Ride height adjustment on a SFV4S

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yes the steering head angle not the outer tube welded in the frame and yes this can be at a different angle to the outer part of the frame look at a ducati RS set up....

or even look at a 996 etc 23.5.24.5 rotate insert 180 degrees to adjust as std, meaning the steering head tube is angled differently to the outer part of the frame. Or get a parallel insert to make it 24 degrees..thats inline with the outer part of the frame.
 
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It's almost like a company who has access to endless amount of information should be trusted more than a random on the internet.
 
SuperDomestique said:
bagger is making this assumption unless this has been documented by Ducati. No offense, but I’d trust Ducati’s info over speculation despite how much incorrect stuff that they do. I’d also be wary of determining a measurement from what was stamped into the headstock bushes. This could refer to some angle other than rake. Rake and trail could also stay the same and Pani but the SF needs different headstock bushes because the swingarm/pivot/gearing/etc are different between the 2 bikes. Therefore, it needs different bushes to get it back to the 24.5°/100 trail.

The only way to get a true geometry would to literally do the measurements on your own. Also, all this stock geometry goes out the window when you sit on the bike and sag and weight and all kinds of factors get introduced to the system.
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I would agree that ultimately it needs to be measured with the sag included. I think it would behoove all to do some basic calculations so you can understand the actual change in geometry versus ride height changes at either end. I went thru and considered what Ducati would have to do to the rest of the bike to tilt the head 2 degrees such that they'd have to add offset bushes to return it to 24.5. (and then why would you mark them 26.5?). Ultimately to change the head angle 2 degrees the SA pivot would need to be raised about an inch. The SA pivot height is what you're moving to achieve a rake change when you change rear ride height.
 
baggerman said:
I would agree that ultimately it needs to be measured with the sag included. I think it would behoove all to do some basic calculations so you can understand the actual change in geometry versus ride height changes at either end. I went thru and considered what Ducati would have to do to the rest of the bike to tilt the head 2 degrees such that they'd have to add offset bushes to return it to 24.5. (and then why would you mark them 26.5?). Ultimately to change the head angle 2 degrees the SA pivot would need to be raised about an inch. The SA pivot height is what you're moving to achieve a rake change when you change rear ride height.
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SF forks are 5 mm shorter than Panigale (at least V4S). Did you account for wheelbase and swingarm length?
 
It's the movement of the SA pivot that matters. When the rear is raised the SA pivot moves up. The triangle you need to consider is the one defined by the line between the SA pivot and the front axle centerlines. The fork length axle centerline to the top of the triples defines the next line and from the top of the triples to the SA pivot defines the last. The 5mm shorter tubes would drop the front a little but nowhere near a 2 degree change. I'll measure my bike when I reassemble with the changed pivots but I'm probably a month plus out. I would greatly appreciate if you have access to a Pani if you could measure the center to center length of a Pani swingarm as the Pani and SF have different part numbers (the casting is actually different). This may be caused by a change in length, torsional rigidity or maybe the shock mount. I get the SF to be about 24.5 inch center to center. I was going to buy Stevens SA but the check I sent took a walk about (I think Steven's maid threw it out by mistake). Since changing the head to 26.5 degrees would lengthen the wheelbase the SF SA may be the same length but if the Pani SA is significantly shorter I will probably change it. Thanks.
 
Measured my bikes swingarm lengths end to end as center to center would be impossible without disassembly.

'21 SF - 710mm
'22 P - 690mm

Wasn't measured with a vernier caliper but it's as near as 20mm difference in length.

Official website indicates the SF wheelbase is 1488mm, P V4 is 1469mm... 19mm. This is inline with my measurements if the difference in wheelbase is solely attributed to the difference in swingarm lengths.
 
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Alkhater said:
Measured my bikes swingarm lengths end to end as center to center would be impossible without disassembly.

'21 SF - 710mm
'22 P - 690mm

Wasn't measured with a vernier caliper but it's as near as 20mm difference in length.

Official website indicates the SF wheelbase is 1488mm, P V4 is 1469mm... 19mm. This is inline with my measurements if the difference in wheelbase is solely attributed to the difference in swingarm lengths.
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Thanks. Now I'm totally confused as a 2 degree change at the head also makes the wheelbase longer.

andyb said:
EBay here SF SA circa £750👍
Pierobon I bet is around £2500-3000 plus the wait and import tax!
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It sound likes I'll be going to a Pani SA. All reporting parts seem to be the same except one of the SA pivots. So, if you're interested I'll sell you mine for the same amount I pay for the Pani one. Steven wanted $750 for his Pani one. Shipping may be the issue.

SuperDomestique said:
How is this even relevant to the original topic?
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Totally relevant as were talking about trying to get the SF's to turn like a Pani.
 
Money no object or top end performance on a pani v4 a longer swing arm is the way to go … so within the original thread topic seeking a better performance, why would you sacrifice the benefit the longer SF Swing arm would provide and change it as has been suggested ….
 
Alkhater said:
Measured my bikes swingarm lengths end to end as center to center would be impossible without disassembly.

'21 SF - 710mm
'22 P - 690mm

Wasn't measured with a vernier caliper but it's as near as 20mm difference in length.

Official website indicates the SF wheelbase is 1488mm, P V4 is 1469mm... 19mm. This is inline with my measurements if the difference in wheelbase is solely attributed to the difference in swingarm lengths.
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Would you mind actually measuring your SF's wheelbase as mine is apart. Thanks.
 
baggerman said:
Thanks. Now I'm totally confused as a 2 degree change at the head also makes the wheelbase longer.


It sound likes I'll be going to a Pani SA. All reporting parts seem to be the same except one of the SA pivots. So, if you're interested I'll sell you mine for the same amount I pay for the Pani one. Steven wanted $750 for his Pani one. Shipping may be the issue.



Totally relevant as were talking about trying to get the SF's to turn like a pani
Click to expand...
The SF SA is 20 mm longer than a panigale👍
 
baggerman said:
Thanks. Now I'm totally confused as a 2 degree change at the head also makes the wheelbase longer.


It sound likes I'll be going to a Pani SA. All reporting parts seem to be the same except one of the SA pivots. So, if you're interested I'll sell you mine for the same amount I pay for the Pani one. Steven wanted $750 for his Pani one. Shipping may be the issue.



Totally relevant as were talking about trying to get the SF's to turn like a Pani.
Click to expand...

Wouldn’t going to a Panigale swingarm decrease ride height (due to it being shorter) and therefore increase rake make the steering more slack and slow?
 
andyb said:
Money no object or top end performance on a pani v4 a longer swing arm is the way to go … so within the original thread topic seeking a better performance, why would you sacrifice the benefit the longer SF Swing arm would provide and change it as has been suggested ….
Click to expand...
I want it shorter and steeper so it'll turn harder. More length means more lean angle so less corner speed.
 
Again, why didn’t you just buy a Panigale and put risers on it??? Your life would be so much easier. It’s like you’re turning the SF into a pretzel just to get geometry that is stock on another bike.

As for you go-getters thinking of swapping swingarms. Good luck with that. It’s like you don’t think that Ducati would’ve thought of this. Minimizing sku’s and consolidating parts would be one of the biggest factors why they would want share parts. But they don’t. And I’m sure there are plenty of reasons why they don’t.
 
The streetfighter set up achieved one thing, the panigale set up achieved another.

The thing is if you had been around Ducati’s long enough obviously with the correct engineering acumen, you would have already experienced or experimented with a variety of items that will swap over from model to model To improve on the original spec!

1198 motor into a 996-999
1098 swing arm linear rocker and TTX shock
into a 748-998 frame
Wide track yikes and forks into a 748-999

It goes on and on
 
andyb said:
The streetfighter set up achieved one thing, the panigale set up achieved another.

The thing is if you had been around Ducati’s long enough obviously with the correct engineering acumen, you would have already experienced or experimented with a variety of items that will swap over from model to model To improve on the original spec!

1198 motor into a 996-999
1098 swing arm linear rocker and TTX shock
into a 748-998 frame
Wide track yikes and forks into a 748-999

It goes on and on
Click to expand...

You have an engineering degree now?!>?!>!
 

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