So.... 15/41.. Is there a new map?? ...or Not??

Ducati Forum

Help Support Ducati Forum:

WAfatboy said:
Ye DNA, DUK, and Oz are sending different letters at different times. The email I received (not a letter) talked about the sprocket and map (end of Feb) but my dealer knows nothing as of last week. Email below (note we weren't offered a discount on the sprocket)

----------------------------------

Dear ,

Your 1199 Panigale has, as well as winning your trust, won an impressive number of prizes in 2012 for its style, technology and incredible performance, making us extraordinarily proud.

In line with tradition, the development and updating of such a prestigious model never ends; we're excited ahead of the upcoming sporting season that will see the 1199 Panigale debut in the Superbike championship and renew its efforts in the Superstock championship, where the differences between your bike and the race bike are truly minimal.

This development work, which is consolidated with the launch of the 1199 Panigale R, has allowed us to obtain a series of solutions that we are pleased to make available to you from the end of February, to give you - as we do with every Ducati rider - important updates to help you make the most of the best twin sport bike of all time.

We have developed solutions to ensure an increase in mid-range power, in particular:

- a new electronic engine mapping, which also optimizes the Quick Shift system
- the chance to use a Z41 rear sprocket, to shorten the final ratio.
These innovations mean that you can experience even better performance, when riding on the track, from the Ducati Performance exhaust that you have already bought or will decide to install.

And that's not all: if you want we will fit your 1199 Panigale, free of charge, with a new heat shield on the vertical cylinder and exhaust system, to improve comfort especially in hot weather and during daily use.

We're sure that these touches will be appreciated by those, like you, that have chosen a product that is absolutely at the top of its line. We hope to meet you soon at one of the many events that bring the Ducati family together.

The Ducati Team
Click to expand...

I recieved this by email on 9th Feb 2013
 
The same questions/informtion being provided, the same answers being given - its the forum way, and not unlike the movie Ground Hog Day... (I'm a poet, and didnt even know it, hope I dont blow it) :D
 
Brad said:
Yep, it gets confusing alright.
I think inconsistant flow of information to dealers and customers is combined with differing interpretations is the problem.
Rest assured it will be all good in the long run.
It's a bit like a pizza.
Sometimes it takes longer for the same thing you always get, and there is a fair bit of variation in how it turns out. And sometimes there's shouting and abuse with lots of arm waving from within the kitchen.
But it's still all good:):)
It's the Italian way, and i personally wouldn't have it any other way as long as i live.

The information i have provided thus far has been extracted from a letter i have in PDF on my computer which is from DNA to their dealer network in the US.

It is quite detailed and is 5 pages long. They say that the ECU upgrade is a warranty item that is dated to be effective from 4/12/2012 and is from TSB-12-005. There is nothing else other than the software update number.
It is stated to be siutable for both the 41 tooth and 39 tooth sprocket.
This to me is very conclusive, and has no ambiguity about it;)

I got my notification by email from Italy on 9th Feb 2012.
Either way it doesn't worry me in the slightest as mine is running nearly perfect with the ECU upgrade as it stands.
I really can't get over the stir and confusion it is causing:)
It's extraordinary.

Regards,
brad
Click to expand...

You are missing the information on page 2 of the same document:

Please be informed that the 41-tooth rear sprocket, the corresponding drive chain and the specific ECU
software will be available from the end of March at a discounted price. For further details please refer
to the Service Bulletin that will be released by the end of March.

The specific software they are referring to seems to be different than the one associated with TSB-12-005.
 
xpercad said:
You are missing the information on page 2 of the same document:

Please be informed that the 41-tooth rear sprocket, the corresponding drive chain and the specific ECU
software will be available from the end of March at a discounted price. For further details please refer
to the Service Bulletin that will be released by the end of March.

The specific software they are referring to seems to be different than the one associated with TSB-12-005.
Click to expand...

Yes i see where you are coming from:(
Not only page 2 but there is reference to specific ECU software on page 1 as well.
You may be quite correct in coming to that conclusion.
If it is so, then it will certainly be an add on cost along with the sprocket change due to the fact that it is optional.

However there is no mention of it in the summary table on page 4?
My question is this. Why would they need specific software for the 41T sprocket?
Software changes have never been needed before to run accessory DP sprockets.
I think the reference to it will be proven to be a typo.
I suppose we will see in a few weeks.

Regards,
Brad
 
Brad said:
My question is this. Why would they need specific software for the 41T sprocket?
Software changes have never been needed before to run accessory DP sprockets.
Click to expand...

I don't know how specific for the 41T sprocket the software would be. But software can always be optimized and bugs can be corrected. For instance, think about all the "dash" random issues which sometimes correct themselves and then appear again: turn signals not working, not being able to change the TRIP displays, etc. Maybe Ducati will correct these and others and it is a good time to do it.

If software changes have never been needed before to run accessory DP sprockets, it doesn't mean it can't be optimized. The effort involved in developing and testing new or changed software is huge. There has to be a very good reason ($$$) to do it, in this case it must be customer satisfaction, and of course sales.

Technically speaking, the ECU can easily determine the front sprocket - rear sprocket ratio. For this it doesn't have to know how many teeth in each sprocket. Once the ratio has been determined, fuelling, ignition timing and other parameters could be adjusted and optimized depending on the ratio.

Of course this is all speculation, although Jarel has posted in this thread (post #26) that they (Ducati Dealers) were told specifically that there will be a NEW map available to take full advantage of the 41t rear sprocket.

As you say, we will see in a few weeks.

Cheers
 
My dealer just confirmed me they have a new map available, they just got it from Italy
 
As I said before:

The new map is already at some dealers (mine) and available to load. It is bulit into their regular software updates, he didn't tell me the number, but he has it.

It takes advantage of the faster reving caused by the 41T, but will supposedly work fine with the 39T if you have the dealer intstall the 41T, don't like it, and have it removed, you can leave the map on.

Since this is an optional change (unlike the heat shield), there is a cost to install the 41T:
Map: Is free if you pay to have the sprocket installed. It is $30 if you just want it, or you bought/have your own 41T.
Chain $121
Sprocket - not available yet.

He recommends staying with the last map unless you are experiencing problems. My bike is running fne, not sure I will update just to update.

Lastly - this is my dealer only, what he says now, and has now. Other dealers may vary. I would wait (I know you won't) until your personal dealer has all this in stock, and stop specualting this and that.
 
Last edited:
It seems there's different opinions on this and like in the past it seems that dealers are not consistent in their responses or knowledge.

I'm not saying which one is correct or incorrect, but simply reading the letter i received, a map is mentioned (which is provided for free which addresses quick-shifter improvements (and potentially others)) separately from the gearing change (available at a discount).

It was also mentioned that the gearing improvements are available on the R and are made available to us so i would assume the software change if any would be available already.

Regardless of the assumption above, if the gearing change needs a map update as well then so be it and would leave it to the dealer if and when i choose to upgrade. It is also possible that a dealer may not have been completely updated until the upgrades are ready and available for installation.
 
What I jsut discovered, the map is free if you pay to have the Ducati supplied sproket/chain installed. i.e., you buy the chain and sprocket (approx 250 total), pay your dealer to install, then the map is free. If you just want it without all that, it is $30 (my dealer's price). But if you do all this, don't like the 41 and have it taken off, you can leave the map on, as it is fine for the 39T.
 
Ok i think i've got it now:)

There is definately a new map for the 41T sprocket which also works for the 39T sprocket.

The old new map from TSB-12-005 dated 4/12/2012 is only suited to the 39T sprocket.

I was looking at it from the wrong angle all along:eek:

I now suspect the 41T update map has been a product of the developement of the 1199R which comes standard with the 41T sprocket.
If that is the case, then it looks like DUCATI have been doing their homework again.

It would be interesting to see a back to back comparison dyno run on the same bike between the 39T specific map with the 39T sprocket and the new 41T map with the 39T sprocket?

So that would potentially make lots of maps which are current including the termi maps.
1 map for a 39T 1199S/1199 + a termi map for slip on, and 1 for full system
1 map for a 39T/41T 1199S/1199 + a termi map for slip on, and 1 for full system
1 map for a 41T 1199R with full system

If that is the case then it would seem DUCATI have been busy working in the background:):)

Regards,
Brad
 
Last edited:
Ok... so..... we are clear... there is a new 41T map that isn't the November '12 map we all have by now?? Right???
 
Stw said:
Ok... so..... we are clear... there is a new 41T map that isn't the November '12 map we all have by now?? Right???
Click to expand...

Looks like it STW. There does indeed seem as though there's a specific 41T map.

The fog is clearing:)

Regards,
Brad
 
don't these maps have software version numbers or reference numbers that we can point to? Perhaps it's difficult to "discover" but wouldn't that make it easier to keep this all straight?
 
All dealers get the same maps, via the only method available to receive maps, which is through the update function on our DDS systems. So unless a dealer has failed to update their DDS, they (we) always have the most current maps, and those maps are automatically downloaded into any bike that we plug in to the DDS. It's not like a Power Commander where the technician specifies which map they want to load from a choice of available maps. The technician has no control over which map is loaded, the DDS automatically detects the appropriate current map to load based upon the bike that is plugged in.
 
Brad said:
Ok i think i've got it now:)

There is definately a new map for the 41T sprocket which also works for the 39T sprocket.

The old new map from TSB-12-005 dated 4/12/2012 is only suited to the 39T sprocket.

I was looking at it from the wrong angle all along:eek:

I now suspect the 41T update map has been a product of the developement of the 1199R which comes standard with the 41T sprocket.
If that is the case, then it looks like DUCATI have been doing their homework again.

It would be interesting to see a back to back comparison dyno run on the same bike between the 39T specific map with the 39T sprocket and the new 41T map with the 39T sprocket?

So that would potentially make lots of maps which are current including the termi maps.
1 map for a 39T 1199S/1199 + a termi map for slip on, and 1 for full system
1 map for a 39T/41T 1199S/1199 + a termi map for slip on, and 1 for full system
1 map for a 41T 1199R with full system

If that is the case then it would seem DUCATI have been busy working in the background:):)

Regards,
Brad
Click to expand...

Just to be clear, no specific map for the slip-ons, just for the full Termis.

Which when used, totally out perform the AR by 25% to 30% percent.
 
Trauma said:
Just to be clear, no specific map for the slip-ons, just for the full Termis.

Which when used, totally out perform the AR by 25% to 30% percent.
Click to expand...

Atthe risk of being flamed - Anyone got a dyno chart to show this?
 
Trauma said:
Just to be clear, no specific map for the slip-ons, just for the full Termis.

Which when used, totally out perform the AR by 25% to 30% percent.
Click to expand...

Hi Trauma,

If there is only 1 map for the Slip-ons and the Full Termis then it must be a compromise on the fueling requirements between the 2 systems? Or does it favour the Full system and not be an issue for the engines running the Slip-ons?
What is the AR?
In what way does the Full Termi map "out perform" the AR?

Thanks,
Brad
 
Brad said:
Hi Trauma,

If there is only 1 map for the Slip-ons and the Full Termis then it must be a compromise on the fueling requirements between the 2 systems? Or does it favour the Full system and not be an issue for the engines running the Slip-ons?
What is the AR?
In what way does the Full Termi map "out perform" the AR?

Thanks,
Brad
Click to expand...


Hi Brad
We know that there are separate maps for Termi full system and for just slip ons only. That is specified in our original manual.

BTW did someone mention a heat problem.
 

Similar threads

K
Dead Up Map Key?
Replies
2
Views
555
Ktse
K
L
Clarification needed for Akrapovic Dealer Map
Replies
3
Views
238
Hooch33
H
FlyingDucatiMonster
New to Forum - 2024 Panigale V4R
Replies
0
Views
127
FlyingDucatiMonster
FlyingDucatiMonster
K
Termi Exhaust and Up Map
Replies
1
Views
852
Seth Vo
Seth Vo
N
best up map for arrow slip on
Replies
1
Views
386
Flyingstefano
Flyingstefano

Register CTA

Register on Ducati Forum! This sidebar will go away, and you will see fewer ads.

Recent Discussions

Back
Top