Great write-up on the 1299S

Lots of defensive responses here. Undoubtedly any new bike is likely to improve on areas previously tagged as known "issues" on an outgoing model. After all there has to be an incentive to trade your current bike in and secure sales. That said, the successor to the 1299 will almost certainly be another step up, so in a couple of years from now, the cycle will repeat itself.

Most products are out of date the second you buy one. Development stops for no one and without it, a company would wither and die. The trick is to be happy with what you have and if that is not enough, move on to a later offering. At best any present model owner (be that a 1299 or a Multistrada DVT) will be on a machine that is already slated for a makeover, enhancement or replacement in the not too distant future. That's just how it goes. Chances are Ducati are already sketching a replacement for the Panigale for 2017/18. Enjoy the moment now else you will forever be left wanting.

topolino said:

Lots of defensive responses here. Undoubtedly any new bike is likely to improve on areas previously tagged as known "issues" on an outgoing model. After all there has to be an incentive to trade your current bike in and secure sales. That said, the successor to the 1299 will almost certainly be another step up, so in a couple of years from now, the cycle will repeat itself.

Most products are out of date the second you buy one. Development stops for no one and without it, a company would wither and die. The trick is to be happy with what you have and if that is not enough, move on to a later offering. At best any present model owner (be that a 1299 or a Multistrada DVT) will be on a machine that is already slated for a makeover, enhancement or replacement in the not too distant future. That's just how it goes. Chances are Ducati are already sketching a replacement for the Panigale for 2017/18. Enjoy the moment now else you will forever be left wanting.

Click to expand...

I agree, there is always technical devepopment that mostly improves performance/driveablility/safety, but this is not a guarantee that new is always better (in every attribute).

I think for steet bikes the max power around 200 HP is already over the usable level, so mid range power/torque is for street use the most important attribute. There the 1299 seems to have a big improvement vs. 1199 (in stock setup at least).

If the sucsessor of the 1299 in two/three year will be better, lets wait and see. The real loud OEM exhaust (with the flapper valve "trick") will be not possible any more here in Europe at least...

You're right about noise regs. We will soon be facing Euro 5 regulations which aim to strangle current bikes and include sensors to detect if you fit a non standard exhaust for example. Make hay while the sun shines people.

Wow. I thought California's emission laws were BS. That takes the cake. Sensors to detect aftermarket exhaust? Wow.

topolino said:

Lots of defensive responses here. Undoubtedly any new bike is likely to improve on areas previously tagged as known "issues" on an outgoing model. After all there has to be an incentive to trade your current bike in and secure sales. That said, the successor to the 1299 will almost certainly be another step up, so in a couple of years from now, the cycle will repeat itself.

Most products are out of date the second you buy one. Development stops for no one and without it, a company would wither and die. The trick is to be happy with what you have and if that is not enough, move on to a later offering. At best any present model owner (be that a 1299 or a Multistrada DVT) will be on a machine that is already slated for a makeover, enhancement or replacement in the not too distant future. That's just how it goes. Chances are Ducati are already sketching a replacement for the Panigale for 2017/18. Enjoy the moment now else you will forever be left wanting.

Click to expand...

True. When it comes to cars and motorcycles, nobody is more critical of a new model than owners of the previous model.

How can 1199 owners get the same 1299 chassis tweaks ?
(rake and trail numbers[ 1299 is 24 degree rake I believe , swing arm pivot apparently is 4mm lower on the 1299 , etc, etc)

Perhaps raising the ride height on the 1199 would decrease the rake angle to achieve the 24degree rake angle, as the 1299?

Prince, there is a kit to change the rake. If you do a search on the forum it is easy to find that. I am not sure about the swing arm change though.

topolino said:

You're right about noise regs. We will soon be facing Euro 5 regulations which aim to strangle current bikes and include sensors to detect if you fit a non standard exhaust for example. Make hay while the sun shines people.

Click to expand...

Thought that after Euro 3 (which is currrent requirement) next will be Euro 4, which increases the demand for a certain noise emission limit (more than just a short acceleration from 50 kph; where the flapper valve is active only)

The story with sensors is new to me. But the good thing here in Germany is that if the police detects a non legal exhaust like Termi or Akra (the chance is little by the way), it only costs you 90 Euro....no other panalty.

Thanks Rawdog

Prince Albert said:

Perhaps raising the ride height on the 1199 would decrease the rake angle to achieve the 24degree rake angle, as the 1299?

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Look here:

http://ducati1299.com/mechanical-technical/20713-installing-24-degree-kit-w-pics-3.html

jogy said:

Thought that after Euro 3 (which is currrent requirement) next will be Euro 4, which increases the demand for a certain noise emission limit (more than just a short acceleration from 50 kph; where the flapper valve is active only)

The story with sensors is new to me. But the good thing here in Germany is that if the police detects a non legal exhaust like Termi or Akra (the chance is little by the way), it only costs you 90 Euro....no other panalty.

Click to expand...

I did some investigation into EU legeslative:

Regs 41-60 - Transport - UNECE

The next step in motorcylcles noise emission in EU is regulation no. 41 with 04 series of amendments.

Valid for new type approvals since 1st January 2014, for first registration 1st January 2017.

The 1299 is likely to be homologated with an amendment of type approval of the 1199 which was released before Jan 2014 (based on 03 amendment).

04 amendment clearly regulates that systems to influence noise emissions (like flapper valve) are not allowed to be active in driving noise test only:

6.3.1. The motor cycle manufacturer shall not intentionally alter, adjust, or introduce any device or procedure solely for the purpose of fulfilling the noise emission requirements of this Regulation, which will not be operational during typical on-road operation.

6.3.2. The vehicle type to be approved shall meet the requirements of Annex 7 to this Regulation. If the motor cycle has user selectable software programs or modes which affect the sound emission of the vehicle, all these modes shall be in compliance with the requirements in Annex 7. Testing shall be based on the worst case scenario.

Also the overall noise limit is different, it is a mix now from acceleration and constant speed measurement which may not exceed 77/78 dB(A) for high power motorbikes.

Lol@ 77/78db. The Panigale is probably louder than that on start up alone.

double0 said:

Lol@ 77/78db. The Panigale is probably louder than that on start up alone.

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A washing machine is louder...that's an insanely low noise level..

Current limit in EU is 80 dB(A) driving noise level (which is met also by 1199/1299 with OEM exhaust including flapper valve intervention), no limit for stationary noise.