Forsaken Motosports Linear rear link +22 v4

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Here is the feedback from Forsaken...

For the spring I'd say just a preload adjustment for now. We have customers close to us that were ok with just that, no spring change.

For valving the general rule is that now that the link is softer, the shock will compress more easily so the compression has to be a bit more closed, let's say 3 clicks. Along the same lines for rebound, the shock will not rebound as aggressively now so the rebound valving can be opened a bit, let's say 2 clicks.
Click to expand...
 
Thanks. That sounds a bit like an answer that someone might want to hear.
Wouldn't a preload change and increased compression to deal with effectively more force be a compromise compared to using a higher spring rate?
 
@cl955 for the mass market Ohlins spring rates are only available in 5 N/m increments. Adding a 1-2 mm of preload is a relatively small adjustment compared to a full spring rate. Compression/Rebound control the rate of oil flow through the valving.

  1. Linear Linkage: the shock absorber's compression or extension is directly proportional to the movement of the wheel. This means that as the wheel encounters bumps or obstacles, the force required to move the shock absorber remains relatively constant. A linear linkage can provide predictable and consistent damping characteristics, making it well-suited for general-purpose applications.
  2. Progressive Linkage: the force required to move the shock absorber increases as the wheel moves through its travel. This means that the shock absorber becomes stiffer or more resistant to movement as it compresses or extends further. Progressive linkages are designed to provide a softer initial response to small bumps and imperfections, allowing the suspension to be more compliant and comfortable. As the suspension further compresses due to larger impacts, the linkage becomes progressively stiffer, providing better support for handling and stability.
The main advantage of a progressive linkage is that it can offer both comfort and control. It allows for a softer ride during normal driving conditions while providing increased resistance to bottoming out during heavy impacts or aggressive driving.

In summary, the difference in force required to move the shock absorber between progressive and linear linkages lies in how the suspension responds to different levels of compression or extension. Progressive linkages provide a variable resistance that changes as the suspension travels, while linear linkages maintain a more consistent force requirement throughout the suspension's movement.
 
roadracerx said:
@cl955 for the mass market Ohlins spring rates are only available in 5 N/m increments. Adding a 1-2 mm of preload is a relatively small adjustment compared to a full spring rate. Compression/Rebound control the rate of oil flow through the valving.

  1. Linear Linkage: the shock absorber's compression or extension is directly proportional to the movement of the wheel. This means that as the wheel encounters bumps or obstacles, the force required to move the shock absorber remains relatively constant. A linear linkage can provide predictable and consistent damping characteristics, making it well-suited for general-purpose applications.
  2. Progressive Linkage: the force required to move the shock absorber increases as the wheel moves through its travel. This means that the shock absorber becomes stiffer or more resistant to movement as it compresses or extends further. Progressive linkages are designed to provide a softer initial response to small bumps and imperfections, allowing the suspension to be more compliant and comfortable. As the suspension further compresses due to larger impacts, the linkage becomes progressively stiffer, providing better support for handling and stability.
The main advantage of a progressive linkage is that it can offer both comfort and control. It allows for a softer ride during normal driving conditions while providing increased resistance to bottoming out during heavy impacts or aggressive driving.

In summary, the difference in force required to move the shock absorber between progressive and linear linkages lies in how the suspension responds to different levels of compression or extension. Progressive linkages provide a variable resistance that changes as the suspension travels, while linear linkages maintain a more consistent force requirement throughout the suspension's movement.
Click to expand...

Preload...doesn't effect spring rate.
 
roadracerx said:
@cl955 for the mass market Ohlins spring rates are only available in 5 N/m increments. Adding a 1-2 mm of preload is a relatively small adjustment compared to a full spring rate. Compression/Rebound control the rate of oil flow through the valving.

  1. Linear Linkage: the shock absorber's compression or extension is directly proportional to the movement of the wheel. This means that as the wheel encounters bumps or obstacles, the force required to move the shock absorber remains relatively constant. A linear linkage can provide predictable and consistent damping characteristics, making it well-suited for general-purpose applications.
  2. Progressive Linkage: the force required to move the shock absorber increases as the wheel moves through its travel. This means that the shock absorber becomes stiffer or more resistant to movement as it compresses or extends further. Progressive linkages are designed to provide a softer initial response to small bumps and imperfections, allowing the suspension to be more compliant and comfortable. As the suspension further compresses due to larger impacts, the linkage becomes progressively stiffer, providing better support for handling and stability.
The main advantage of a progressive linkage is that it can offer both comfort and control. It allows for a softer ride during normal driving conditions while providing increased resistance to bottoming out during heavy impacts or aggressive driving.

In summary, the difference in force required to move the shock absorber between progressive and linear linkages lies in how the suspension responds to different levels of compression or extension. Progressive linkages provide a variable resistance that changes as the suspension travels, while linear linkages maintain a more consistent force requirement throughout the suspension's movement.
Click to expand...

I get that. Have had the Forsaken Linkage for about 18 months and understand the benefits on track (not that I am quick enough to fully enjoy what it will bring in terms of edge grip).
My comment was based upon the response from Forsaken re springs and damping that even someone as simple as me can work out to be a bit of a compromise...
 
RickD996 said:
Preload...doesn't effect spring rate.
Click to expand...

@cl955 was asking a weird question "Wouldn't a preload change and increased compression to deal with effectively more force be a compromise compared to using a higher spring rate?"

Going up a spring rate is a BIG step if all that is required is a small change in preload. Never said preload affects spring rate.
 
roadracerx said:
The link arms p/n 37211983AA are the same for all V4 Streetfighter and Panigale models 2018-2022 as is the actual "triangle" linkage p/n: 37211971BA. You can check the parts diagrams on Ducati Omaha's website.

I HAVE installed one of these linkages on a customer's V4R which has an extended swingarm. Ohlins built a custom shock for the linkage and +30 mm Pieobon swingarm and changed the valving. I will have a look into what that change was.

I am curious about this same linkage on my 2023 V4R. I DO have that customer's bike in my garage right now so I guess I could try it and report back...
Click to expand...

Do it ;-) haha
 
roadracerx said:
The link arms p/n 37211983AA are the same for all V4 Streetfighter and Panigale models 2018-2022 as is the actual "triangle" linkage p/n: 37211971BA. You can check the parts diagrams on Ducati Omaha's website.
Click to expand...

Wrong … the link arm for 2018-20 models was longer and a different part

Also the 22 model is different again in length and part number!
roadracerx said:
I HAVE installed one of these linkages on a customer's V4R which has an extended swingarm. Ohlins built a custom shock for the linkage and +30 mm Pieobon swingarm and changed the valving. I will have a look into what that change was.

I am curious about this same linkage on my 2023 V4R. I DO have that customer's bike in my garage right now so I guess I could try it and report back...
Click to expand...
 
Are you guys talking about V4R or V4S part numbers? They may be different? i.e. maybe the V4S has different part numbers from one year to the next but the V4R doesn’t?

Dunno, I didn’t look.

Anecdotally on the Forsaken Linear Link versus the OEM link. I rarely ride the bike on the street anymore, but I noticed a difference on bumpy roads, the bike feels a bit harsher over bumps with the linear link versus the progressive link. At the track the Linear link makes the bike feel more predictable if not more planted. The linear link at least feels like a slide is more progressive, predicable and manageable than the progressive link. And I dunno if it’s because of the IMA eccentrics in the triple trees, or the extended swingarm, or the linear link, but I never get that pumping feeling from the back of the bike when accelerating hard off an apex…also no front end headshake that a lot of guys seem to have to deal with.
 
And the tie rods for 2018. -20 are 140 mm long and 2020 on are 135
The R started at 135 2019-20 but you say ALL are the same
The 22 base is a different length 🤔✊😉
Like you say sorry SHOUTED,do your research! Fook me I even wrote the part numbers on another thread..
 
Last edited:
I don't believe you @andyb

I actually went to the dealer and reviewed all the part numbers when I was trying to figure out why/how the 2023 V4R sits so much higher than all previous V4, so should we believe you or the actual Ducati parts fiche?
I also have a contact at Ducati Corse who told me the same thing. The tie rods and rocker are the same for all V4 Panigale, Superleggera and Streetfighter. The upper shock mount is unique to the R and Superleggera. The 2019 R has a different swingarm from all the others as does the Superleggera and the 2023 R swingarm is also different. The Streetfighter has a longer swingarm but I am not concerned with that model in the context of this conversation.

And I WILL YELL when someone comes out of the woodwork to tell me I am wrong when I know I am not. Go look up the part numbers at the dealer then you will see what I am talking about. I did not measure these parts directly, I trust Ducati knows how to manage their parts.
 
2018 parts NO 9
2018 rear.png

2020 Parts No 9

2019 rear.png

a simple sorry..... I am blind and got this wrong will suffice..............when you are an expert in a hole.stop digging!

As I have already said, and even the god like Rick also said in this thread, the 2018 was 140 long and the 2020 was 135, the same as the R.

2018 link Ducatiomaha 2018 Panigale V4

2020 link 2020 Ducati Panigale V4 OEM Parts Diagram Ducati Omaha

oh yeah, the lesson on finding the parts fiche is for free too.
 
roadracerx said:
I also have a contact at Ducati Corse who told me the same thing. The tie rods and rocker are the same for all V4 Panigale, Superleggera and Streetfighter.
Click to expand...
As Andy pointed out, that doesn’t seem to be entirely accurate.
 
roadracerx said:
The link arms p/n 37211983AA are the same for all V4 Streetfighter and Panigale models 2018-2022 as is the actual "triangle" linkage p/n: 37211971BA. You can check the parts diagrams on Ducati Omaha's website.

I HAVE installed one of these linkages on a customer's V4R which has an extended swingarm. Ohlins built a custom shock for the linkage and +30 mm Pieobon swingarm and changed the valving. I will have a look into what that change was.

I am curious about this same linkage on my 2023 V4R. I DO have that customer's bike in my garage right now so I guess I could try it and report back...
Click to expand...


Read your opening line DUDE!
 

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