1299S Swingarm Pivot on 1199S

crazybat · Jul 27, 2015

Just wondering if it is possible to change my 1199S swingarm pivot to a fixed -4 just like 1299S has?
I think I don't need the adjustable pivot like R version has. But -4 is the value I want to try...

Any ideas which parts are needed to be replaced?

Phl · Jul 27, 2015

Great idea! Keep us posted on the progress!

bp7178 · Jul 27, 2015

All of the relevant parts between the 1299S and 1199S look the same, except the 1299S swingarm has a different part number. The difference could be in the geometry of the arm.

I posted all of the part numbers needed to convert to a 1199R adjustable swingarm. I don't know if the expense and effort would justify the result.

On a side note...the plumbing to the charcoal canister changed with a valve being added on the vacuum line...interesting.

crazybat · Jul 30, 2015

Exactly what I found on the spare parts manual...
Look like the swingarm itself is the key on 1299S...

Any suggestion that if go 24 degree steering bush without -4mm on the swingarm? will it be very unstable ?

bp7178 said:
All of the relevant parts between the 1299S and 1199S look the same, except the 1299S swingarm has a different part number. The difference could be in the geometry of the arm.

I posted all of the part numbers needed to convert to a 1199R adjustable swingarm. I don't know if the expense and effort would justify the result.

On a side note...the plumbing to the charcoal canister changed with a valve being added on the vacuum line...interesting.

pedrin · Jul 30, 2015

I did that, nota problem with the ohlins steering damper. So that you know, according to d. Moss the effect is the same as lowering the front

Marmoot · Jul 30, 2015

Doesn't 1299 have a slightly steeper rake and slightly longer swingarm to give it that extra agility, better swingarm angle, and maintain wheelbase length?
Or maybe I am just imagining things...

wilkson · Jul 30, 2015

The head angle goes from 24.5 to 24 degrees the swingarm remains the same length but 4 mm lower .

Steve B · Jul 31, 2015

bp7178 said:
All of the relevant parts between the 1299S and 1199S look the same, except the 1299S swingarm has a different part number. The difference could be in the geometry of the arm.

I posted all of the part numbers needed to convert to a 1199R adjustable swingarm. I don't know if the expense and effort would justify the result.

Definitely different part numbers for the left/right holders from my 1199 versus the 1299, but without an eccentric of some sort at the front pivot bolts like the R, I'm sure they're getting the '4mm drop with different engine cases anyway. The swingarm arm geometry wouldn't matter, since the relevant bit for swingarm geometry is the line between the front/rear swingarm axle centers relative to the countershaft sprocket. With non-offset pivot bolts like the original 1199 and the new 1299, they go straight through the holder and into the engine case. The only ways to drop the front center point of the swingarm 4mm relative to the countershaft are an eccentric, new cases with relocated swingarm mounting points (my guess, as the new cases have a start date of 15/1/15, while most of the related parts go back to 2011), or rotating the whole engine backwards significantly, which of course hasn't happened.

So if you want to go -4, it's an adjustable setup from an R or else a 1299. You can get some of the effect by reducing your rear ride height, and get back the front geometry by raising the forks in the clamps, or else changing to the 24 degree steering head insert.

bp7178 · Jul 31, 2015

I think you need to analyze what problem you're trying to fix.

At some point you'd be better off to sell your bike and buy a 1299S.

crazybat · Aug 2, 2015

bp7178 said:
I think you need to analyze what problem you're trying to fix.

At some point you'd be better off to sell your bike and buy a 1299S.

I think I may consider to go the "adjustable pivot"....
For me, I would consider to sell my bike for the next whole new generation of Ducati superbike.....1299S is like a facelift for me....

Thanks for the advise

kope999R · Aug 2, 2015

wilkson said:
The head angle goes from 24.5 to 24 degrees the swingarm remains the same length but 4 mm lower .

i had that done on mine and i see it as quit an improvement... seems to quiten down the bike, more stable under braking, steering sharper, flipping easier, keeping a tighter line... it dropped 2 seconds off at Valencia...

pedrin · Aug 7, 2015

Steve B said:
So if you want to go -4, it's an adjustable setup from an R or else a 1299. You can get some of the effect by reducing your rear ride height, and get back the front geometry by raising the forks in the clamps, or else changing to the 24 degree steering head insert.

Good point, what is the difference between the -4 swingarm and just lowering the rear? which of the two would be more efficient in helping the bike keep the line during corner exit?

Steve B · Aug 8, 2015

pedrin said:
Good point, what is the difference between the -4 swingarm and just lowering the rear? which of the two would be more efficient in helping the bike keep the line during corner exit?

Well, the adjustable pivot lets you play with the anti-squat geometry alone and more effectively without messing with the overall chassis geometry. You still can, of course, but for other reasons. If you lower the rear for that reason, it lowers the overall CG and puts more weight on the back tire, which you may or may not want, plus it slows down the steering geometry a bit. You can compensate up front by lowering the front to match, but then you end up lower overall, which again you may or may not want. That's where mine is at the moment (about -6mm at the front and -8mm at the back). Best bet would be to go with the adjustable pivot and the new steering head insert, but it's worth playing with it as is to see how it responds for you. Easy to do and undo.

c0untry011 · Jul 10, 2019

does anyone have part numbers for this for a 2013 1199S to add the adjustable swing arm pivot?

Nathanhu · Jul 11, 2019

1 75610332AA outer eccentric LH 1 47.12
3 75610321AA Eccentric LH 1 7.07
4 75610312AA Inner Eccentric LH 1 26.80
7 75610301BA Eccentric sleeve RH 1 69.21
21 86050051A Eccentric Pins LH 2 4.95
22 7715445BZ Swingarm bolts 2 3.43
23 71114631BA RH Engine mount 1 36.52
24 71114641BA LH engine mount 1 36.52

plus 1 or 2 swing arm Bearings-70250451A

i just did my 1199 and didnt use the 1199r side plates, i just made sure the eccentric ws in the 6 oclock position.
works well.

elements018 · Jul 11, 2019

Nathanhu said:
1 75610332AA outer eccentric LH 1 47.12
3 75610321AA Eccentric LH 1 7.07
4 75610312AA Inner Eccentric LH 1 26.80
7 75610301BA Eccentric sleeve RH 1 69.21
21 86050051A Eccentric Pins LH 2 4.95
22 7715445BZ Swingarm bolts 2 3.43
23 71114631BA RH Engine mount 1 36.52
24 71114641BA LH engine mount 1 36.52

plus 1 or 2 swing arm Bearings-70250451A

i just did my 1199 and didnt use the 1199r side plates, i just made sure the eccentric ws in the 6 oclock position.
works well.

Was the install pretty straight forward? just replace all the parts you bought? Do you know of any guide online for the install?

Nathanhu · Jul 11, 2019

when you pull the swingarm it will be easy to see what pats need to be changed.
the left side ( gearchange) is just a new motor threaded insert and Eccentric axle.
the righ hand side ( rear brake pedal) you will have to knock out one bearing, inner or outer and fit the internal part number (4) and the drive pins each side of the Eccentric.

i have heard that the pn 75610301BA maybe not in stock at the moment so check availability on the set before ordering.

l did mine in about a hour once the exhaust was of and the bike was on a engine stand

crazybat · Jul 15, 2019

Forget to update the thread for a long time.
Here is what I found and did:

1. The difference between 1199 and 1299 is not the swingarm, it is the engine mount point for swingarm, the mount point is lowered by 4mm. (it is off center to the lower compared to 1199).

2. I ordered complete 1199R parts to complete the job, now happy with the -4mm setting.

HiSpeed48 · Jul 16, 2019

crazybat said:
Forget to update the thread for a long time.
Here is what I found and did:

1. The difference between 1199 and 1299 is not the swingarm, it is the engine mount point for swingarm, the mount point is lowered by 4mm. (it is off center to the lower compared to 1199).

2. I ordered complete 1199R parts to complete the job, now happy with the -4mm setting.

So you're saying that the difference is in the engine mounting points? Therefore the only way to get the 1299 pivot point onto an 1199 is to swap engines? (Or buy the 1199R parts)

This is a conversation that I've been wanting to do for awhile but the 1199R parts are pricey for a few pieces of metal. I'd rather put that money towards suspension.

c0untry011 · Jul 16, 2019

Thanks a ton guys for this update. No dealer is responding to me when I ask for parts and pricing.

1299S Swingarm Pivot on 1199S

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