V4R

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Just an observation.

In 2018 last year for the 99 (F-18) at Aragon the fastest Ducati and race winner was Melandri. His lap time was 1’51.048.

In 2021Aragon the fastest Ducati was Redding. Fastest lap time was 1’50.504. Difference of .544.

Now to a Wsbk racer that difference over 25 laps is huge provided the difference was consistent. To me and everyone else on this board, the difference would be absolutely zero. To anyone other than a world championship caliber rider the performance difference between the 2018 F-18 1199 and the 2021F-21 V4 is absolutely zero and that’s with 3 years of development.

If you like the twin, get the 99 if you like the four cylinder get the V4 but don’t fool yourself thinking the V4 is more capable. Prepped correctly either platform will out deliver anyone on this forum. Now maybe for you the V4 is more confidence inspiring. Maybe you like the electronics etc. Thats about the bike and what your bike has from a setup perspective. That’s why I put the caveat in there “prepped correctly”.

Different riders are going to be faster, smoother and more confident on one platform or another but in general from a professional perspective it’s obvious both bikes can be set up to be extremely competitive with each other.

Overall for 3 years of development, higher costs, more electronic gremlins and more electronic doo-dads I don’t need, more weight, and a larger bike, the V4 made zero sense for me. The new V2, even less sense.
 
Last edited:
The V4 is a design evolution.

There's a Jay Leno quote from his YouTube channel where he says "The last days of old technology are better than the first days of new technology." I agree completely.

The xx99 platform was the very developed end but Ducati had to move on to keep reaching higher.

Eventually, the desmo valve thing will follow, probably not soon but its going to happen.

MaverickiB said:
I guess the one thing to point out is the V4R absolutely did walk away from things during the beginning of it's racing career. WSBK had to lower its rev limit to make it "fair" because Bautista was obliterating Rea. HSBK was forced to add like 25lbs to their V4R racebike back when PJ was on it because MotoAmerica thought it was too unfair.
Click to expand...

So how do you get to the V4 being a failure per your previous post when later you fluff it up?
 
bp_SFV4 said:
The V4 is a design evolution.

There's a Jay Leno quote from his YouTube channel where he says "The last days of old technology are better than the first days of new technology." I agree completely.

The xx99 platform was the very developed end but Ducati had to move on to keep reaching higher.

Eventually, the desmo valve thing will follow, probably not soon but its going to happen.



So how do you get to the V4 being a failure per your previous post when later you fluff it up?
Click to expand...
Agreed. Like I said I think it’s a great bike but there are a bunch of great 4 cylinders. The V4 will be 4 years into development in a few months so it’s not exactly new and the other manufacturers have been able to hold their own and in some cases pass the Duc in development I guess time will tell. Again sticking with the 99, I don’t have to think about what’s around the corner. My next venture in 2 wheeled motorcycle will be electric.
 
Ducati reaching higher? How is that look at the results in BSB, SBK or Moto America top 3 at best last 3 seasons so I would sum that up as failure.


bp_SFV4 said:
The V4 is a design evolution.

There's a Jay Leno quote from his YouTube channel where he says "The last days of old technology are better than the first days of new technology." I agree completely.

The xx99 platform was the very developed end but Ducati had to move on to keep reaching higher.

Eventually, the desmo valve thing will follow, probably not soon but its going to happen.



So how do you get to the V4 being a failure per your previous post when later you fluff it up?
Click to expand...
 
This is a stupid conversation. A full 80% of the board is about bolting on .... that looks pretty but makes zero difference except in the owners head.
Get whatever you like, but sooner or later someone on some other brand is going to ride around the outside- who cares? No one is having more fun than the guy on the 99
 
I was disappointed with my V4R when I got it, after years in IL4s, I was looking forward to the character of my old 1098. Sure, it has the rattly clutch, but the engine couldn't be any less 'Ducati' in it's character. It is unbelievably smooth, and more linear than the ubiquitous sewing machine. Absolutely a better engine than the 1098, technically. But, being technically better, doesn't always align with people. Flaws (or character) appeal to a lot of people. Expensive watches are coveted by many, and often out performed (more accurate, zero maintenance) by a very cheap bottom of the range Casio. I know which I prefer, and I accept that my Swiss watch needs adjusting daily and can't be trusted.
If I wanted a bike for connection (heart to bike), I believe the twins are very hard to beat.
For performance around a track, once setup perfection is attained, the V4R is one of the best bikes available. It is 100% faster down a straight than any other litre bike, and you can setup all the big bikes to corner the same.
Cost wise, they all cost about the same. Yes, the V4R is £35k+ mods (wheels, suspension, ECU flash, exhaust, fairings). But everyone racing a CBR or S1000 are in for approx the same money. On the CBR, if you change a sprocket size, it throws the electronics out and goes into limp mode. You have to have the kit ECU, dash and loom (£8k). Similar story on the BMW. At least the V4R and CBR come with stock suspension you could race, the quality is acceptable, whilst not being excellent. The BMW M1000 comes with the same suspension as the base bike, it is wholly unsuitable for track/race use.
Some people suit the twins better than the fours (Chaz Davies?), each to their own...

...but remember, those 1970's Porches, are MUCH more enjoyable to drive than anything newer.
 
RickD996 said:
I was disappointed with my V4R when I got it, after years in IL4s, I was looking forward to the character of my old 1098. Sure, it has the rattly clutch, but the engine couldn't be any less 'Ducati' in it's character. It is unbelievably smooth, and more linear than the ubiquitous sewing machine. Absolutely a better engine than the 1098, technically. But, being technically better, doesn't always align with people. Flaws (or character) appeal to a lot of people. Expensive watches are coveted by many, and often out performed (more accurate, zero maintenance) by a very cheap bottom of the range Casio. I know which I prefer, and I accept that my Swiss watch needs adjusting daily and can't be trusted.
If I wanted a bike for connection (heart to bike), I believe the twins are very hard to beat.
For performance around a track, once setup perfection is attained, the V4R is one of the best bikes available. It is 100% faster down a straight than any other litre bike, and you can setup all the big bikes to corner the same.
Cost wise, they all cost about the same. Yes, the V4R is £35k+ mods (wheels, suspension, ECU flash, exhaust, fairings). But everyone racing a CBR or S1000 are in for approx the same money. On the CBR, if you change a sprocket size, it throws the electronics out and goes into limp mode. You have to have the kit ECU, dash and loom (£8k). Similar story on the BMW. At least the V4R and CBR come with stock suspension you could race, the quality is acceptable, whilst not being excellent. The BMW M1000 comes with the same suspension as the base bike, it is wholly unsuitable for track/race use.
Some people suit the twins better than the fours (Chaz Davies?), each to their own...

...but remember, those 1970's Porches, are MUCH more enjoyable to drive than anything newer.
Click to expand...
Good write up. Not nearly as proficient as you from a riders perspective but I did like the sewing machine comment. All the tech going into moving vehicles is on the electric side. It is outpacing combustion engines by a huge margin and while it’s not there yet, it will be. Looking at the 220 hp Parker motor that is the size of a toaster. Fricken amazing. No radiator, no gas tank, no exhaust, closed frontal aerodynamics, infinitely tunable electronics and engine control.

You want smooth, give it a couple of years. You will have an electric bike that makes the V4 looked parked going down the straight away. I can wait. Until then, I’ll enjoy the rickety old 99 tech.
 
Paul G said:
This is a stupid conversation. A full 80% of the board is about bolting on .... that looks pretty but makes zero difference except in the owners head.
Get whatever you like, but sooner or later someone on some other brand is going to ride around the outside- who cares? No one is having more fun than the guy on the 99
Click to expand...




Idk man the new fireblade pretty fun lmfaoo jk.
endodoc said:
Good write up. Not nearly as proficient as you from a riders perspective but I did like the sewing machine comment. All the tech going into moving vehicles is on the electric side. It is outpacing combustion engines by a huge margin and while it’s not there yet, it will be. Looking at the 220 hp Parker motor that is the size of a toaster. Fricken amazing. No radiator, no gas tank, no exhaust, closed frontal aerodynamics, infinitely tunable electronics and engine control.

You want smooth, give it a couple of years. You will have an electric bike that makes the V4 looked parked going down the straight away. I can wait. Until then, I’ll enjoy the rickety old 99 tech.
Click to expand...


Bro I’m still waiting on you to send pics For RS parts
 
endodoc said:
Good write up. Not nearly as proficient as you from a riders perspective but I did like the sewing machine comment. All the tech going into moving vehicles is on the electric side. It is outpacing combustion engines by a huge margin and while it’s not there yet, it will be. Looking at the 220 hp Parker motor that is the size of a toaster. Fricken amazing. No radiator, no gas tank, no exhaust, closed frontal aerodynamics, infinitely tunable electronics and engine control.

You want smooth, give it a couple of years. You will have an electric bike that makes the V4 looked parked going down the straight away. I can wait. Until then, I’ll enjoy the rickety old 99 tech.
Click to expand...

agreed…I’ve built a lot of cars over the years, peaking with the 1100 whp Porsche that I’ll eventually take up to 1500 whp before I call her done, this is the first bike I’ve modded/built out…both will be my last great petrol builds in all likelihood.

the grocery getter Plaid ‘wife’s’ car is just about as fast as my 1100 whp Porsche that took a year to build and $120k just in mods on top of the car price, and the Tesla grocery getter is as fast for about a 3rd of the overall cost of my car.

the only sad thing is that guys like me and you who had a bad bad case of the mod bug will have to get a new hobby unless we take up battery development and programming lol…not much room for modding the electric stuff so far….though my guess is finding ways to make them lighter will be all that’s left of the aftermarket industry eventually.
 
endodoc said:
Good write up. Not nearly as proficient as you from a riders perspective but I did like the sewing machine comment. All the tech going into moving vehicles is on the electric side. It is outpacing combustion engines by a huge margin and while it’s not there yet, it will be. Looking at the 220 hp Parker motor that is the size of a toaster. Fricken amazing. No radiator, no gas tank, no exhaust, closed frontal aerodynamics, infinitely tunable electronics and engine control.

You want smooth, give it a couple of years. You will have an electric bike that makes the V4 looked parked going down the straight away. I can wait. Until then, I’ll enjoy the rickety old 99 tech.
Click to expand...

I commute on an Energica Ego and it is wild being able to pull a consistent 3 second 0-60 from every stop sign with no effort. It is crazy smooth and unbeatable in the 60-90mph speed regime because that's where it lays down all 150ft/lb torque it has to offer. You can be cruising at 60 and whack the throttle open, only to look down and instantly be going 90 like the bike just activated a warp drive.

Crazy smooth ride and the perfect commuter, but...

I'm getting rid of it. For the same reasons some people prefer the twin Ducatis. It has zero character. There is nothing special about it. You turn the throttle and it goes. No quirks, no excitement, it's just a boring machine. Once you get used to the ball busting acceleration and realize that's all the bike has to offer, it's super boring.

So I'm likely getting a Moto Guzzi as a commuter because I've realized I want something that's gonna feel like a motorcycle, and most new bikes are feeling less and less like motorcycles as technology progresses.
 
Mick1976 said:
Your way off on the numbers man a Motec package for a 99 would run about $8-10k that's including the tuning support.
Click to expand...

https://www.superbikeunlimited.com/...le-v4-v4-r-v4-s-superbike-electronics-package
I thought we were talking about the V4R. It starts at $17,105 and goes to $22,402 fully optioned. I guess half as much for half the number of cylinders. Hilarious.

On your post where you wrote that the V4R had to be neutered.

MaverickiB said:
I guess the one thing to point out is the V4R absolutely did walk away from things during the beginning of it's racing career. WSBK had to lower its rev limit to make it "fair" because Bautista was obliterating Rea. HSBK was forced to add like 25lbs to their V4R racebike back when PJ was on it because MotoAmerica thought it was too unfair.
Click to expand...

So WSBK had to limit its rev range and add weight to make things fair but the V4R is a failure?
 
bp_SFV4 said:
https://www.superbikeunlimited.com/...le-v4-v4-r-v4-s-superbike-electronics-package
I thought we were talking about the V4R. It starts at $17,105 and goes to $22,402 fully optioned. I guess half as much for half the number of cylinders. Hilarious.

On your post where you wrote that the V4R had to be neutered.



So WSBK had to limit its rev range and add weight to make things fair but the V4R is a failure?
Click to expand...

I think you might be thinking of the wrong person, or I just have amnesia. I don't recall saying the V4R is a failure.
 
Yeah, Mick is the guy who said the V4 is a failure and the $17-22k electronics package should come standard.
 

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