DUCATI V4SP ENGINE UPGRADES?????

Hae guys new here , got a 2021 V4SP , ive done alot of work to it so far
small list as follows

full ackro system
the usual carbon parts
carbon sprocket
lighter wheel nuts and everything else down there
tail tidy
titanium nuts everywhere
carbonfibre rear subframe has nearly arrived
dyno tuned with woolich , got 206 h.p at rear wheel
bluetooth attachment
gps unit
sprint filter
caliper spacers
caliper titanium bolts everywhere
looking at getting a few more billet allimnium parts for some parts
keyless gas tank

im now wondering what i can do with the actual engin , i know ducati has done well with squeezing everything in there

im of to do NZ SPEED RUNS next weekend so can update here what top speed i get out of it , im 103kgs so im hoping i can scratch that 300kph/180mph mark , hate these youtube videos of people with there over rated speedo runs haha

Hmmm I would have bought an H2R, saved a pile of money and gone faster.

Sweet wheels Pippa. I haven't heard much about getting more power out, beyond what you've done.
I think Tambourini (Italy) might do race valves and head work, but not sure.
You can play around with different exhausts, which potentially can move the power band around, but I think you'd be talking about 1-5hp here or there.

Enjoy!

endodoc said:

Hmmm I would have bought an H2R, saved a pile of money and gone faster.

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I do appreciate what the H2R can offer , I'm not personally a kawasaki fan , and neither are you if your on a Ducati forum page (no offemce), all seriousness though , I didn't get the H2 because I wanted something fast around the track , super eye appealing and 100% eye candy , the H2 doesn't do all of that for me , yes in a straight line it's Great , but it's glory for me ends there ,
The duce eye appealing is there , the engine is great , the teack ability is super on point and it makes me get a hard on lol

RickD996 said:

Sweet wheels Pippa. I haven't heard much about getting more power out, beyond what you've done.
I think Tambourini (Italy) might do race valves and head work, but not sure.
You can play around with different exhausts, which potentially can move the power band around, but I think you'd be talking about 1-5hp here or there.

Enjoy!

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Thanks man , yeah not worth playing with that much money for bugger all gains , again Tha ks for the compliment

Carbon Starbucks coffee holder?

RickD996 said:

Sweet wheels Pippa. I haven't heard much about getting more power out, beyond what you've done.
I think Tambourini (Italy) might do race valves and head work, but not sure.
You can play around with different exhausts, which potentially can move the power band around, but I think you'd be talking about 1-5hp here or there.

Enjoy!

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Coincidentally, I made an inquiry recently because my bike is down for updates. We were considering head work (port/polish and valve job) but were told the shop had done a few v4’s and it weren’t seeing significant gains and said it wasn’t worth doing. Not sure this is true - just what I was told.

Also, I reached out to Nova about a gearset for the v4, or doing anything like shot peening, cryo or ISF to the oem gearset was being done. They said no gearset is being developed for the v4, and that to their knowledge, even wsbk isn’t shot peening, cryo’ing or ISF treating the gearsets.

Anyone else know anything different?

pippa said:

I do appreciate what the H2R can offer , I'm not personally a kawasaki fan , and neither are you if your on a Ducati forum page (no offemce), all seriousness though , I didn't get the H2 because I wanted something fast around the track , super eye appealing and 100% eye candy , the H2 doesn't do all of that for me , yes in a straight line it's Great , but it's glory for me ends there ,
The duce eye appealing is there , the engine is great , the teack ability is super on point and it makes me get a hard on lol

Click to expand...

Ok being somewhat jovial in my comment but reality is reality. Its a great bike. 206 rwhp to me is quite astonishing for the price of that bike and not in a good way. You’re into that thing what 50k plus for 206 rwhp? The 2018 V2 SBK motors were making a bunch more power than that.

North Valley Honda’s 2005 HRC kitted 1000rr that Mark Ledesma (awesome CCS guy from AZ)rode made 205 rwhp and that was 17 years ago and that bike was pennies compared to this stuff.

I don’t get these bikes anymore. They have been throwing around 199-210 hp for literally over a decade. These things for the displacement are tapped, been tapped long ago unless you’re going to spend some $$.

To Craig’s comment, not sure who you guys are talking to but their is a SBK package for that bike. Now they probably wouldn’t make it if gains weren’t statistically significant. The numbers thrown around for the Corse WSBK engine are considerably higher than the standard R motor so they are getting them from somewhere. Rapido also has a bunch of photos out there of the heads on the bench getting “the treatment” and they wouldn’t be doing that if there wasn’t something there.

These bikes are just too much of everything. Look at all the wiring coming out of this thing. What a ....... mess. This is precisely why I didn’t jump from the 99 to the 4. For me, there was zero to be gained and more headaches I will gladly migrate to a newer platform when they give me something better (for me) but they are continuing to gimmick the .... out of these things which drives the cost skyward and reliability and maintenance costs into the drain.

Hopefully they get the bugs worked out with the ebikes and we can move on but right now the cost of going faster on these internal combustion dinosaurs has become somewhat silly.

endodoc said:

To Craig’s comment, not sure who you guys are talking to but their is a SBK package for that bike. Now they probably wouldn’t make it if gains weren’t statistically significant. The numbers thrown around for the Corse WSBK engine are considerably higher than the standard R motor so they are getting them from somewhere. Rapido also has a bunch of photos out there of the heads on the bench getting “the treatment” and they wouldn’t be doing that if there wasn’t something there.

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I’m inclined to agree. I was quite surprised by the advice.

Ducati claims what - 234 hp for the R with full Akro exhaust? Raising the scr from 14 to 15.4 and running higher octane (more detonation resistant) fuel makes that number 257. Wsbk spec exhaust and engine management would likely result in additional gains, so 265-270 crank seems attainable. Add another ~10 for the head work that I was told wasn’t worth the money and the bike is making 275-280 at the crank? Maybe? I’m just spitballing.

My favorite line, "titanium nuts everywhere"
Where do you do speed runs in NZ? I'd love to see images of all this. You'd better post some vids of that exercise!

craig bush said:

I’m inclined to agree. I was quite surprised by the advice.

Ducati claims what - 234 hp for the R with full Akro exhaust? Raising the scr from 14 to 15.4 and running higher octane (more detonation resistant) fuel makes that number 257. Wsbk spec exhaust and engine management would likely result in additional gains, so 265-270 crank seems attainable. Add another ~10 for the head work that I was told wasn’t worth the money and the bike is making 275-280 at the crank? Maybe? I’m just spitballing.

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Yes so the thinking is aligned. As you can see if we look at a base motor all the way up to utilizing unlimited resources for a build there is quite a large difference in performance potential. Of course with that you will sacrifice service life and reliability accordingly. The question is one of strategic value (long term) vs tactical spontaneity (.... it, if I blow it up, I have 6 more) If your race, you do have some constraints on what you can do and if you want to be competitive, you will undoubtedly have to spend to win.

If it’s a track bike, sky’s the limit and largely depends on what you can afford and I don’t just mean monetarily. Can you afford to have the bike down a lot for service? Can you afford the time logistically to make it all happen? Or do you just want to track it, park it, put gas in it and go again. One would really need to identify the goal of your endeavors.

pippa said:

I do appreciate what the H2R can offer , I'm not personally a kawasaki fan , and neither are you if your on a Ducati forum page (no offemce), all seriousness though , I didn't get the H2 because I wanted something fast around the track , super eye appealing and 100% eye candy , the H2 doesn't do all of that for me , yes in a straight line it's Great , but it's glory for me ends there ,
The duce eye appealing is there , the engine is great , the teack ability is super on point and it makes me get a hard on lol

Click to expand...

Me abs you are in the same track with our bike builds….look at the “Back in the Shop” thread at a lot of options you haven’t gotten to.

My whole idea with this build was not to build a perfect track weapon, but to build a REALKY sexy bike that I like looking at, that’s fast as hell in a straight line but also very capable on the track….i.e. a bike that checks off ALL the boxes, or at least balances all the check marks well.

I have the full Akra but am moving to to Spark SBK exhaust, and will Woolich dyno tune it as soon as the exhaust is installed.

Look at doing the Pierobahn extended swingarm because it will let you pull harder with more mechanical wheelie resistance versus electronic wheelie intervention that cut the power.

craig bush said:

I’m inclined to agree. I was quite surprised by the advice.

Ducati claims what - 234 hp for the R with full Akro exhaust? Raising the scr from 14 to 15.4 and running higher octane (more detonation resistant) fuel makes that number 257. Wsbk spec exhaust and engine management would likely result in additional gains, so 265-270 crank seems attainable. Add another ~10 for the head work that I was told wasn’t worth the money and the bike is making 275-280 at the crank? Maybe? I’m just spitballing.

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That sounds about right to me…it’s all about air and fuel in and air abs exhaust out, there’s always ways to do that if you’re willing to spend the cash….but you can’t understate the benefit of race fuel and/or methanol….and the right tune for it.

You combine higher air in/out with higher octane and you get a MUCH more powerful engine.

endodoc said:

Hopefully they get the bugs worked out with the ebikes and we can move on but right now the cost of going faster on these internal combustion dinosaurs has become somewhat silly.

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For sure.

The race machines squeezing more power out of a similar size engine have totally different maintenance requirements. One can't expect ever increasing HP and for that cost to be limited only to the buy in. If such a thing as a 265-270 HP V4 exists, its not getting by on 7500 mile oil changes.

bp_SFV4 said:

For sure.

The race machines squeezing more power out of a similar size engine have totally different maintenance requirements. One can't expect ever increasing HP and for that cost to be limited only to the buy in. If such a thing as a 265-270 HP V4 exists, its not getting by on 7500 mile oil changes.

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True but at least as far as engine components go most of the “race” stuff is actually more durable when used by mere mortals than the street stuff, it needs to be because it’s designed to not fail under much higher stress levels.

Not so with non-engine race parts though, like clutches and trannies and brakes etc that are designed to perform well but only have to last one race.

That kind of goes to my point. Doing a tune with race fuel to extract more power on a system not readily designed for it (OEM) without a pretty serious consideration on the service requirements maybe a recipe for disaster.

If you're building for it its another matter, but then you go into skyrocketing costs.

bp_SFV4 said:

That kind of goes to my point. Doing a tune with race fuel to extract more power on a system not readily designed for it (OEM) without a pretty serious consideration on the service requirements maybe a recipe for disaster.

If you're building for it its another matter, but then you go into skyrocketing costs.

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I think these engines are built well enough to handle a lot more power than stock…kinda like my Porsche, it comes from the factory with about 480 whp….but you can crank the power up to 1100 whp as long as you keep the torque below 750-800.

I think the Ducati engine can handle ALOT more power, maybe the tranny too, but the clutch is suspect to me, you start adding 20% or 30% more power I doubt the readily available clutches can handle it for long, abs most of the high end aftermarket clutches for race bikes are only meant to last a race or two….so with big additions in power I think the weak link will be the clutch

Unlike Harley or some of the JAP brands or even the s1000RR, you’re going to be limited to the basic engines itself, you’re not going too say tear the heads off and port them. Or throw a set of big boy cams in there, the situation is very similar with Ferrari where the aftermarket is very soft. As a result you’re going to be able to do full bolt ons and get a custom tune that’ll be about it . On top of that the comments in here about these bikes in general being tapped out at 200-220whp at the most is 100 percent true without direct injection, higher compression and lesser emissions. You’re not going to see a 250hp V4 anytime soon or ever

Vbreeze said:

My favorite line, "titanium nuts everywhere"
Where do you do speed runs in NZ? I'd love to see images of all this. You'd better post some vids of that exercise!

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One public road is about 6k's dead straight and level, the official record for a normally aspirated bike is held by a 2011 ZX10 at 321 kmh. No V4's but I lets see if that changes

Paul G said:

One public road is about 6k's dead straight and level, the official record for a normally aspirated bike is held by a 2011 ZX10 at 321 kmh. No V4's but I lets see if that changes

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I won't be that time , I'm just going for the fun of it