1199 vs s1000rr

I would say since you rode both get what suites you and your riding style best.

I have both an 1199R and an S1000RR. I'll give you my thoughts, though to be fair, it's not a fully apples/apples comparison as my S1000RR is all set up for the track while my 1199R is all stock with exception of the Termis (ok, those are stock on the R), fueling, and stiffer front fork springs.

I rode both at Portland International Raceway, my home track. I also rode the 1199R at the Ridge raceway in WA.

What I found on the 1199R - it looks and sounds great, very good brakes, agile handling. Very good transmission and shifting. The main problem that I had with the 1199R was on the brakes. Even with the stiffer springs I was bottoming out going into T1 at PIR (almost mile long front straight) to the point the tire was rubbing on the plastic piece between the radiator and oil cooler. If I turned up the compression it would start to get a nasty mid-corner chatter as you approached a 9/10's pace and didn't give me much confidence. To go faster it would take some suspension work. The agile handling also turned into a bit of nervousness and amplified mistakes, especially towards the end of a session when you get tired. The motor was fast, I could keep up with stock S1000RR's on the straights. Engine braking was surprisingly strong, I'd recommend using setting 2 or 3 for the track. Traction control was at 1, but still a bit too intrusive. Fastest time at PIR was a 1:10 with Dunlop slicks.

As far as my S1000RR - it's all set up for track duty with good suspension, bodywork, exhaust, etc. It is very comfortable to go fast on, stable but also turns in well. Very good brakes like the 1199R, but faster down the straights. The one big handling issue I have is coming off the corners I sometimes get pumping from the rear shock. It's really bad on PIR's bumpy "back straight" T6 with the traction control light constantly flashing while you're going 150 mph! The TC is a bit better than the Ducati, but I have the kit ECU that comes with the German IDM Superbike series settings. The shifting is not as good as the 1199R and prone to false neutrals if you're not deliberate with the downshifts. My best lap time was a 1:06 on Pirelli slicks. For reference the current lap record at PIR is a 1:05.

For me I would take the S1000RR to race because it's easier to go fast on. I'm sure the 1199R can be made to go very quick, but I think it would be a lot pickier on set up. I will still ride the Duc at the track and have a lot of fun with it, but for racing I would choose the BMW.

SOULRIDER said:

That's not a Pirelli SuperCorsa rear in the picture. Are you running different makes on tire front and back?

I've ridden both, and I think it all depends on your personal preference. I do think it's easier to go fast right out of the box on the Beemer.

The suspension when setup right on the Panigale is butter, but it takes time.

Both bikes are beasts. Do you really think you can get more than 90% out of either bike?

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I buy my bike with this (see photo) tires and i make some laps with this tires and after i change with pirelli super corsa sc2

dpwracing said:

Even with the stiffer springs I was bottoming out going into T1 at PIR (almost mile long front straight) to the point the tire was rubbing on the plastic piece between the radiator and oil cooler. If I turned up the compression it would start to get a nasty mid-corner chatter as you approached a 9/10's pace and didn't give me much confidence.

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Yep, it seems very easy to bottom the forks out. I'm 80kg with gear and while adding preload and compression helped, I not 100% sure its completely sorted.

Stock suspension settings for the base as well S version are pretty much unrideable. I talked to few guys that sold their panigales soon after buying them since they could not gel with it, but, they did not try changing the suspension settings for their body weight either.

What transformed ride for my S model was Dave Moss’s suspension recommendation, as well as other few tweaks such as replacing the slippery foot pegs with rizoma’s and tightening up the steering dumper. I had my friend’s S1000RR as a reference for the steering dumper resistance.

You can refer to Dave’s article for the base model here:
Panigale standard | Feel The Track

One final tweak that made it for me was changing the tyres and putting Dunlop Q3s. Note that the rear Q3 190/55 will match perfectly the stock Pirelli rear tire dimensions.

Enjoy!

regards bottoming under brakes, have people with that issue reduced the air gap in the forks? from memory they run quite a big std gap(160mm on the S) 110-120mm is mostly considered "normal"....

Setup and practice. The BMW isn't 4 seconds faster on any track.

You can sell and lose serious $$$$ on the trade to the BMW, or you can just fix your bike and riding. Seems like an easy choice to me.

Raising the oil level would make a lot of sense, I'll have to ask the shop that took them apart where they reset the level.

HilG said:

One final tweak that made it for me was changing the tyres and putting Dunlop Q3s. Note that the rear Q3 190/55 will match perfectly the stock Pirelli rear tire dimensions.

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Unless the Dunlop Q3's supplied to Australia are different the ones we get in the USA, this is not correct. The Dunlop Q3 190/55 is actually a few mm wider and several mm (at least 6 mm) shorter than the OEM Pirelli Supercorsa 200/55. Without making any compensating changes (changing shock length/dropping fork tubes in triple clamps), this will lower the rear ride height of the bike, somewhat slowing steering but increasing mid-corner stability, and it will have an effect on the DTC. The DTC with the Dunlop Q3 190//55 will basically seem to intervene 1-2 levels higher than the same setting with the OEM Pirelli Supercorsa. The difference in overall circumference, compound, carcass construction - and the slip/thrust ratio (combination of above) makes the DTC react slightly different since it was developed specifically for the Pirelli Supercorsa.

dpwracing said:

Raising the oil level would make a lot of sense, I'll have to ask the shop that took them apart where they reset the level.

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While they have them apart, have the upgrade the valving to the race-spec and get rid of the street valving that is in there now so you have enough compression damping to support the hard braking on the track.

jarel, do you have a race tech kit for the marzocchis?

i'm in the market, so to say...

Phl said:

jarel, do you have a race tech kit for the marzocchis?

i'm in the market, so to say...

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No, all we have is Ohlins cartridge kits (NIX30 or TTX25).

thanks