AR Inconel Install

sifubs said:

Are we now focused on peak HP or the improvements to be made by tuning only , by AR exhaust only , by AR exhaust and tuning by Termi slips and tuning?

A couple of days ago this thread was headed in a positive direction not it has again degraded, this is very disappointing.

There are other tuners that claim significant increased by tuning only what does that say about the tuning that has been done thus far? Or, could this be just differences in dyno setup and environment.

Anything is possible lets wait and see and avoid the unpleasant accusations.

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WAfatboy said:

Will pick this up in the morning. Rich sent me a valid point about the air flow issue. The Termi slips run on stock headers that are much more restrictive than the AR racing exhaust. In those circumstances airflow could be a deciding issue.

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sifubs said:

Are we now focused on peak HP or the improvements to be made by tuning only , by AR exhaust only , by AR exhaust and tuning by Termi slips and tuning?

A couple of days ago this thread was headed in a positive direction not it has again degraded, this is very disappointing.

There are other tuners that claim significant increased by tuning only what does that say about the tuning that has been done thus far? Or, could this be just differences in dyno setup and environment.

Anything is possible lets wait and see and avoid the unpleasant accusations.

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ttkarp said:

Agreed. But, this latest data was the result of "lets wait and see..." If the next round of results don't show the desired outcome, do we just wait again before arriving at a conclusion? Just curious how this works.

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ttkarp said:

Couldn't the same be said for the full Termi system then?

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WAfatboy said:

Based on ARs feedback it appears all comparisons are invalid until we can find a dyno with sufficient airflow.

We've identified Bunbury Dyno as producing numbers on their Termi and stock bikes as even higher than ARs so we are going to run there, and compare with the results they have had from full Termi system, slips and stock.

I am aiming for a 6th May run as the earliest I can spare the time.

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Trauma said:

If the 150 mph fan is all that's missing, I would think AR could post numbers at various fan speeds that would best replicate fans available to the general market. ........

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WAfatboy said:

Yes, see the graph for the Full Termi 1199 run back to back with my bike, it has 70mm headers.

Slips run on my bike previously use the more restricted 35mm pipe which apparently doesn't need the ram air.

Given that 99% of people buying this bike for road use will see that speed will it mean that they see poorer performance when they are riding slower (most of the time?)

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Trauma said:

How often will you be going 150 mph? Is the fan have a flow meter/governor, where the airflow matches the speedometer? i.e., when the bike is going 75 mph on the dyno, the fan is pushing air at 75 mph? So you only have 1/2 the gain in HP at that speed? I want my HP increase at all speeds.

I really don't buy that making a lot of difference. And being a pilot I wonder, if you are in head/tail/cross winds, your HP will vary at any given speed as well???

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ScrapperX said:

From my understanding from my tuning guy is that the problem with this bike when performing a dyno, the ECU takes the airspeed from the air speed sensor and determine how much fuel you need along a whole array of stuff like throttle position, front and rear wheel speed, engine rpm, traction control setting and input from the O2 sensor. So when doing a dyno for this bike you need to "Trick" the bike into thinking that it is in a certain state. Reason for Turning everything off and disconnecting the rear wheel speed sensor. The induction of the 150+MPH into the RAM air ducts only needs to occur when approaching that speed. He turns on the fan only when he approaches that speed. When having the Fans on all the time causes the bike to run really lean.

I agree with you i would like to know what is the True HP per given RPM with accurate airspeed at various RPM's.

Not sure what types of plane you fly (Props/jet engines) but I know for jet engine if you don't get enough/or too much air down the intake the engine will stall. Ive seen F/A-18 engine stalls at a certain AOA at certain altitude or not enough speed at certain altitude do to thin air. So I would say yes the engine would produce more HP with the correct airflow.

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ScrapperX said:

From my understanding from my tuning guy is that the problem with this bike when performing a dyno, the ECU takes the airspeed from the air speed sensor and determine how much fuel you need along a whole array of stuff like throttle position, front and rear wheel speed, engine rpm, traction control setting and input from the O2 sensor. So when doing a dyno for this bike you need to "Trick" the bike into thinking that it is in a certain state. Reason for Turning everything off and disconnecting the rear wheel speed sensor. The induction of the 150+MPH into the RAM air ducts only needs to occur when approaching that speed. He turns on the fan only when he approaches that speed. When having the Fans on all the time causes the bike to run really lean.

I agree with you i would like to know what is the True HP per given RPM with accurate airspeed at various RPM's.

Not sure what types of plane you fly (Props/jet engines) but I know for jet engine if you don't get enough/or too much air down the intake the engine will stall. Ive seen F/A-18 engine stalls at a certain AOA at certain altitude or not enough speed at certain altitude do to thin air. So I would say yes the engine would produce more HP with the correct airflow.

Click to expand...

ScrapperX said:

From my understanding from my tuning guy is that the problem with this bike when performing a dyno, the ECU takes the airspeed from the air speed sensor and determine how much fuel you need along a whole array of stuff like throttle position, front and rear wheel speed, engine rpm, traction control setting and input from the O2 sensor. So when doing a dyno for this bike you need to "Trick" the bike into thinking that it is in a certain state. Reason for Turning everything off and disconnecting the rear wheel speed sensor. The induction of the 150+MPH into the RAM air ducts only needs to occur when approaching that speed. He turns on the fan only when he approaches that speed. When having the Fans on all the time causes the bike to run really lean.

I agree with you i would like to know what is the True HP per given RPM with accurate airspeed at various RPM's.

Not sure what types of plane you fly (Props/jet engines) but I know for jet engine if you don't get enough/or too much air down the intake the engine will stall. Ive seen F/A-18 engine stalls at a certain AOA at certain altitude or not enough speed at certain altitude do to thin air. So I would say yes the engine would produce more HP with the correct airflow.

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VAST said:

and if you draw a pentagram around your dyno, then you will get even more HP. if you use chicken blood for said pentagram, it'll be a touch more HP. human blood yields even greater HP.

pentagram in human blood with gale hurricane winds yields unrivaled HP. add in an active zombie holocaust and your pani will fly like a jet plane!

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Stw said:

I have some Ocean Front property in Dallas...if anyone is interested.... For details call Rich at Austin Racing..

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Notec said:

If WAf has Paypal, I am willing to donate funds to assist in Dyno fees at the new facility. We need answers. I was on the fence with purchasing the AR system as New Haven Powersports is 2 miles from my employer, but now I'm thinking I'll just explore other options... Losing midrange is not an option for me. Absolutely not an option.

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Notec said:

If WAf has Paypal, I am willing to donate funds to assist in Dyno fees at the new facility. We need answers. I was on the fence with purchasing the AR system as New Haven Powersports is 2 miles from my employer, but now I'm thinking I'll just explore other options... Losing midrange is not an option for me. Absolutely not an option.

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VAST said:

there's really nice lakefront props in Austin, Texas.

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