Termignoni Evolution slip-ons: first road impressions

Those are some massive numbers! Could that be a happy dyno?

Whoopazz said:

Those are some massive numbers! Could that be a happy dyno?

Click to expand...

it's often debated, but I personally believe some dynos are more "generous" than others, and I think this one would be on the generous side. but are stingy dynos more inaccurate?

at the end of the day though, I just want a very smooth, happy running engine (optimized air-fuel mapping), and happy engines just naturally run strong.

Yeah a nice smooth curve is what you should be after. In sure the bike will be awesome after the tuner is done. Let us know what dyno tuning will run you pls.

Just did this exhaust and filter from moto d. Got rid of charcoal canister and valve.
It definitely cleaned up part throttle 3k to 4500 rpm in the cruising range I'm at. Engine cools faster and the sound is nice a deep. I'd say 20% louder than stock but the nice deep rumble. Will be adding a rapid bike tune next week.

I don't have the graph file on me at the moment, but today's baseline was significantly lower than last time - 184whp (vs 192). After about 6 hours on the dyno, we got 190whp/98tq.

Weather conditions likely played a role - we were tuning during a very heavy thunderstorm.

Anyways, much of the time was spent smoothing out low throttle response and smoothness, and getting rid of any dip in the middle. It was a successful tune on both of those counts.

Custom tuning a map to one's bike costs hundreds of dollars. But it really makes everything work together better, and that's really the bottom line. By bringing up the middle, the 8k power surge that the Termis w/stock map had has largely disappeared, and linear power curves are always more desirable in situations like on the track, or challenging twisties.

In any event, wheel horsepower over 190 is definitely next-generation superbike territory. Tuned 2015 superbikes should be posting numbers in this zone.

But they won't be coming close on the torque numbers

Post.Graph.Post.Graph.

Really looking forward to seeing some charts on these with pre & post tune curves and A/F. 1) to compare the pre-tune with what Termi advertises for a reality check, and 2) to see what's achievable with the next step.

- HP and torque cross at 5250, so it's reasonably precise.
- as mentioned above, the baseline was 8hp and 3tq down from the first baseline taken two weeks ago. weather is the culprit there.
- tuning added power, but the curves are already quite smooth. not sure why; the baseline AFRs were all over the place.

If it's 6hp over the baseline, and we take the first dyno run, that's 198hp at the wheel. Still shy of 200 but whatever, even 190hp at the wheel is beyond what the 1st gen S1000RRs were laying down on average with a pipe and tune (180s).

Where I got my money's worth can't be seen on this graph - all of the part-throttle tuning. I wouldn't go so far as to say that it's as tractable as my Multistrada and that Testastretta 11, but it's remarkably close. It's exceptionally rideable in traffic, and I can sit at a stoplight without wriggling around from the heat. In fact, I'd say it feels coolest when idling at a stop.

Thanks! Understood about the part-throttle tuning; you never see that on a dyno chart. Still, and whatever the relative numbers, I think that's the flattest torque curve I've ever seen from a Panigale. Slightest dip still between 6-7K, but not bad at all! Wonder what Chaz' looks like with that long, 360+ degree 2-1 setup on it...

kismetcapitan said:

- HP and torque cross at 5250, so it's reasonably precise.
- as mentioned above, the baseline was 8hp and 3tq down from the first baseline taken two weeks ago. weather is the culprit there.
- tuning added power, but the curves are already quite smooth. not sure why; the baseline AFRs were all over the place.

If it's 6hp over the baseline, and we take the first dyno run, that's 198hp at the wheel. Still shy of 200 but whatever, even 190hp at the wheel is beyond what the 1st gen S1000RRs were laying down on average with a pipe and tune (180s).

Where I got my money's worth can't be seen on this graph - all of the part-throttle tuning. I wouldn't go so far as to say that it's as tractable as my Multistrada and that Testastretta 11, but it's remarkably close. It's exceptionally rideable in traffic, and I can sit at a stoplight without wriggling around from the heat. In fact, I'd say it feels coolest when idling at a stop.

Click to expand...

Does it seem like you were getting wheelspin at the top end??? I can see a bunch on waves from about 8.5k rpm up?

between 4-6k rpm, it's making more than 80tq at the wheel. so it has a 1198-ish grunt down low. you can see where it feels like the power really takes off - on the graph it's at 7k but I guess it happens so fast that I was guessing that this "boost" kicked in around 8k.

Ducati first really came on my radar watching Bayliss and Haga on the 1198s - they'd drive out of corners at 4000rpm and it sounded like they were practically at idle. Having that kind of low-end pull on the Panigale is very, very nice!

I was actually mulling over the WSBK exhaust while riding home today. This is PURE conjecture, but it may be that the Termi slip-ons under the best conditions won't reach 200hp at the wheel. Close, but won't get there. The pipe length is shorter than stock or on the Akrapovic. It sounds wonderful, and I think the easier breathing helps with low to mid power, but obviously long pipes for top end is where the race teams have been going.

so my hypothesis - if the rumors about flapper valves strategically placed in Chaz Davies' exhaust are true, what could be happening is that at the low end, the exhaust is exiting earlier to boost midrange, and that valve would close to have the exhaust run the full length of all that spaghetti piping to boost top end power. Who says you can't have your cake and eat it too?

80shilling said:

Does it seem like you were getting wheelspin at the top end??? I can see a bunch on waves from about 8.5k rpm up?

Click to expand...

possibly? wheelspin on a dyno is always an issue with high-powered bikes. I will say that it shredded the hell out of my tire! A new rear Supercorsa will be needed a couple months earlier than planned....

kismetcapitan said:

I don't have the graph file on me at the moment, but today's baseline was significantly lower than last time - 184whp (vs 192). After about 6 hours on the dyno, we got 190whp/98tq.

Weather conditions likely played a role - we were tuning during a very heavy thunderstorm.

Anyways, much of the time was spent smoothing out low throttle response and smoothness, and getting rid of any dip in the middle. It was a successful tune on both of those counts.

Custom tuning a map to one's bike costs hundreds of dollars. But it really makes everything work together better, and that's really the bottom line. By bringing up the middle, the 8k power surge that the Termis w/stock map had has largely disappeared, and linear power curves are always more desirable in situations like on the track, or challenging twisties.

In any event, wheel horsepower over 190 is definitely next-generation superbike territory. Tuned 2015 superbikes should be posting numbers in this zone.

But they won't be coming close on the torque numbers

Click to expand...

[/URL][/IMG]

[/URL][/IMG]

This 1st photo certainly looks like a dual tuned length system notice the short bypass section on the 2-1 collector, 2nd pic you can just make out a servo mech' on rear bend

Thx for the pix Sean, why would they put a servo on a full system???

That thing looks awesome! Would like to see some more pix.

yeah, that servo thing... maybe for several rpm ranges to create back pressure?

sean999r said:

[/URL][/IMG]

[/URL][/IMG]

This 1st photo certainly looks like a dual tuned length system notice the short bypass section on the 2-1 collector, 2nd pic you can just make out a servo mech' on rear bend

Click to expand...

i agree with you, I think it could be that they use the long tubing for low RPM grunt and less back flow between pulses, then shift the gasses over to a shorter path for high RPM and less back pressure.

Flappers are pretty common on all the WSBK's the past few years.

Don't mean to hi jack thread, but from the WSBK races I watch the bike sounds fairly quiet in pit lane but very loud and raspy on the track

definitely either to vary backpressure, or to act as valves to shunt flow one way or another.

I was NOT prepared to view such hardcore ....ography when I opened this page. Such sinuously curved titanium, complex and mysterious multiple passageways, the bespoke exhaust of the highest performing Panigale on earth.....oh lord, oh lord, oh lordy!!!!

Does this slip on mod make the bike any more or less rideable at slow back road commuter speeds?

Bike is great above 4k, but in low gears @ 2.5k to 3.5k it feels kind of chunky. I know that's the nature of a big v-twin, but I've been able to fix that to a large degree by exhaust work & remaps on my other bikes (full termi kit on my 999 and a WASP PUK + Termi slipon on my GT).

I'm seriously considering this mod, but sound, heat, looks & top end performance are not my primary motivators. Also does disabling the servo have any affect (good or bad) on low end performance?

Forward facing blow hole looks a lil weird.

Slowdive2 said:

Does this slip on mod make the bike any more or less rideable at slow back road commuter speeds?

Bike is great above 4k, but in low gears @ 2.5k to 3.5k it feels kind of chunky. I know that's the nature of a big v-twin, but I've been able to fix that to a large degree by exhaust work & remaps on my other bikes (full termi kit on my 999 and a WASP PUK + Termi slipon on my GT).

I'm seriously considering this mod, but sound, heat, looks & top end performance are not my primary motivators. Also does disabling the servo have any affect (good or bad) on low end performance?

Forward facing blow hole looks a lil weird.

Click to expand...

It does make more torque down low which helps, but sans mapping on my 1199 it's not appreciably smoother at the very bottom. I expect that's more of a fueling thing, solvable with Rapidbike/Tuneboy/etc.