Heat shield removal

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The website you linked is for the 2020 V4R and I assumed you're on the 2023. I think the difference in power is a emission and/or noise regulation thing. The site is EU based so they'd likely know nothing of a difference in specs to US bikes.
 
Trying to follow astral’s train of thought is like trying to read a sentence written by andy circa 2022 (though recently his grammar and sentence structure has really tightened up; nice work!)
 
The 2020 US model is also 218hp stock after verifying the manufacture's title. Interesting there's been no change over 3 years. So were back to 234 with Akra map and no other mods. Ducati also claims 240ish, 240.5 to be exact on their website
 
The V4, V4S & SP 2 make more peak power stock than the V4R according to their US site.

www.ducati.com

New Panigale V4: The Evolution of Speed

The Panigale V4 2022 represents the last step in the characteristic path of the Borgo Panigale sports bikes. The improvements involve all areas: aerodynamics, ergonomics, engine, chassis and electronics. The result is an even faster and more intuitive bike.
www.ducati.com

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EU version of the site is 237 HP. The 240.5 HP is with the snake oil.


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SuperDomestique said:
Trying to follow astral’s train of thought is like trying to read a sentence written by andy circa 2022 (though recently his grammar and sentence structure has really tightened up; nice work!)
Click to expand...

Bit like trying to see where the stolen goods will be handled next 🤷🏼‍♂️.., nice fencing 😉
 
Well I'll be damned 😒 I'll get on the dyno and see if I can get myself out of this..last time I count on marketing lol
 
SuperDomestique said:
I’ve been thinking about this whole heat shield nonsense and using heat tape etc. It really doesn’t matter how much you try, all the heat the engine produces will conduct/convect/radiate all over and unless you cover the particular component in the space shuttle’s ceramic tiles. Any small exposed area is going to transfer that heat and it’s game over. I think that why you don’t see GP/WSBK bike exhausts coated or wrapped or tank taped up with heat reflective tape
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Any physical contact or near proximity will transfer heat. The real problem is the portion of the tank under the seat. Ducati sorta sealed the area around the seat. Wrong. You need airflow to remove the heat. I have been messing with this and the only thing that helped was to raise the seat (0.300 inch) to increase the gap to the tank which allows airflow while you are moving that cools the seat. Stop for more than a gas stop and the seat heat soaks and then it takes 20-30 miles at speed to cool it off again. Serious design flaw. The new bikes rear exhaust turns directly down from the head to move that portion of the pipe away from under the tank. My friend has one of these (2023), doesn't help. And the rear exhaust loses it's equal length and the pipes are smaller diameter. With the converter this apparently moves the torque peak down but I can't see how this is anything but a power loser when you go to a half system. Ducati seems to have never understood (at least publicly) that to equalize front to rear cylinder exhaust flow you may want to time the rear exhaust cam(s) differently. Anyway anything else you do, ceramic coating, header wrap only changes the time constant.
 
baggerman said:
Serious design flaw.
Click to expand...
Is it? If it wasn't a parameter of the design, something defined with left right limits, how could the result be considered a failure? IMHO, the end product is the result of meeting obligations of well meaning regulations for noise and emissions. At the end of the day, Ducati only really cares about their race program(s). Everything else merely supports that.

I never really had a complaint about heat from the seat. It's always been the hot spot on my left leg just below the knee when riding at street speeds. On the track, I was always to busy otherwise to notice.
 
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bp_SFV4 said:
Is it? If it wasn't a parameter of the design, something defined with left right limits, how could the result be considered a failure? IMHO, the end product is the result of meeting obligations of well meaning regulations for noise and emissions. At the end of the day, Ducati only really cares about their race program(s). Everything else merely supports that.

I never really had a complaint about heat from the seat. It's always been the hot spot on my left leg just below the knee when riding at street speeds. On the track, I was always to busy otherwise to notice.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Heat from a high performance engine should be expected. But it could be worse…

IMG_0003.jpeg
 
The margins support the racing programs for sure, but I think the loyalty is to racing. They're not dumb people who can't design a road worthy supersport bike. They just don't have a want or need to.

The Multistrada V4 is an amazing road package, by design.
 
baggerman said:
Any physical contact or near proximity will transfer heat. The real problem is the portion of the tank under the seat. Ducati sorta sealed the area around the seat. Wrong. You need airflow to remove the heat. I have been messing with this and the only thing that helped was to raise the seat (0.300 inch) to increase the gap to the tank which allows airflow while you are moving that cools the seat. Stop for more than a gas stop and the seat heat soaks and then it takes 20-30 miles at speed to cool it off again. Serious design flaw. The new bikes rear exhaust turns directly down from the head to move that portion of the pipe away from under the tank. My friend has one of these (2023), doesn't help. And the rear exhaust loses it's equal length and the pipes are smaller diameter. With the converter this apparently moves the torque peak down but I can't see how this is anything but a power loser when you go to a half system. Ducati seems to have never understood (at least publicly) that to equalize front to rear cylinder exhaust flow you may want to time the rear exhaust cam(s) differently. Anyway anything else you do, ceramic coating, header wrap only changes the time constant.
Click to expand...

KTM seem to have realised, you don't need equal length exhausts to maximise engine power. Especially since each cylinder is tuned/fuelled individually anyway.
 
bp_SFV4 said:
Is it? If it wasn't a parameter of the design, something defined with left right limits, how could the result be considered a failure? IMHO, the end product is the result of meeting obligations of well meaning regulations for noise and emissions. At the end of the day, Ducati only really cares about their race program(s). Everything else merely supports that.

I never really had a complaint about heat from the seat. It's always been the hot spot on my left leg just below the knee when riding at street speeds. On the track, I was always to busy otherwise to notice.
Click to expand...

Clearly you don't ride the bike much. When I go riding it's for thousands of miles (350-400) a day. As long as tires last (with what I use about 6000 miles). If they had forced the design team to commute on the prototypes it would have not been so bad.
 
RickD996 said:
KTM seem to have realised, you don't need equal length exhausts to maximise engine power. Especially since each cylinder is tuned/fuelled individually anyway.
Click to expand...

Look at the twin buell (the one buell designed not HD). All the cams are different. All the ports are different, all the pipes are different. Equal flow in the exhaust (and velocity) is what matters.
 
baggerman said:
Clearly you don't ride the bike much. When I go riding it's for thousands of miles (350-400) a day. As long as tires last (with what I use about 6000 miles). If they had forced the design team to commute on the prototypes it would have not been so bad.
Click to expand...
It’s not a commuter bike. If that’s your use case, so be it.
 
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No it's not a commuter. But it's unfortunate that they ignored this at some level. One guy posted that he got essentially at least a first degree burn on his right cheek riding from Dallas to COTA a couple hundred miles. You're right about feeling it in your right cheek first, I'd forgot. I wrapped the rear header so I don't find this an issue anymore. I don't commute, I'm a retired old guy who is seduced by speed and likes to ride. Many, many, many fine twisty roads in the west.
 
I’m either on a track or out for a short ride on the backroads. If I was wanting to get out for hundreds or thousands of miles I’d get a Multistrada V4. I think that would even be a good bike for an occasional track day.
 
I don't really mind the heat on my 22 pani. Only use this bike as a road bike and predominantly for 4-500km day rides or long road trips (first one was 3000+ kms) with a rack on the back lol. It's my first ducati after years on s1000rr's and have say with both stock exhaust or the full akro system on it now, I've never noticed heat from the seat only from both sides on the lower legs. Spend most of time in leathers and it's a non issue. Only ever does it become something to deal with in jeans if going for a local cruise which is not what I bought the bike for anyway.
The thing I find weird though is comparing this bike to my girlfriends 2021 RSV4. Same engine config and size, exhaust is a bit different on the rear bank but I don't feel heat from that area on the pani anyway. The RSV4 engine runs a lot hotter than my bike however. Coolant temp climbs up like a mfer when stopped. Strangely enough no heat to be felt from anywhere when riding it. Feels like any other 1000cc I4 bike. Is the heat on a panigale just due to the way the air flows through and exits the fairings? Food for thought..
 

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