylinders to compensate, thus giving a false reading. Disconnecting the sensor delivers an appropriate air/fuel ratio while the bike is stationary on the dyno. Handy tip for those looking to dyno their own Panigale: obtain (or have your dealer provide) these instructions when buying.

out of this MCN article