Difference between 2019 vs 2021 V4

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RODOLFO

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I have a 19 V4S

and have the bug of changing to a 21 base model or an SP

But is the handling that much better on the new models?

because of the front chasis or the rear shock link?

is changing worth it?

or are changes minimal
 
Adjusting the geometry to 2020 is easy. You do not have to buy a new bike for that. Nor because I do not like the 2020 fairing.

There are new driving modes. Whether you need them, I can not say.
 
There are quite a few differences between the 2019 and 2020, and even between the 2020 and 2021. I have a 2021 Panigale and my owner's manual is for a 2020 and doesn't have correct info as to mode settings. IIRC, with the 2018 and 2019 you couldn't change Mid Corner, Acceleration etc unless you where in Race mode. Now you can change everyone of those settings in all 4 ride modes, Race A, Race B, Sport and Street. DTC is now DTC Evo3 or whatever.

The 2020+ front frame has cutouts in it to allow for flex. The front frame comes with a plastic plug marked "V4" in the hole.

The 2018 Panigale came with a 95nm spring. The 2020+ comes with a 85nm but has a different linkage. Both are stiff AF from the factory with no static sag. I think there was a ride height/fork height change, but that's not anything you can't do yourself.

No one can really tell you if any of these features or the electronics would benefit you. It seems every model year gets more developments. With the 2020 Panigale, I think that was close to when the 1199 went to the 1299. Its not a huge leap but a tick more.

I'd suggest riding and trying one out if possible.

1635801782860.png
 
MY21 is "easier" to ride but that doesn't mean it's faster or slower. It has DTC EVO3 which is the latest. Will you feel the difference on the street, unlikely. On the track over a 20 minute session it feels more like a "traditional" bike as far as front end feel and feedback. If your happy with the S then keep it. Going to a MY21 is nice but it's not a new bike, just updated.
 
bp_SFV4 said:
The 2020+ front frame has cutouts in it to allow for flex. ...
...I think that was close to when the 1199 went to the 1299. Its not a huge leap but a tick more.

View attachment 39369
Click to expand...

Frame
Ouch two gaping holes! That hurts?

tdjVLG8l.png


I also went silent in awe after learning from Claudio about this 'gaping' intervention to improve PV4's frontend feedback. I guess less=more? lol ;)

Nevertheless the frontend feel of my '18 V4S feels fine and secure on the road and track with still its 'intact' magnesium frontal frame.
Especially compared to my previous optimised Daytona 675 track-bike, which was known for its great chassis feedback.

I do remember VR46 struggling though with related frontend issues riding his MotoGP V4, so more flex could potentially improve frontend feel if you really push it on track.

I must say that soon after purchase, I had the front- and rear-suspension for both these bikes personally updated and dialled in by a suspension specialist for my weight and usage.
Different internal shims, improved general geometry setup and custom spring/damper configuration again made a world of difference in handling.
Factory setup for both was OK, but both felt soo much more planted and refined - inspiring confidence - after this treatment. Best investment period.

Engine & Electronics
Even though I also had the DTC/DQS recently updated to 'Evo2', which makes power management and shifting a tad smoother, I generally like the edgier 'balls to the wall' engine character of my 'original' PV4 better (closer to the even r-/tougher 1199/1299 'true Ducati' PV2 twins), compared to that of later and current more refined PV4's. That doesn't mean I consider the 2021 PV4 a boring bike, just a somewhat more polished character which makes it an evolutionary more refined and efficient 'easier2ridefast' tracktool.

Engine displacement and power is 99,9% the same, nothing like the difference between 1199 and 1299 displacement I recon. But I can't tell from personal experience, since never actually rode any of these older iconic PV2's.

Fairing
Shark gills in its side panels are both a great looking addition as well as providing more efficient airflow for heat shedding.
I dislike the 'bloated' frontal silhouette which supposedly improves the wind protection. Which can also sufficiently be achieved by installing the higher up racing canopy.
IMHO I still truly love the much more refined look of the original 1199/1299 PV2's and succeeding PV4 upto 2019.

Nowadays bigger=better to show off its racing pedigree with even uglier 'aero' wings seems to be the mantra?
IMHO quite laughable for PV4's primarily ridden as street-bikes and primarily doing street-legal speeds? ;)
 
Last edited:
Looks are subjective but I like the 1299 better than any flavor of the V4, but none are hard to look at.

The wind protection from the widebody V4 and the V4R is more than a tall windscreen but only useful at higher speeds. Even a tall windscreen can be more harm than good depending on how the air hits you when you're riding.

I though it was an interesting bit of engineering that they cut out sections of the frame to get the bike to handle better. I'm sure a lot went into exactly where the stress was and the exact shape and size to make the cutout both on the outer and inner part of the frame. Only useful when leaning or under hard braking, but interesting nonetheless.
 
Money better spent modding your current bike vs buying a 21. Throw the money into suspension/chassis/brakes and you’ll have a better handling bike than a stock 21 anyway.

Plus the non-winged bikes look better.
 
Last edited:
brad8266 said:
Money better spent modding your current bike vs buying a 21. Throw the money into suspension/chassis/brakes and you’ll have a better handling bike than a stock 21 anyway.

Plus the non-winged bikes look better.
Click to expand...

any suggestions on some suspension mods?

chassis or brakes

I have a 19 S model
 
RODOLFO said:
any suggestions on some suspension mods?

chassis or brakes

I have a 19 S model
Click to expand...

If Im not mistaken you may be able to send your forks to Ohlins USA or to certain certified ohlins dealers like Motorcycle Metal down in Florida. Motorcycle metal sells and rebuilds Ohlins suspension. If you did that I think they could remove the electronic servos and replace them with manual ones. Then you can replace the Nix30mm non-pressurized cartridges with TTX FKR spring pressurized cartridges. Im not sure what the cost is to covert from electronic to manual. But the TTX FKR cartridges cost somewhere between $2300-$2500.

Your brake calipers are pretty good. I wouldnt suggest replacing them unless youre chasing championships. My suggestion would be to replace the brake pads. I like the Ferrodo XRAC or ZRAC up front and the ST HH sintered in the rear. If you wanted more braking then get the Brembo 17RCS Corsa Corta front brake master cylinder. Want more braking power? Add the Brembo 330mm T-Drive brake rotors.

You can also always get the IMA special parts adjustable triple trees. Depending on how you set it up will determine the way the bike handles. Quicker turns, lazier turns, more stable on longer straight away's, less stable on shorter straight away's. Its how you set it up depending on the riding you do. Or the different tracks you go on. Here is a link. Its a minute and half video that reactive parts made. I sold about 7 to guys on the forum.

For the rear, the least expensive upgrade you can do is add the Oversuspension. I have it on two of my bikes and sold around 60 of them to guys with Ducati's, Kawasaki's, Honda's, Aprilia's, KTM's, BMW's and Suzuki's. But the majority have been to sold to Ducati owners. Some call it snake oil. I sold one to Bill from Calimoto TV (although he said he bought it from Bellissimoto which bothered me. But at least he buys other things from me) Here is a Calimoto TV review on the Oversuspension

And here is the last mod that someone just ordered from me. Its the first time I sold this type of mod. I knew nothing about it until I was asked to get it. I dont think guys who only ride the streets should do this. Its really expensive. There is a company in Italy that extends the V4 swing arm by +35mm and +30mm for the 1299. Apparently stabilizes the bike better during acceleration and braking. While giving a better secure feel while exiting turns. You can either order a new swing arm for $7200 or send your swing arm in and have it extended for $4200. I gave the customer a discount on a new swing arm. But unless youre turning your bike into a track bike and are a dominant track rider. Or want to tell people how cool you are riding in the street with this extended swing arm. I say this is a mod you can skip mod. Extended swingarm +35 : Pierobon Frames - frames and accessories for motorcycle
 
RickD996 said:
I'm perplexed, why hasn't a top race team, suspension manufacturer or tyre company taken Dave Moss on!?
Click to expand...

Maybe he likes being his own boss and setting up suspension the way he see's fit. Im sure he has seen his fair share of pro's complaining about their bikes set up. When in reality maybe its not the bike but the rider. He sets up bikes a certain way. Can you imagine a race team hiring him and then telling him how to set up their suspension. That would like when Harley bought Buell. Buell thought he would be able to develop bikes the way he saw fit with all his knowledge and no how. Instead Harley told him what to design and how they wanted it designed. Instead of letting Buell design something that would compete in the sports bike market. They thought they knew better and had him design what they thought customers wanted. In the end Harley effed everything up. Maybe thats what Dave Moss thinks if he were to sign with a top race team. He may make less money doing it this way. But he is own boss, people from all over come to him and he his known worldwide. That may be enough for him. Who know what goes on in a persons mind.
 
cycler said:
Maybe he likes being his own boss and setting up suspension the way he see's fit. Im sure he has seen his fair share of pro's complaining about their bikes set up. When in reality maybe its not the bike but the rider. He sets up bikes a certain way. Can you imagine a race team hiring him and then telling him how to set up their suspension. That would like when Harley bought Buell. Buell thought he would be able to develop bikes the way he saw fit with all his knowledge and no how. Instead Harley told him what to design and how they wanted it designed. Instead of letting Buell design something that would compete in the sports bike market. They thought they knew better and had him design what they thought customers wanted. In the end Harley effed everything up. Maybe thats what Dave Moss thinks if he were to sign with a top race team. He may make less money doing it this way. But he is own boss, people from all over come to him and he his known worldwide. That may be enough for him. Who know what goes on in a persons mind.
Click to expand...


Kinda missed my point...
 
RODOLFO said:
What adjustment has to be done?

i think the front frame is also softer
Click to expand...

We talk about geometry.

The fork is pushed through 4 mm further.
Other tie rods are used for the linkage of the shock absorber.

The basic tuning for a rider weight of about 75 kg is slightly softer.
Softer spring on the shock (standard and S Model) and in the fork (only S Model, standard Showa not changed).
This leads to more negative sag!
 
I don't think you're going to be blown away by the changes. Perhaps wait for the next big change in the platform. Maybe the 22's?

If you have the itch for another bike, pick up a 21 Tuono so you can justify it based on different rides. :)
 
And I agree with the comment about the wings being unnecessary. Yes, they do provide some downward pressure on the front-end (technically). But it's negligible until well over 100mph. IMHO, they're unnecessary and irrelevant unless you are spending a LOT of time at the track where they actually do anything meaningful (besides look rediculous & ugly). Mine came off right away. So I guess people won't be able to tell from afar that I'm on a '21... oh well....
 
DTC3 and the riding modes major differences. I found 2021“easier to ride” and even better handling SP due to lighter weight and carbon wheels i think. If you can find an SP, get it. Absolutely stunning and rarer. $8k over the S and just the dry clutch and the wheels makes that difference almost. Anything else is a bonus. Great bargain! I got one and in love. If you cant find one, then cop a V4R they are same price now. Or you can simply build your 2019 with that price difference if you are into that!
 

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