Your desires for future roadgoing Ducatis

I'd like to see the tank and side fairings redesigned so it's easier for your knees to interface with the bike and lock in a bit better. I'm always slipping forward under hard braking even with tank grips when I'm in my one piece. A few tweaks should easily fix that.

Really want to see bikes specced better in the future.
I just want a simple, light bike with great suspension and some light wheels.

The only bike that meets that criteria is the new R and when it comes to the new R over the S what are you getting for your money other than different engine and new engine internals? A lithium ion battery, a paint job and a titanium exhuast? None of that justifys the extra cost, here that's $10,000.00 over the S and $18,000.00 over the base (ohlins, forged wheels, a lithium ion and an Akrapovic system at retail only costs like $10,000.00). I know it's a Ducati and they've never been about value but for a lot of extra money over the base and S, I'd like to see where you're money has actually gone. Rearsets, carbon wheels and paddock stands would at least make you feel like you're getting something other than a letter on the side for the extra money? Because I feel like I'm being shafted.

It would be nice to see a V4 motor in a traditional Ducati L configuration but I'd rather more efforts being put into further reducing the weight of the bike than more top end power. The bike has plenty of power, all it needs is the motor to be refined and the mid range stronger and more linear.

Next bike has to have the traction control tied into the IMU and make use of the lean angle sensors and cruise control.

Panigale 1399 !!

I can wish,right?

Chris

I would like to see an updated sport tourer like the old ST models

Just updated with ABS DQS etc

Like someone said to compete with the new R1200Rs

bradp51 said:

I would like to see an updated sport tourer like the old ST models

Just updated with ABS DQS etc

Like someone said to compete with the new R1200Rs

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+1

but keep it simple for the old folks

sexparty said:

I'd like to see the tank and side fairings redesigned so it's easier for your knees to interface with the bike and lock in a bit better. I'm always slipping forward under hard braking even with tank grips when I'm in my one piece. A few tweaks should easily fix that.

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+1 on this, plus a general call for more adjustable ergos across the board, as one size definitely does not fit all. If even a lowly Gixxer can come with adjustable pegs, there's no excuse for it on a Ducati. KTM really set the bar here with the RC8's adjustability; bars, pegs, seat/subframe position, etc. Wouldn't take much to accomplish or add much to build cost.

With the pani scratching my itch for extreme power and speed I'd be down for a bike that satisfies my desire for extreme efficiency.

I'm talking about a scooter. *gasps*
No more than 150cc
Around 70 mpg
70-75 mph top speed
Comfortable ergos
Maybe retro modern style (modern attemps to make a scooter look cool fail, they just look bazaar and alien)
Throw in a bucket load of Italian charisma (sound, feel, handling, sssa) and I'd vote with my wallet.

After thinking about the original question.......

What I would like/want and in keeping with current technology trends would be a touchscreen TFT/Dash system, and really this is more than do-able with current tech. Instead of clunking through menus, especially the DES, with the buttons on the handle bars.

With the above could come an app for phones/iphones/tablets that wirelessly ties in to the DDA system so you can talk to the bike on track days without dicking around with computers and plugging-in/unplugging modules, blah, blah, blah..........downloading..........zzzzzzzzzzzzz. The app could easily show throttle position, braking, gears, GPS timing/tracking, speeds, lean angles etc. Again, all possible, I imagine quite simply with the base already there for it.

The other thing would be mirrors. Just get shot of them, you can't see squat in them anyway. Again as with the above, with improvements to the TFT screen, make it wider and have two rear facing cameras in the farings at strategic points to give you near on the same view the mirrors would of displayed at the sides of the screen. Prettier and funtional..........

MR DUCATI, ARE YOU LISTENING?!?!?

What I would like: headlights and brake lights that can be very easily removed. Crash protectors that are supplied and have ready-made mounting points. Yamaha R1M seems to have got this right. I mean, it can't be that bad, can it?

And camera mounts. Two camera mount points would be great.

OK got some more time to look this over. Like I said before great stuff so far, it's clear that you guys are really putting some thought into this. To further the discussion let me play "devil's advocate" a bit and offer up responses to some of the suggestions. Not to criticize, just to stimulate.

First of all, seems like lots of desire for a V4. Message received, loud and clear. It's an expensive engine layout, is it worth the cost?

b9009b, Kevin1199 - 899R, are we talking component upgrade, or whole-hog R with a different motor? Price would be an issue, do you see an 899 with sus brakes wheels and a few other bits selling at the same price as the standard 1299? Or a hot-motor version selling for even more?

Charliem90, roadster - I share love for the supermono concept but keeping it low cost is tough. New engine development is expensive, and generally you have to make the rest of the bike very lightweight (also expensive) to make the 70-ish horsepower of a strong single, fun and brand consistent (high performance). Track only could be a way around that but the market for a bare bones track-only single costing as the 899 with half the hp may be prohibitively limited.

Avidmoto - I think the aforementioned brand consistency is a strong argument against a Ducati Grom. Do others disagree?

shakazulu12 - now that would be something to drool over! right there with you!

Buliwyf - interesting analysis. How do you see hipster Monster positioning different than Scrambler?

Kevin1199 - it would be a riot, but cost the same as the Pani. A dedicated few, like you, would buy it. But the question is do you have enough like-minded friends...

HarmonyJim - I think that with horsepower now above 200 more and more experienced riders will find themselves sharing your thoughts

ruley - Hyper SP! the extra 21cc won't bother her

jyli19 - I'd buy one too

wilkson - I'll call Febur, they're just down the road

reganc, bjorgens, BTrain5489 - very very interesting.

Duck41 - I would love that too, the issue is keeping cost reasonable. Unfortunately smaller displacement doesn't mean lower dev't costs, especially with a new engine format (single). Components like Ohlins and SSSA would guarantee you couldn't set a cost that most would consider accessible to a beginner enthusiast.

Steve B - what displacement would you see a new ST needing to be to compete with the R1200RS? Bare bones equipment simple and light, or fully-stocked techno wonder? Agree with you on the ergos

Phl - ok so Kevin has at least one like-minded soul

sexparty - not following you, Hyper SP totally meets simple light great sus and wheels brief. As for the R cost, the engine doesn't justify it but rearsets wheels and paddock stands would? Please explain because believe me it'd help margins to substitute the R's engine with the nicest paddock stands you've ever seen

bradp51 - same questions as for Steve B, what's your ideal sport tourer spec

bikenamenumber - woah. don't even know if I should touch that one In all honesty it's a better idea than many give it credit for. Production limitations is something people tend not to consider though. Scooter construction is completely different than motorcycles, and requires different assembly lines and procedures. Anyway, what would it offer over that classic Italian icon, the Vespa?

Mutt1979 - so much is possible with electronics. On the cameras, did you know Terblanche's original concept that became the MH900e had one instead of mirrors?

TJ99 said:

ruley - Hyper SP! the extra 21cc won't bother her

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we've been looking at the hyperstrada....hyperstrada SP!!

she's done the naked bike thing....didn't like it, more fairing protection required for the kms we like doing from time to time

TJ99 said:

b9009b, Kevin1199 - 899R, are we talking component upgrade, or whole-hog R with a different motor? Price would be an issue, do you see an 899 with sus brakes wheels and a few other bits selling at the same price as the standard 1299? Or a hot-motor version selling for even more?

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Hey TJ.


Take the 899 as it sits and add Mag wheels, full nix30 and ttxgp ohlins and a few other trick bits(some ti engine parts) and make it a right out the box package for insane street riding and track/race fun. That could all be had for around $17.5-18k USD ish lol.

Oh and also as Kev said 1199SF omg I'm drooling. I'd buy it. Make one version. $22k with ohlins shock and marz/bpf forks s/r wheels and boom instant badass

Phl said:

A next Streetfighter with 200+ HP

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@TJ99 did you get that too?

TJ99 said:

Duck41 - I would love that too, the issue is keeping cost reasonable. Unfortunately smaller displacement doesn't mean lower dev't costs, especially with a new engine format (single). Components like Ohlins and SSSA would guarantee you couldn't set a cost that most would consider accessible to a beginner enthusiast.

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I'd say keep the SSSA (... appeal), ditch the Ohlins for an acceptable second option (many will likely switch out suspension components anyway), hit the other performance targets (class-leading lightweight, power, etc.), and hit an MSRP of $8k. The entry bike segment is begging for an upscale variant, and this would likely provide an excellent opportunity to pull young riders into the Ducati brand. If done right, the development costs should pale in comparison to long term profits, particularly when these entry riders begin trading their way up through the Ducati lineup.

What are your thoughts regarding the feasibility of implementing forced induction into other models?

Now to play into the other half..... A v4 is appealing... But a Ducati has soul, they all do and that's what draws me to it. I picked up a 1299S today and let me say... Well done sir, this thing is an absolute animal, yet on the street it is a better bike than the 1199..... Credit to you and your coworkers, I do understand the problems of a big SF, cost being a big factor and the dedicated few who would be willing to take that plunge...

b9009b said:

Hey TJ.


Take the 899 as it sits and add Mag wheels, full nix30 and ttxgp ohlins and a few other trick bits(some ti engine parts) and make it a right out the box package for insane street riding and track/race fun. That could all be had for around $17.5-18k USD ish lol.

Oh and also as Kev said 1199SF omg I'm drooling. I'd buy it. Make one version. $22k with ohlins shock and marz/bpf forks s/r wheels and boom instant badass

Click to expand...

Mag wheels top shelf Ohlins and trick engine parts for an additional $2.5-3k over base price is way too optimistic. How many would be interested in the 899 you describe at an equal or higher price to a standard 1299?

Phl said:

@TJ99 did you get that too?

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Yes I know there are a few of you nutters out there

Duck41 said:

I'd say keep the SSSA (... appeal), ditch the Ohlins for an acceptable second option (many will likely switch out suspension components anyway), hit the other performance targets (class-leading lightweight, power, etc.), and hit an MSRP of $8k. The entry bike segment is begging for an upscale variant, and this would likely provide an excellent opportunity to pull young riders into the Ducati brand. If done right, the development costs should pale in comparison to long term profits, particularly when these entry riders begin trading their way up through the Ducati lineup.

What are your thoughts regarding the feasibility of implementing forced induction into other models?

Click to expand...

I think $8k is unrealistic, that's $3k lower than the Monster 821, but I agree that there is a market opportunity for a premium "entry" sportbike.

Forced induction is an interesting question. In some general hardware trends the bike industry follows autos, in others it does not. Turbos have become ubiquitous in high performance car engines out of necessity, but even in the areas bikes tend to follow autos, there is usually a significant time lag. In my personal opinion the widespread implementation of forced induction (driven by necessity) is highly dependent upon the rate at which other potentially more attractive technologies mature and become increasingly viable for motorcycles, the obvious example being electrics.

TJ99 said:

First of all, seems like lots of desire for a V4. Message received, loud and clear. It's an expensive engine layout, is it worth the cost?

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Aprilia did it. Many people would love a proper V4 sportbike. Honda has been rumored to be making one for years, but nothing concrete yet. And I don't expect to see it soon, and when I do, I expect to not be able to afford it.

To me a V4 is truly a "racing" engine layout - even going back to the 500 days most of those 2 strokes were V4s. I think Ducati could make a stonking fast V4, in a package similar in weight to the Panigale, and sell quite a lot of them.

TJ99 said:

Mag wheels top shelf Ohlins and trick engine parts for an additional $2.5-3k over base price is way too optimistic. How many would be interested in the 899 you describe at an equal or higher price to a standard 1299?

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I would be all over it if its the same price as a base 1299 and i know it would save Jarel alot of time too lol. It would be a dedicated track bike for me.

TJ99 said:

Charliem90, roadster - I share love for the supermono concept but keeping it low cost is tough. New engine development is expensive, and generally you have to make the rest of the bike very lightweight (also expensive) to make the 70-ish horsepower of a strong single, fun and brand consistent (high performance). Track only could be a way around that but the market for a bare bones track-only single costing as the 899 with half the hp may be prohibitively limited.

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Send your engineers to KTM. They seem to have figured it out with the RC390. And @ $5500 they've sold out the allotment for the US this year I understand. And rumors are rife that Triumph (Triumph!) are going to be entering the market next year with a sport single.
KTM getting 45hp with that $5.5. You'd think Ducati engineers could get another 15-20 hp in a motor for another $10k-$15k @ retail - given they already have a prototype (Supermono) to work with.
The shame of it - KTM giving lessons to Ducati.