Tickets in the mail.. Never stopped. Ever happen to you?

White13Pani · Jan 22, 2015

Okay, so Ive been holding off posting about this for some time but I must vent because I'm about ready to lose my ....... .....

Back in October, a cop sent me a ticket (well, two tickets) in the mail.
ticket 1- reckless driving- 5 points, potential jail, very bad .... in the commie state of NJ.
ticket 2- obstructed plate $60 fine, no points, no big deal.

BUT, I was never stopped. These events are alleged to occur on a sunday.
Cop actually wrote tickets up online the day after, Monday then sent them in the mail and I got them that Tuesday.

Several issues arise here- there was absolutely no identification made- you can in no way shape or form prove its me underneath what i would assume the rider was wearing- whether it be leathers, jeans, full face helmet, whatever the case is.

So, I went to the first court appearance, pled not guilty. Plain and simple I'm not paying $500 for the ticket, nor another $500-$2,000 for an attorney to downplay offenses I'm not guilty of, because it is my position that I wasn't riding (I work sundays) so simply i have NO idea WTF the cop is even talking about.

2nd appearance comes I was a little late so the prick judge issues a $500 warrant. I immediately pay the bail and get my date to come back.

3rd appearance comes I finally talk to the prosecutor and tell her i have no idea what this is and will accept nothing but them dropping these nonsense Probable cause lacking/illegal tickets. she tells me the cop isnt there so i have to come back one more time. I freak out and tell her this is the third day of work i'm missing. she doesnt care, (duh pigs nor the judges or prosecutor care about you they just want your money).

4th appearance comes today. I go. Guess whos not there? The cop. So... is the cop sent to jail for failing to show up? Nope. Is the case thrown out? Nope. You guessed it, judge tells me i have to come back again. Tells me the cop is teaching at the academy. I tell him i do not care. i tell him im missing five days of work now, as all judges he doesnt give two ...... he tells me what i'm accused of. I tell him once again WHERE IS YOUR PROBABLE CAUSE I WAS EVEN DRIVING? He proceeds to ignore me and tell me if the cop doesnt show up on visit 5 it will be dismissed. Rudely, I told him "i doubt that, because the prosecutor told me that last time, so i wont hold my breath." turned away and pushed open the door to leave after being yelled at by the bailiff. I ask for my bail back he refuses and tells me come again.

facts: yes i in fact was a ......... on this 4th visit. friendly me is gone and not coming back. I am sick of coming to this ....... courtroom. S I C K.
I am not guilty of any moving violation or anything. I will not plead of give another $500+ to a ........ attorney to prove i have done nothing wrong. I already had to pay $500 6 months ago when some pre-pubescent ...... from the MIddletown NJ police department wrote me a moving violation saying i ran a redlight when i went through a green light and he was 500+ feet down the side road. in no way could he even see the light. Just another illegal traffic stop. that time i kept my cool, paid a plea bargain, but not this time. I'm not sure if I will be able to compose myself come the 5th visit but I know i need to.

Soooo... I'm just curious have any of you gotten motorcycle tickets in the mail? Specifically for such a serious infraction? Whether its related or not, this is the same cop who investigated my friends accident in which he passed about two weeks earlier. I had called this guy asking the status of the investigation and he cursed me off the phone saying he cant talk to me, but then a week later i have these tickets in the mail...

Additionally, please dont comment on my opinion of the law. I don't know all the facts of how the system works, I may have a few things twisted, I'm just a bit heated. Boss is even starting to get on my ... now. This has been a pattern in my life. Calmest rider in the group and I'm always the one pulled over. But hey, such is life, I accept it.
endrant.

b9009b · Jan 22, 2015

In pa and most other states if the cop doesnt show too any dates it dropped immediately. Sorry to hear this dude. But they have to show you proof by federal law. Ill find the statute and email it to yiu to take.

Thamer · Jan 22, 2015

I ....... hate New Jersey! It should have been dropped the First time. Sorry to hear of your woes with the ...... judicial system in the little ......, ...... state of New Jersey.

White13Pani · Jan 22, 2015

Thamer said:
I ....... hate New Jersey! It should have been dropped the First time. Sorry to hear of your woes with the ...... judicial system in the little ......, ...... state of New Jersey.

Thank you for the sympathy. Yes, this state is a .... .... .... .........
I was truly perplexed when the judge said come back. I made sure to reiterate nice and loud for the court crowd that an innocent man has to come back and miss a fifth day of work. Bulllshit.

cmh210 · Jan 22, 2015

You can be sent tickets in the mail, but they still require probable cause. Most likely he saw you or somebody else riding while off duty and somehow wrote down your license plate number for the tickets. When you do get to court, you will want to get the cop to positively identify you were the person he saw doing what he thought was reckless. Obviously he wont be able to because of helmet and leathers. Also, check the traffic code and see what defnines reckless. And how far away was he when he saw "you". And your always able to bring and question your own witnesses who saw you at work.

BAIBAICOP · Jan 22, 2015

Whatever you do for a living will be cheaper cost of living in a less ...... up state. Even WA (CA north) has no income tax. Oh, and you can have suppressed short-barreled rifles here. Time to GTFO of NJ!

White13Pani · Jan 22, 2015

BAIBAICOP said:
Whatever you do for a living will be cheaper cost of living in a less ...... up state. Even WA (CA north) has no income tax. Oh, and you can have suppressed short-barreled rifles here. Time to GTFO of NJ!

Possession of a silencer or SBR would net you 15 years in NJ. One day my good friend. One day.

Only state that could take months just to get a rifle permit.

Can not wait to leave for numerous reasons. Me being a second amendment lover is definitely one of them.

White13Pani · Jan 22, 2015

cmh210 said:
You can be sent tickets in the mail, but they still require probable cause. Most likely he saw you or somebody else riding while off duty and somehow wrote down your license plate number for the tickets. When you do get to court, you will want to get the cop to positively identify you were the person he saw doing what he thought was reckless. Obviously he wont be able to because of helmet and leathers. Also, check the traffic code and see what defnines reckless. And how far away was he when he saw "you". And your always able to bring and question your own witnesses who saw you at work.

Thanks for the input (y)

Ive never once im my life ridden on public roads in a manner that would fall under such a serious category as reckless driving so that trumps me even more.

NOLA · Jan 22, 2015

White13Pani said:
Possession of a silencer or SBR would net you 15 years in NJ. One day my good friend. One day.

Only state that could take months just to get a rifle permit.

Can not wait to leave for numerous reasons. Me being a second amendment lover is definitely one of them.

15 years, haha"¦.right dude.

NOLA

cmh210 · Jan 22, 2015

Always glad to help. And I also forgot one thing. Request a jury trial. They tend to be more leniant than a judge.

kensteele · Jan 22, 2015

should have gotten a lawyer right away on day 1. everybody knows the avg citizen can't fight the state esp in places like nj. sorry to hear about your problems but you should still get a lawyer and make it all go away.

maybe one day, karma will help you get it all back when to move to another state....like here, where the police don't harass you like that or where i already have 2 sbrs and an sbs that both the chief and the sheriff signed off on without hesitation.

bp7178 · Jan 22, 2015

Back in October, a cop sent me a ticket (well, two tickets) in the mail.
ticket 1- reckless driving- 5 points, potential jail, very bad .... in the commie state of NJ.
ticket 2- obstructed plate $60 fine, no points, no big deal.

BUT, I was never stopped. These events are alleged to occur on a sunday.
Cop actually wrote tickets up online the day after, Monday then sent them in the mail and I got them that Tuesday.

Several issues arise here- there was absolutely no identification made- you can in no way shape or form prove its me underneath what i would assume the rider was wearing- whether it be leathers, jeans, full face helmet, whatever the case is.

They might not have to prove it was you that was driving, only you that owned and is the responsible party for the vehicle.

Laws vary wildly across jurisdictions. That is why it is always advisable to hire an attorney. As much as you think that you know, someone who actually works in the field knows volumes more.

In many cases if a ticket is issued to the registered owner, the fine may be levied but not the points.

Just because a sentence is authorized by statute, ie jail time for littering or reckless driving, doesn't mean...by a long shot...that anyone actually does time, outside of guys that miss court and get picked up on bench warrants over and over and over, only to plead guilty and get time served, after they did 6 months 24 hours at a time.

We've had good dealing on the forums, so please take this sage advice. You don't know .... about traffic law. Get a lawyer. A lawyer could have swacked all this down to a parking violation and saved you infinite amounts of headache. Look back on it, how much would you have paid NOT to go through that BS.

Think of it like a license to drive however you want. Its going to cost, sometimes. But, the amount of headache a lawyer can save you is immense.

bradp51 · Jan 22, 2015

White13Pani said:
Okay, so Ive been holding off posting about this for some time but I must vent because I'm about ready to lose my ....... .....

Back in October, a cop sent me a ticket (well, two tickets) in the mail.
ticket 1- reckless driving- 5 points, potential jail, very bad .... in the commie state of NJ.
ticket 2- obstructed plate $60 fine, no points, no big deal.

BUT, I was never stopped. These events are alleged to occur on a sunday.
Cop actually wrote tickets up online the day after, Monday then sent them in the mail and I got them that Tuesday.

Several issues arise here- there was absolutely no identification made- you can in no way shape or form prove its me underneath what i would assume the rider was wearing- whether it be leathers, jeans, full face helmet, whatever the case is.

So, I went to the first court appearance, pled not guilty. Plain and simple I'm not paying $500 for the ticket, nor another $500-$2,000 for an attorney to downplay offenses I'm not guilty of, because it is my position that I wasn't riding (I work sundays) so simply i have NO idea WTF the cop is even talking about.

2nd appearance comes I was a little late so the prick judge issues a $500 warrant. I immediately pay the bail and get my date to come back.

3rd appearance comes I finally talk to the prosecutor and tell her i have no idea what this is and will accept nothing but them dropping these nonsense Probable cause lacking/illegal tickets. she tells me the cop isnt there so i have to come back one more time. I freak out and tell her this is the third day of work i'm missing. she doesnt care, (duh pigs nor the judges or prosecutor care about you they just want your money).

4th appearance comes today. I go. Guess whos not there? The cop. So... is the cop sent to jail for failing to show up? Nope. Is the case thrown out? Nope. You guessed it, judge tells me i have to come back again. Tells me the cop is teaching at the academy. I tell him i do not care. i tell him im missing five days of work now, as all judges he doesnt give two ...... he tells me what i'm accused of. I tell him once again WHERE IS YOUR PROBABLE CAUSE I WAS EVEN DRIVING? He proceeds to ignore me and tell me if the cop doesnt show up on visit 5 it will be dismissed. Rudely, I told him "i doubt that, because the prosecutor told me that last time, so i wont hold my breath." turned away and pushed open the door to leave after being yelled at by the bailiff. I ask for my bail back he refuses and tells me come again.

facts: yes i in fact was a ......... on this 4th visit. friendly me is gone and not coming back. I am sick of coming to this ....... courtroom. S I C K.
I am not guilty of any moving violation or anything. I will not plead of give another $500+ to a ........ attorney to prove i have done nothing wrong. I already had to pay $500 6 months ago when some pre-pubescent ...... from the MIddletown NJ police department wrote me a moving violation saying i ran a redlight when i went through a green light and he was 500+ feet down the side road. in no way could he even see the light. Just another illegal traffic stop. that time i kept my cool, paid a plea bargain, but not this time. I'm not sure if I will be able to compose myself come the 5th visit but I know i need to.

Soooo... I'm just curious have any of you gotten motorcycle tickets in the mail? Specifically for such a serious infraction? Whether its related or not, this is the same cop who investigated my friends accident in which he passed about two weeks earlier. I had called this guy asking the status of the investigation and he cursed me off the phone saying he cant talk to me, but then a week later i have these tickets in the mail...

Additionally, please dont comment on my opinion of the law. I don't know all the facts of how the system works, I may have a few things twisted, I'm just a bit heated. Boss is even starting to get on my ... now. This has been a pattern in my life. Calmest rider in the group and I'm always the one pulled over. But hey, such is life, I accept it.
endrant.

I can tell you for a fact that if the prosecution witness (police in this case) do not front for court at a hearing date then the magistrate will dismiss the matter straight away and may award court costs to the defendant.

That is what would happen in New South Wales Australia.

In addition to that with out some evidence of driver or rider then there is no prima facie evidence to even issue a ticket. You guys have a strange system. Here only parking tickets can get sent by mail to the owner, (without ID of driver) the registered owner is liable for the fine or must nominate who the driver was.

bp7178 · Jan 22, 2015

bradp51 said:
I can tell you for a fact that if the prosecution witness (police in this case) do not front for court at a hearing date then the magistrate will dismiss the matter straight away and may award court costs to the defendant.

That is what would happen in New South Wales Australia.

Why would that matter? He is in New Jersey.

Its this whole different place...

JHTmcrider · Jan 22, 2015

Yea, real bummer about how NJ State Law might conflict with laws regarding speeding and identification around the world.

I can empathize with the OP. Getting a ticket in the mail or having cops show up at your house several days later to try and serve a summons is pretty crazy stuff.

Like many other have said and shown, when stuff like that happens its time to lawyer up!

My ex recently was road blocked by cops in Teller County Colorado for allegedly passing a car in a double yellow zone.

Obviously, that claim was made by an angry driver who was possibly driving in a dangerous fashion. Cops attempted to extract a plea agreement on the spot. Ex said hell no! Not guilty. No proof only a person who wasn't a LEO made the claim.

Message boards in CO lit up with finger pointing and some support much like here. She is fighting it, and will hopefully win against a DA who holds all the power.

The point was made that the local DA is the one who holds the power here, and unless you are connected, you better have had gotten a lawyer who specializes in either criminal or traffic law in New Jersey.

I would recommend moving if you can after this is over. Best of luck!

AntiHero · Jan 22, 2015

Nice that the cops don't have even notify the court when they can't show up. If I was you, I'd bring an attorney in for your next visit. It might cost you a few hundred bucks, but it could also save you a hell of a lot. At the very least, consult one and find out what you need to say. Don't lose your temper, though...stay calm and reasonable. The more aggressive you get the more aggressive they'll get and you'll just end up ...... (doesn't take much to spend 30 days in jail for contempt).

I've received a couple tickets in the mail, but the best one was when my girlfriend (ex)received a ticket for parking in a bus zone ($350). Knowing her, I figured she just spaced out and parked half way in the zone....after teasing her about it she checks her calendar and says, "hey, that's the day you had my car!" Well I hadn't parked in a bus zone....and after searching my brain for clues I realized that was the day I flipped off a meter maid who was giving out .... tickets in SF. After three court dates, my case was dismissed. The meter maid was guilty of perjury, but probably didn't even get a scolding.

bradp51 · Jan 22, 2015

bp7178 said:
Why would that matter? He is in New Jersey.

Its this whole different place...

You are right it does not matter. I was only pointing out the difference in the process of the different jurisdictions/countries.

I am sure you are not confused. Perhaps just being a smart ....

White13Pani · Jan 23, 2015

AntiHero said:
Nice that the cops don't have even notify the court when they can't show up. If I was you, I'd bring an attorney in for your next visit. It might cost you a few hundred bucks, but it could also save you a hell of a lot. At the very least, consult one and find out what you need to say. Don't lose your temper, though...stay calm and reasonable. The more aggressive you get the more aggressive they'll get and you'll just end up ...... (doesn't take much to spend 30 days in jail for contempt).

I've received a couple tickets in the mail, but the best one was when my girlfriend (ex)received a ticket for parking in a bus zone ($350). Knowing her, I figured she just spaced out and parked half way in the zone....after teasing her about it she checks her calendar and says, "hey, that's the day you had my car!" Well I hadn't parked in a bus zone....and after searching my brain for clues I realized that was the day I flipped off a meter maid who was giving out .... tickets in SF. After three court dates, my case was dismissed. The meter maid was guilty of perjury, but probably didn't even get a scolding.

Yep. He was subpoenad for two cases. Me and another young driver who has already been there 2-3 times with his attorney so honestly even having an attorney wouldn't have sped this up. This court is a joke. The lawyers face for the other guy when he was told he has to come back was stunned. That lawyer was pissed but just took it. I refused and told the robe draped ...... how I felt.
I miss court accidentaly im thrown in jail. Cop misses court for two cases intentionally and the state adjourns the matter all while this scumbag goes free and merrily collects his $110,000+ Salary where he gets to just skip court when he feels, while I'm about to lose mine because of this.

The law is simple here. The state can not and will not prove to identify me here.
Sadly, most of the guys here are right- it doesn't matter. In nj the judges and prosecutors make their own version of the law up as they go. Tis a very scary state to have to step into a courtroom. Look the wrong way and these judges somehow are given so much power they can throw you in lockup without any cause and deny you the right to due process of law. Very scary.

Thanks for the input. I figured you were among the top of the miles list on the forum and therefore mayve experienced this before.

icucar · Jan 23, 2015

White13Pani said:
it is my position that I wasn't riding (I work sundays) so simply i have NO idea WTF the cop is even talking about.

If this is true, simply bring in your time sheet as proof that of your alibi and without a possitive identification you are off the hook.

bp7178 · Jan 23, 2015

bradp51 said:
You are right it does not matter. I was only pointing out the difference in the process of the different jurisdictions/countries.

I am sure you are not confused. Perhaps just being a smart ....

Yes.

I'm being a smart ... now as well.

<--- Another non genuine use of a smiley.

icucar said:
If this is true, simply bring in your time sheet as proof that of your alibi and without a possitive identification you are off the hook.

Assuming they depend on that.

Tickets in the mail.. Never stopped. Ever happen to you?

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