Honda CBR1000RR-R SP 2024 vs V4R 2023

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so is the Panigale and many other bikes. than you just get a tune and thats it. based on the comment "and all the restrictions.." i thought there is more to it

I see a basic Upmap from Duc can be had very reasonably, and that allegedly resolves restrictions on my US Duc v4. As far as the Blade is concerned, has the stock ecu been cracked so it can be flashed wt a tune?
 
RoadracerX did a cool track test of the 2025 CBR back to back with the 2022 version…said lots of good things about the power delivery improvements and especially the new spool valve Ohlins stuff.

Oh very cool, where did he do that?
 
We had talked about changing the bike right away to the HRC race ECU and manual suspension. But after riding the new Spool Valve 3.0 Ohlins stuff he said “You’re gunna be very happy with it the way it is”.

He said at the pointy end of pace on the bike the Spool Valve suspension was “much smoother” and consistent and stable at speed. And I may not want to go the HRC Race route it was so good.

Also said the power delivery from 7k to 8k RPM was better because there was more torque at the bottom end and a smoother transition into the power band but the transition was still there and noticeable.

My take on it was that for track day riding the bike as-is was so good that there might not be a lot of real benefit to the HRC ECU and Manual Suspension…but at the very pointy end of performance HRC KIT and suspension are still needed.
 
We had talked about changing the bike right away to the HRC race ECU and manual suspension. But after riding the new Spool Valve 3.0 Ohlins stuff he said “You’re gunna be very happy with it the way it is”.

He said at the pointy end of pace on the bike the Spool Valve suspension was “much smoother” and consistent and stable at speed. And I may not want to go the HRC Race route it was so good.

Also said the power delivery from 7k to 8k RPM was better because there was more torque at the bottom end and a smoother transition into the power band but the transition was still there and noticeable.

My take on it was that for track day riding the bike as-is was so good that there might not be a lot of real benefit to the HRC ECU and Manual Suspension…but at the very pointy end of performance HRC KIT and suspension are still needed.

Exactly what I was hoping to hear.

Same suspension on the V4S of course.
 
We had talked about changing the bike right away to the HRC race ECU and manual suspension. But after riding the new Spool Valve 3.0 Ohlins stuff he said “You’re gunna be very happy with it the way it is”.

He said at the pointy end of pace on the bike the Spool Valve suspension was “much smoother” and consistent and stable at speed. And I may not want to go the HRC Race route it was so good.

Also said the power delivery from 7k to 8k RPM was better because there was more torque at the bottom end and a smoother transition into the power band but the transition was still there and noticeable.

My take on it was that for track day riding the bike as-is was so good that there might not be a lot of real benefit to the HRC ECU and Manual Suspension…but at the very pointy end of performance HRC KIT and suspension are still needed.

Stock and slicks goes a long way to getting a very fast laptime
 
We had talked about changing the bike right away to the HRC race ECU and manual suspension. But after riding the new Spool Valve 3.0 Ohlins stuff he said “You’re gunna be very happy with it the way it is”.

He said at the pointy end of pace on the bike the Spool Valve suspension was “much smoother” and consistent and stable at speed. And I may not want to go the HRC Race route it was so good.

Also said the power delivery from 7k to 8k RPM was better because there was more torque at the bottom end and a smoother transition into the power band but the transition was still there and noticeable.

My take on it was that for track day riding the bike as-is was so good that there might not be a lot of real benefit to the HRC ECU and Manual Suspension…but at the very pointy end of performance HRC KIT and suspension are still needed.

I can’t recall who said it, but Someone on this forum said something similar… Honda probably just needs to drop the front forks a couple mm to get to 99 mm trail and it’ll be perfect
 
I can’t recall who said it, but Someone on this forum said something similar… Honda probably just needs to drop the front forks a couple mm to get to 99 mm trail and it’ll be perfect

They are at 100mm trail already, and you don’t want to mess with that, they have arguably the best front end feel and turn in to exit of any bike on the market.
 
We had talked about changing the bike right away to the HRC race ECU and manual suspension. But after riding the new Spool Valve 3.0 Ohlins stuff he said “You’re gunna be very happy with it the way it is”.

He said at the pointy end of pace on the bike the Spool Valve suspension was “much smoother” and consistent and stable at speed. And I may not want to go the HRC Race route it was so good.

Also said the power delivery from 7k to 8k RPM was better because there was more torque at the bottom end and a smoother transition into the power band but the transition was still there and noticeable.

My take on it was that for track day riding the bike as-is was so good that there might not be a lot of real benefit to the ECU and Manual Suspension…but at the very pointy end of performance HRC KIT and suspension are still needed.
Some corrections......I said the transition from throttle pick up to the exhaust valve opening around 7k is smoother, it is less Jeckyl & Hyde like the previous model......most likley due to so ecu tuning and the shortened gearing (+1 rear sprocket).

The Spool Valve suspension IS smoother on small bumps at speed, by comparison the gen 2 suspension on the previous bike felt like it was trying to catch up and the new stuff just feels like it is working as you would expect it to.

The HRC ecu provides a lot of adjustability which makes sense for me but those interested in buying this 2025 RR-R will be surprised how good it is stock. With the Honda you can't really change the exhaust or gearing or tires beyond 120/70 and 200/60 slicks from Pirelli. If you want a full exhaust then HRC ecu will also eliminate the Spool Valve suspension and the ABS system. It's a all or nothing scenario. By contrast with Ducati, you can get an exhaust, data logger, etc that all work very well for 99% of the riders out there but it CANNOT really be tuned. Having gone through the nightmare of building a REAL tunable Ducati superstock bike which IS tunable like the Japanese kit ecus allow, I would not even think about making a Ducati any kind of REAL race bike. Sorry, I started rambling....
 
Some corrections......I said the transition from throttle pick up to the exhaust valve opening around 7k is smoother, it is less Jeckyl & Hyde like the previous model......most likley due to so ecu tuning and the shortened gearing (+1 rear sprocket).

The Spool Valve suspension IS smoother on small bumps at speed, by comparison the gen 2 suspension on the previous bike felt like it was trying to catch up and the new stuff just feels like it is working as you would expect it to.

The HRC ecu provides a lot of adjustability which makes sense for me but those interested in buying this 2025 RR-R will be surprised how good it is stock. With the Honda you can't really change the exhaust or gearing or tires beyond 120/70 and 200/60 slicks from Pirelli. If you want a full exhaust then HRC ecu will also eliminate the Spool Valve suspension and the ABS system. It's a all or nothing scenario. By contrast with Ducati, you can get an exhaust, data logger, etc that all work very well for 99% of the riders out there but it CANNOT really be tuned. Having gone through the nightmare of building a REAL tunable Ducati superstock bike which IS tunable like the Japanese kit ecus allow, I would not even think about making a Ducati any kind of REAL race bike. Sorry, I started rambling....

Thanks for that - very useful information.

It would be interesting to hear what you think of the new V4S in comparison if the opportunity arises.

In reality, I suspect either the S or SP are more than enough stock for the vast majority of track riders and you can't go wrong with either of them. The SP certainly seems a better value proposition though. Integration of data logging with the dash on the Ducati is nice. Exhaust options remain excessively priced.
 
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Some corrections......I said the transition from throttle pick up to the exhaust valve opening around 7k is smoother, it is less Jeckyl & Hyde like the previous model......most likley due to so ecu tuning and the shortened gearing (+1 rear sprocket).

The Spool Valve suspension IS smoother on small bumps at speed, by comparison the gen 2 suspension on the previous bike felt like it was trying to catch up and the new stuff just feels like it is working as you would expect it to.

The HRC ecu provides a lot of adjustability which makes sense for me but those interested in buying this 2025 RR-R will be surprised how good it is stock. With the Honda you can't really change the exhaust or gearing or tires beyond 120/70 and 200/60 slicks from Pirelli. If you want a full exhaust then HRC ecu will also eliminate the Spool Valve suspension and the ABS system. It's a all or nothing scenario. By contrast with Ducati, you can get an exhaust, data logger, etc that all work very well for 99% of the riders out there but it CANNOT really be tuned. Having gone through the nightmare of building a REAL tunable Ducati superstock bike which IS tunable like the Japanese kit ecus allow, I would not even think about making a Ducati any kind of REAL race bike. Sorry, I started rambling....

There is a route to go that’s not the all or nothing switch to the HRC ECU with manual suspension and exhaust.

I was looking more closely at the Moore Mafia tuning…he says he can provision the cat-less exhaust, removal of the evap air stuff, calibrate for a 125 tire, and remove the restrictions and get the power up.

The downside is you can’t re-adjust that stuff easily like with the HRC stuff, and you have to remove and send him your ECU. Kind of onerous but a route to having the spool valve suspension with unlocked restrictions, alt tire sizes, and exhaust setups etc.
 
Some corrections......I said the transition from throttle pick up to the exhaust valve opening around 7k is smoother, it is less Jeckyl & Hyde like the previous model......most likley due to so ecu tuning and the shortened gearing (+1 rear sprocket).

The Spool Valve suspension IS smoother on small bumps at speed, by comparison the gen 2 suspension on the previous bike felt like it was trying to catch up and the new stuff just feels like it is working as you would expect it to.

The HRC ecu provides a lot of adjustability which makes sense for me but those interested in buying this 2025 RR-R will be surprised how good it is stock. With the Honda you can't really change the exhaust or gearing or tires beyond 120/70 and 200/60 slicks from Pirelli. If you want a full exhaust then HRC ecu will also eliminate the Spool Valve suspension and the ABS system. It's a all or nothing scenario. By contrast with Ducati, you can get an exhaust, data logger, etc that all work very well for 99% of the riders out there but it CANNOT really be tuned. Having gone through the nightmare of building a REAL tunable Ducati superstock bike which IS tunable like the Japanese kit ecus allow, I would not even think about making a Ducati any kind of REAL race bike. Sorry, I started rambling....

How does the 25 RRR riding style compare to the 22-24 V4? Most interested in differences in front end feel and turn in.
 

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