2022 Electronics Upgrade to 2023

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I've done two 20 minute sessions this morning. EBC seems less invasive in level 3 and 2. Quickshifter can't tell, hasn't been warm enough for the fans.

Feels like the Woolich map is unaffected, but I haven't dynoed
 
DeussenEngines said:
That can only be the case if the update was only done to the BBS module which is possible.
Click to expand...

Is it possible to just update the BBS and not the ECU , wouldn't that throw some comms trouble codes?
For what reason should a dealer only upgrate the BBS?
I'm asking because I ordered also a '23 bike and asked the dealer to see if it's possible to put the Akra software on this bike.
Software is VIN related and the problem could be that my '19 bike is a euro 4 and the '23 is a euro 5
 
DeussenEngines said:
All changes in the ECU are overwritten when an ECU update is performed. It is only possible to overwrite the full software and mapping areas. Partial updates are not possible.

There are no grip position to TPS translation table in this ECU. This is a part that Woolich may not understand correctly. Everything inside the ECU is handled in terms of airflow and torque. Be careful messing with those tables that woolich calls the throttle command. It is easy to put the ECU in limp mode when messing with those.
Click to expand...

Yes, I fully understand Load/Torque based ECU tuning as I also have several 4-wheel vehicles that are also Load/Torque based. Yes, they ALL have throttle pedal/twist grip translation tables that provide the “demand” (linear or otherwise determined by ride mode) inputs to the Load to Torque and Torque to Load comparison tables as Throttle Requested Load. The final command sent to the Electronic Throttle Control or Valve ETC/V actuator is determined from these tables, as limited by the Load/Torque Limit tables, etc.

Now each ECU software engineer may name these tables different things to suit their established vernacular, but they all work similarly. When the ECU itself is flashed, it indeed reflects the new flash and previous values are all overwritten with the new flash data.

Some of us are quite experienced in the process, but unsure of how the Ducati CAN bus controller is set up. You should be able to flash/update individual modules per their address on the bus.
 
But we don’t know if and when a Ducati dealer uploads to the bike soft ware whether it picks and chooses one or two bits or goes over the whole thing…..
 
andyb said:
But we don’t know if and when a Ducati dealer uploads to the bike soft ware whether it picks and chooses one or two bits or goes over the whole thing…..
Click to expand...

The 23MY electronics update is one package. It either does everything, or it does nothing. The dealer has no control, it's a' plug it in and see' deal.
The package contains various updates (as previously described), but they are bundled together.
 
RickD996 said:
The 23MY electronics update is one package. It either does everything, or it does nothing. The dealer has no control, it's a' plug it in and see' deal.
The package contains various updates (as previously described), but they are bundled together.
Click to expand...

that's what I said.....so it isn't like it picks and chooses one area and just does that. It there for as was said above interferes with the Woolich stuff as per what the woolich guy said.

Are you going to go back on to a dyno to check /re calibrate?
 
andyb said:
that's what I said.....so it isn't like it picks and chooses one area and just does that. It there for as was said above interferes with the Woolich stuff as per what the woolich guy said.

Are you going to go back on to a dyno to check /re calibrate?
Click to expand...

It doesn't seem to effect the fueling maps. The only areas it effects are:
EBC
DQS
Fans
Ride by wire

I don't believe it overwrites any other files.

No plans to dyno atm.
 
DeussenEngines said:
That can only be the case if the update was only done to the BBS module which is possible.
Click to expand...

There are many people (two in this thread) that have updated factory software for some modules on top of an aftermarket tune leaving the tune is unaffected. Doesn't speak highly of your tuning company's potential and your understanding of Ducati system architecture if you insist on arguing with real world facts.
 
Last edited:
TomFoolery said:
There are many people (two in this thread) that have updated fueling maps on top of an aftermarket tune leaving the tune is unaffected. Doesn't speak highly of your tuning company's potential and your understanding of Ducati system architecture if you insist on arguing with real world facts.
Click to expand...

Believing the tune is unaffected…

but he is only saying what the woolich guy said!
That said I’m cynical enough to wonder if we’ll they would say that to get a copy of the latest info for their bank ….
 
I stood by the bike and watched when dealer updated my 18 with upmap to Evo 2. Like Rick said, the dealer has no control over the process. The computer authenticates, reads the modules and does what it wants. It updated a bunch of modules for me including DES and updated some parts of the ECU but left all fueling intact. I know this for a fact because: a) if upmap was overwritten I would have immediately gotten a CEL as I have no emissions bs b) computer still said race evo on startup and c) butt dyno definitely said bike still ran the same as before (crap because upmap is garbage for early bikes) d) subsequently when Frank updated me to his SLR tune, he asked for a copy of my upmap file that was on the bike and verified it was an upmap.

There is other literature on another ducati forum detailing the same things I am describing. I remember reading it before going through the update process on my bike.
https://ducatimodified.com/threads/...-racing-evo-for-aftermarket-exhaust.57/page-4
 
my logic would be that the bike soft ware perimeters have been modified. If you move those perimeters with a upgrade then surely the modifications are going to be out?
We don't truly know for sure what is or isn't changed and what effect that has on all the other parts of the software...
 
TomFoolery said:
There are many people (two in this thread) that have updated factory software for some modules on top of an aftermarket tune leaving the tune is unaffected. Doesn't speak highly of your tuning company's potential and your understanding of Ducati system architecture if you insist on arguing with real world facts.
Click to expand...

Sorry Tom that your impression is that I have no idea what I am talking about. Just because people say that they believe their tune is unaffected does not make it true. The upgrade to the EVO2 definitely consist of three components: Dash, BBS and ECU reflash. Take a look at the attached file and you should understand what I am talking about.

After over 15 years as an OEM ECU calibration engineer in the Powersports industry and 12 years as a Ducati ECU tuner I am missing an understanding Ducati system architecture…but maybe not? 😂
 

Attachments

  • MC-10163547-0001.pdf
    259.2 KB
TomFoolery said:
I stood by the bike and watched when dealer updated my 18 with upmap to Evo 2. Like Rick said, the dealer has no control over the process. The computer authenticates, reads the modules and does what it wants. It updated a bunch of modules for me including DES and updated some parts of the ECU but left all fueling intact. I know this for a fact because: a) if upmap was overwritten I would have immediately gotten a CEL as I have no emissions bs b) computer still said race evo on startup and c) butt dyno definitely said bike still ran the same as before (crap because upmap is garbage for early bikes) d) subsequently when Frank updated me to his SLR tune, he asked for a copy of my upmap file that was on the bike and verified it was an upmap.

There is other literature on another ducati forum detailing the same things I am describing. I remember reading it before going through the update process on my bike.
https://ducatimodified.com/threads/...-racing-evo-for-aftermarket-exhaust.57/page-4
Click to expand...

There is an easy explanation for your bike not showing a CEL after the update. The Ducati performance map that is part of the upgrade has the diagnostics for the emission related components disabled. All Ducati Performance maps up to MY2020 bikes that show Racing EVO at startup have EVAP valve disabled by default.

The second possible explanation for a tune really staying unaffected would be that the calibration ID of the tune that had been loaded in the ECU previously was already the matching ID for the EVO2 software package. In that case the Ducati Diagnostic System would not flash the ECU again.
 
Last edited:
andyb said:
my logic would be that the bike soft ware perimeters have been modified. If you move those perimeters with a upgrade then surely the modifications are going to be out?
We don't truly know for sure what is or isn't changed and what effect that has on all the other parts of the software...
Click to expand...

The bike still does the quite unique Woolich warmup aswell.
 
RickD996 said:
The bike still does the quite unique Woolich warmup aswell.
Click to expand...

what just hunts......
1f923.png


or does the independent rev thing?
 
I would have no idea what software my bike is running unless it told me at startup, moreover unless I was exploring the edges of performance I am pretty sure I wouldnt feel it unless it was a significant change.
 
Paul G said:
I would have no idea what software my bike is running unless it told me at startup, moreover unless I was exploring the edges of performance I am pretty sure I wouldnt feel it unless it was a significant change.
Click to expand...

why bother wasting money on a tune then?
 

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