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"The weekly median earnings for full-time wage or salary workers in the United States in the second quarter of 2021 amounted to $990. It translates to a yearly income of approximately $51,480. Any amount above that should theoretically be considered a good salary; however, it is not as easy as that. What is considered a good salary in one city may not be so in another. Other factors that determine a good salary are the type of job, level of education, and sadly, even gender and race."

You guys need to step back and think about what average means, and stop shitting on working people who drive your buses, clean your toilets and serve you groceries. On thing that Covid showed the world is the essential workers are not CEO's. Most of where you end up in life is down to luck, don't kid yourself its the hard work that you did all by yourself. I'm just glad everyday that I can play with my toys and look at a beautiful view and not have to work every again if I dont want too. I just got lucky and I know it.
 
Paul G said:
”… Most of where you end up in life is down to luck, don't kid yourself its the hard work that you did all by yourself…”
Click to expand...

Do you have data supporting the assertion that luck is the main determinant of success?

I ask because while it’s irrefutable that luck is a factor, I’m not sure it’s the main factor. Unless, of course, you’re referencing birth luck specifically (i.e. the good fortune to be born free of severe disability or illness to parents who are of similar health and reasonable interpersonal and occupational stability, and who impart to you a value system that isn’t overtly antisocial).

I’m no subject matter expert but my understanding of the evidence on the subject is that several factors intrinsic to the individual correlate more strongly to success than luck; they include conscientiousness, intelligence, the ability to forestall instant gratification, and the proportion of time a person spends being proactive (instead of reactive).

Additionally, there’s a durability to the intrinsic qualities above that is missing from luck - a person who develops those intrinsic qualities can often overcome relatively poor luck, but luck will almost never overcome a relative deficit of those intrinsic qualities.
 
Paul G said:
"The weekly median earnings for full-time wage or salary workers in the United States in the second quarter of 2021 amounted to $990. It translates to a yearly income of approximately $51,480. Any amount above that should theoretically be considered a good salary; however, it is not as easy as that. What is considered a good salary in one city may not be so in another. Other factors that determine a good salary are the type of job, level of education, and sadly, even gender and race."

You guys need to step back and think about what average means, and stop shitting on working people who drive your buses, clean your toilets and serve you groceries. On thing that Covid showed the world is the essential workers are not CEO's. Most of where you end up in life is down to luck, don't kid yourself its the hard work that you did all by yourself. I'm just glad everyday that I can play with my toys and look at a beautiful view and not have to work every again if I dont want too. I just got lucky and I know it.
Click to expand...

Please post another chart that directly refutes your point.
 
“You cannot legislate the poor into freedom by legislating the wealthy out of freedom. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.”

- Gerald LK Smith
 
craig bush said:
Do you have data supporting the assertion that luck is the main determinant of success?
Click to expand...

Craig, I am not denigrating hard work, higher ed and all the planning that Endo refers to, the luck I am talking about is being born into certain circumstances, having the genetics to overcome adversity and so on. Some people are never ever going to have it as good as you as you or I purely due to the hand they got dealt in life. Whether it's your country, health, your race, your sex, your parents, your college or whatever. Meritocracy in the 2020's is mostly is a myth promulgated by the lucky few and by those who's purposes it serves to keep telling low wage workers that you can make it. Look at the Fed right now- its committed to ....... working class people over by forcing austerity to lower wages , the American dream huh?
 
What the exactly do you know about America? Would you take such lectures from a non-resident about your country?
 
Paul G said:
You just don't know how fortunate you are
Click to expand...

I just don't get how you can't keep America out of your posts if the .... is going on everywhere. You could probably search America, US, and United States in this forum and most of the people using those terms aren't from here and/or don't live here. Its bizarre.

I'm not fortunate. There are many, many people much more fortunate than I.

Let's define success for a moment. I don't consider it some Bezos level of wealth. Wealth on its own is a poor metric of success. Even that ...... got divorced and paid handsomely for it. I consider success improvement on your status and situation. To which there are many degrees of success. Some may have the foresight to buy a disk operating system from a talented programmer for $50K, back when that was a lot of money, and turn it into billions. Others may simply escape the generational poverty their family has been living in. Some just climb a little higher than their parents did.

There is a running coach, Jack Daniels, who gave a good presentation about the ingredients of success.

https://runsmartproject.com/2018/10/26/the-ingredients-of-success/
They are...

1. Inherent Ability
2. Motivation
3. Opportunity
4. Direction
5. Focus on the Task at Hand

All of those things are necessary to produce a champion. What ever the sport, and for the sake of this conversation let's consider life a sport.

You can have no opportunity but high ability, motivation and with good direction and focus, make something of yourself. All of these things work in varying levels to produce success and a surplus of one can make up for a lack of another. The only potential negative being direction. Meaning you can receive bad guidance which leads you down the wrong path. Let's say some told Bill Gates, don't buy that DOS nonsense for $50K, it's a waste of money.

I'm sure there are many, many people less fortunate than me. I help the people I can help but its up to them to elevate themselves. Being better than you were is success.
 
I love giving things away to people who aren’t needy but are in need. I have given away a lot of parts on this very board to help out where I could. For those who don’t know me, my main business is food mfg. I invented a new tech to make portable food products that is revolutionizing mfg, logistics and cost of doing business.

We are growing at an exponential rate. We are heavily involved in government food programs (DOD FEMA, HHS, World Food Program etc) it is my goal by 2024 to be able to give away one food item for every one we make. That for me is success. As I build wealth and benefit from all that brings, I can help feed the globe and hopefully ease some of the ridiculousness of hunger. To have hungry people in this day and age is embarrassing for all civilized nations. If you’re not giving back, you’re missing out.
 
bp_SFV4 said:
I consider success improvement on your status and situation. To which there are many degrees of success
Click to expand...

It's up to each of us to define success on our own terms right? So that means you lose the right to call out others who don't live up to your ideals.
When your next big birthday is 70 like me, you don't really give a .... about what people think anymore, success to me is lots of small things, like having the time to talk rubbish on the net with you lot and a few big ones like able to spend time with the people I want, help out. Bikes etc are part of that but if that got taken away...meh who cares, Ive got plenty on.

I'm offering a counterpoint to you and Endos reacharounds over a very narrow definition of success. Like I said luck determines many things, as for the totality of human experience, lets just say its this crazy blue marble is full of surprises. Whats totally mad is that we have Ducati's in common and can blast electrons across the world sharing the passion...
 
bp_SFV4 said:
Some may have the foresight to buy a disk operating system from a talented programmer for $50K, back when that was a lot of money, and turn it into billions.
Click to expand...

To be fair he only turned it into billions because he ...... over his business partner IBM, same goes for Ray Croc and the McDonald brothers.
 
Paul G said:
I'm offering a counterpoint to you and Endos reacharounds over a very narrow definition of success. Like I said luck determines many things, as for the totality of human experience, lets just say its this crazy blue marble is full of surprises. Whats totally mad is that we have Ducati's in common and can blast electrons across the world sharing the passion...
Click to expand...

IDK, I offered a pretty wide definition of success, literally saying its up to the person to define. I can't paint that with a wider brush.
 
Paul G said:
Craig, I am not denigrating hard work, higher ed and all the planning that Endo refers to, the luck I am talking about is being born into certain circumstances, having the genetics to overcome adversity and so on. Some people are never ever going to have it as good as you as you or I purely due to the hand they got dealt in life. Whether it's your country, health, your race, your sex, your parents, your college or whatever. Meritocracy in the 2020's is mostly is a myth promulgated by the lucky few and by those who's purposes it serves to keep telling low wage workers that you can make it. Look at the Fed right now- its committed to ....... working class people over by forcing austerity to lower wages , the American dream huh?
Click to expand...

I didn’t assert that you were denigrating anything; I asked if you had data to support your assertion that luck is the factor that “most” determines success. My suspicion is that you don’t (because I suspect that data doesn’t exist).

Above, you make another assertion:

“Meritocracy in the 2020's is mostly is a myth…”

Do you have data supporting that assertion? I suspect not. See the pattern yet? :)
 

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