$10 K&N filter vs. $30 OEM

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Chaotic said:
Would it be blasphemy to say that I have never changed a crush washer in my life, on any bike? :D

I know you are technically supposed to, but I never have. But I don't gorilla the drain plug on either.
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Yea. Part of me things its just another part to nickle and dime us. But then again, I've reused crush washers on an SR20 turbo water return line and they leaked. Ive seen oil leaks a few times from peoples washers not sealing correctly.

At the end of the day, a small leak isn't going to kill anyone or damage anything beyond repair. The riskiest part, is like you said, muscling the bolt in there and screwing up the threads.

Its such a cheap and simple part though, I guess just buy 50 of them like everyone else is saying. 14mm is a pretty standard size.
 
My K&N showed up today. I took a few measurements.

Total length including the rubber grommet: K&N 132.3mm, OEM 130.9mm
Total length metal to metal: K&N 129.9, OEM 128.4
Diameter: K&N 41.3, OEM 43.2
Orifice of the rubber grommet: K&N 13.5, OEM 13.5
Diameter of rubber grommet: K&N 26, OEM 27.2

The measurement of the length is only 1.4mm different but it is a big enough difference to be visibly noticeable. The diameter is almost a full 2mm different. K&N is stamped, "made in China." OEM is stamped "made in Italy." Do the differences matter? I don't know, but there are differences.
 
Pics of the measurements on the OEM filter.
 

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ID of the rubber grommet is the key measurement in my view (to mitigate leakage past the filter) - I don't see how 2 mm difference in length (or the other minor variations) really matters
 
FYI Only - Ducati appears to be taking the line that if you use non OEM filters (air, oil) the warranty coverage associated with any issues that are potentially linked to these systems will be void. My mechanic warned me earlier this week when I dropped off my bike for service for a coolant system leak and casually asked about the K&N filters due to the huge price difference. The dealers sells both OEM and K&N filters; but, advises customers to use only the OEM stuff while the bike is under warranty. Apparently, some customer have learned the hard way.
Honda is also starting to take this line.
My mechanic also noted that the aftermarket products are likely fine; but, that has nothing to do with it. It is the fact that switching to non-OEM stuff brakes the certainty associated with responsibility/cause of a potential issue.
So, if you are still on warranty... be cognoscente of of the risk, regardless of whether the aftermarket filters are the source of the issue or not.
 
Styler said:
FYI Only - Ducati appears to be taking the line that if you use non OEM filters (air, oil) the warranty coverage associated with any issues that are potentially linked to these systems will be void.
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Technically using a non OEM part can't legally void your warranty. You may not want to spend the $'s to fight DNA, but they'd be in the wrong to deny you based on an aftermarket filter.


Aftermarket parts or modifications: This aspect of warranty coverage has a great deal of gray area. Although many dealers would have you think otherwise, simply having an aftermarket part or modifying your vehicle cannot void your warranty.
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Source:
What Voids Your Vehicle's Warranty? -- Edmunds.com
 
Styler said:
FYI Only - Ducati appears to be taking the line that if you use non OEM filters (air, oil) the warranty coverage associated with any issues that are potentially linked to these systems will be void. My mechanic warned me earlier this week when I dropped off my bike for service for a coolant system leak and casually asked about the K&N filters due to the huge price difference. The dealers sells both OEM and K&N filters; but, advises customers to use only the OEM stuff while the bike is under warranty. Apparently, some customer have learned the hard way.
Honda is also starting to take this line.
My mechanic also noted that the aftermarket products are likely fine; but, that has nothing to do with it. It is the fact that switching to non-OEM stuff brakes the certainty associated with responsibility/cause of a potential issue.
So, if you are still on warranty... be cognoscente of of the risk, regardless of whether the aftermarket filters are the source of the issue or not.
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Hmm, it would probably be something that would cost you more in lawyer and court fees than it was worth, but I would have to think that could be challenged.

In the US, in order to deny warranty claims they have to be able to prove the non-OEM part directly caused (or at least contributed) to the failure.

If the K&N is structurally the same and provides the same levels of filtration, I cannot see Ducati having a case. UNLESS they can prove the failure was caused by dirty oil, and the oil was dirty because the aftermarket filter failed.

In other words, they can't deny your warranty claim on a leaking Head Gasket because of your K&N filter. They can try (and im sure they will), but it just depends on how much of a stand the owner of the bike is willing to take.
 
Hey; I am just passing on the information. It is happening; initial warranty claims are being denied, but that does not mean that a customer will not end up winning in the end.
It's your bike; do what you want - just be willing to fight the fight. Ducati is even having oil samples sent to their lab in such situations (what that would/could prove I have no idea).
My objective in posting the information was to provide my peers with additional information that they might want to consider when making these decisions.
I have had enough go wrong on my bike that I am not willing to risk the bother or cost of battling over a warranty claim just so I can save $20 bucks on an oil filter.
That doesn't mean that I appreciate getting bent over the sink every time I change the oil; its merely and indicator that I am risk averse.
 
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Thanks for the info but sounds like scare tactics to me, I've heard similar comments on other forums but never a documented case of warranty denial. Aftermarket oil filters are used on countless cars, bikes, jet skis etc

If this was a new Ferrari I'd think twice.
 
RD16RR said:
Penny wise - Pound foolish
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Based on what?

Feel free to do your own research (granted particle count tests on these filters are hard to find), but tests I've seen show resin impregnated filter media in the M1 and K&N filters outperform OEM conventional cellulose filters every time, so it's actually double wise in this case. The only thing that filters better is the microglass in the RP and Amsoil filters, which are not available for this bike.
 
Styler said:
Hey; I am just passing on the information. It is happening; initial warranty claims are being denied, but that does not mean that a customer will not end up winning in the end.
It's your bike; do what you want - just be willing to fight the fight. Ducati is even having oil samples sent to their lab in such situations (what that would/could prove I have no idea).
My objective in posting the information was to provide my peers with additional information that they might want to consider when making these decisions.
I have had enough go wrong on my bike that I am not willing to risk the bother or cost of battling over a warranty claim just so I can save $20 bucks on an oil filter.
That doesn't mean that I appreciate getting bent over the sink every time I change the oil; its merely and indicator that I am risk averse.
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We weren't directing that towards you or even arguing with you. It was more directed at Ducati for the way they are trying to be chickenshit.
 
SteSmi067 said:
Just a quick warning to anyone taking advice from or doing business with fzr100098. I don't know this guy at all, but he uses the same username over on Chess.com. After losing a single game, he started with this unprovoked hateful speech while I was playing chess along with my 4-year old daughter:

fzr100098: you suck
fzr100098: how about that
fzr100098: f you trash
fzr100098: rot in hell fggt

I don't really know what these forums are used for or if people do business/trades here. I just wanted to make your community aware of the hateful person who appears to be a regular member here. I was simply trying to enjoy a chess game while trying to teach my young daughter, and this guy would not let up.

I would certainly not play chess with this "Mark Strong" again (if that is your real name), and I really don't appreciate your vulgarity on a family-oriented site like chess.com.

I don't know if you treat everyone you meet like this, but you need to be accountable for your words and actions. Try to have a little respect next time, please.
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I'm not even sure what to say to this... All I know is that I like the Pani more than the R1.
 

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