Ducati Corse Oil - Special Oil developed by Shell and Ducati Corse

Ducati Forum

Help Support Ducati Forum:

01COCCOBET said:
Any news on the subject?!?
Someone with the JASO API spec and real dyno test?!?
Click to expand...

Motul 300V “Motorcycle” oil, and Red Line “Power Sports” are both JASO. They can be used with wet or dry clutches.
Another advantage of the JASO rating, is the oil does not the friction modifiers for improved fuel economy. When those Fuel Economy friction modifiers hit very hot cylinder walls, they flash burn and leave a varnish on the cylinder walls. This varnish fills in the cross hatch pattern on the cylinder walls, making it harder for your oil to cling onto the cylinder walls. This causes high oil consumption. The cylinder walls in your family car don’t get hot enough for the fuel economy friction modifiers to create a problem. Most motorcycles don’t get hot. But modern BlueTEC diesels and you guys hot rodding your Panigale V4s will definitely have hot cylinder walls. JASO with a dry clutch is a positive. Fuel efficient friction modifiers also cause a wet clutch to slip. For you wet clutch owners who feel like your clutch feels odd, check that your oil has the JASO approval. I can also explain JASO MA if anyone really wants to get into the weeds.
 
I bought the special oil, but ai am waiting for some base fact check, before using it.
Right now, I am using the BARDHAL XT4R 39.67 C60 10W-60, as suggested from Barni.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_7871.jpeg
    IMG_7871.jpeg
    819.4 KB
Suggested for the 2022 V4R #51.
According to Barni, now they use a GHOSTLY Ducati Corse Oil, that " you " ( normal people, including me ), cannot buy.
But I am stubborn, I will find out and use it😎
 
01COCCOBET said:
I bought the special oil, but ai am waiting for some base fact check, before using it.
Right now, I am using the BARDHAL XT4R 39.67 C60 10W-60, as suggested from Barni.
Click to expand...

This is a motorcycle oil with the JASO approval for wet clutches. I went to their website and searched for the Material Data Sheet and the Safety Data Sheets. They are not easily found, which is not a good sign. From my experience, when oil companies are proud of their oil, they’re anxious to prove it. When it’s an Ester Synthetic API Group 5 oil, they plaster it all over the label. I suspect it’s a PAO ester blend like the Ducati oil. It’s a very good oil, just not the absolute best. Ducati doesn’t make their Technical Data Sheets easy to find. On the other hand, Motul 300V and Red Line put their Technical Data Sheets where they’re easy to find. Every oil tells you they’ll make you handsome and all the Umbrella Girls will be chasing you up and down Pit Lane. Now I like Umbrella Girls as much as the next guy. But if your oil is going to get me all the Umbrella Girls, I want proof. A snazzy Umbrella ain’t good enough!
 
SuperDomestique said:
I’d say it isn’t. Shell Ducati oil is basically same price and you know that half of that is bc of the Ducati branding. When I looked into reviews, Motul seemed to come up the better oil. I can’t remember why though
Click to expand...

Reply to both questions.
Most oil companies have band together to make it very hard for consumers to understand oil. For example, what’s the difference between “full synthetic” and “100% synthetic” and “similar-synthetic”? What does the word “synthetic” mean? In the mid ‘90s, the US Supreme Court ruled on a beef between Castrol and Mobil. They spent millions arguing about that word. So the Supreme Court ruled that the word “synthetic” is a Marketing term that means whatever the Marketer thinks it means. I know it’s stupid. You can look it up. “Synthetic” doesn’t mean ..... Big oil companies are some of the biggest liars on the planet.
So who’s the API, ACEA, ISLAC, SAE, ISO, JASO, and who put them in charge?
Where do you find the API Group number for the oil?
Really understanding oil is enormously time consuming.
When someone asks if they need such an expensive oil, the answer is easy. Oil does far more than lubricate the engine. Oil is way cheaper than repairs. Most people won’t spend the money for the very best oil. That means the very best oils are hard to find. Change the oil and filter twice as often as you think you should.
 
VYRUS said:
Reply to both questions.
Most oil companies have band together to make it very hard for consumers to understand oil. For example, what’s the difference between “full synthetic” and “100% synthetic” and “similar-synthetic”? What does the word “synthetic” mean? In the mid ‘90s, the US Supreme Court ruled on a beef between Castrol and Mobil. They spent millions arguing about that word. So the Supreme Court ruled that the word “synthetic” is a Marketing term that means whatever the Marketer thinks it means. I know it’s stupid. You can look it up. “Synthetic” doesn’t mean ..... Big oil companies are some of the biggest liars on the planet.
So who’s the API, ACEA, ISLAC, SAE, ISO, JASO, and who put them in charge?
Where do you find the API Group number for the oil?
Really understanding oil is enormously time consuming.
When someone asks if they need such an expensive oil, the answer is easy. Oil does far more than lubricate the engine. Oil is way cheaper than repairs. Most people won’t spend the money for the very best oil. That means the very best oils are hard to find. Change the oil and filter twice as often as you think you should.
Click to expand...

You’re clearly better informed than a layperson - do you work in the petroleum industry?

Is there a rank list of the top three motor oils for our panigales?
 
VYRUS said:
Reply to both questions.
Most oil companies have band together to make it very hard for consumers to understand oil. For example, what’s the difference between “full synthetic” and “100% synthetic” and “similar-synthetic”? What does the word “synthetic” mean? In the mid ‘90s, the US Supreme Court ruled on a beef between Castrol and Mobil. They spent millions arguing about that word. So the Supreme Court ruled that the word “synthetic” is a Marketing term that means whatever the Marketer thinks it means. I know it’s stupid. You can look it up. “Synthetic” doesn’t mean ..... Big oil companies are some of the biggest liars on the planet.
So who’s the API, ACEA, ISLAC, SAE, ISO, JASO, and who put them in charge?
Where do you find the API Group number for the oil?
Really understanding oil is enormously time consuming.
When someone asks if they need such an expensive oil, the answer is easy. Oil does far more than lubricate the engine. Oil is way cheaper than repairs. Most people won’t spend the money for the very best oil. That means the very best oils are hard to find. Change the oil and filter twice as often as you think you should.
Click to expand...

Agree
 
VYRUS said:
This is a motorcycle oil with the JASO approval for wet clutches. I went to their website and searched for the Material Data Sheet and the Safety Data Sheets. They are not easily found, which is not a good sign. From my experience, when oil companies are proud of their oil, they’re anxious to prove it. When it’s an Ester Synthetic API Group 5 oil, they plaster it all over the label. I suspect it’s a PAO ester blend like the Ducati oil. It’s a very good oil, just not the absolute best. Ducati doesn’t make their Technical Data Sheets easy to find. On the other hand, Motul 300V and Red Line put their Technical Data Sheets where they’re easy to find. Every oil tells you they’ll make you handsome and all the Umbrella Girls will be chasing you up and down Pit Lane. Now I like Umbrella Girls as much as the next guy. But if your oil is going to get me all the Umbrella Girls, I want proof. A snazzy Umbrella ain’t good enough!
Click to expand...

Someone likes to show off to impress, when there is no way to prove otherwise.
My opinion is, follow what the " WINNING " top tier racing guys ( and team ) are doing.
They don't want to loose the race and, sometimes, waste money on that.
Of course, winning, sometimes means, push to the limit, so it can brake just after the finish line.
In any case, I follow what they tell me, because I cannot prove that the Motul 300V, that I used for AGES, until yesterday, is any better than Bardhal.
Both of them are used in high ( NOT TOP ) racing environment, so fair enough.
I was only hoping for some wisdom here, perhaps through any evidence-based tests or scientific research, that I was not aware of.
I will tell you.
Sure thing is that I will keep changing my oil and filter every 300 km or so, feeling that is a good move for wears and tears of the engine.
As far for wet or dry clutch spec, it all dipends on the anti-friction additives that they put.
In both cases, a dry clutch, won't feel it.
For the 300V used in normal road conditions, it won't hurt, so why not, if in the correct grade.
I change the oil in my " other " car every 2 years, even if I clocked only 600 to 1000 km, because oil can oxidize with the time, etc.
Perhaps I am a little paranoid, but at least I leave relieved that I do everything I can......
my 2 pennies
 
01COCCOBET said:
As far for wet or dry clutch spec, it all dipends on the anti-friction additives that they put.
In both cases, a dry clutch, won't feel it.
Click to expand...

I’ve noticed that shifting is improved with 300V compared to the Shell Ultra 4T. Will be interesting to see if there’s a noticeable difference between 15W50 and 60 on the track.

For your Barni V4R, oil change frequency won’t make or break it. What will make the difference is following the race refresh schedule so new pistons/timing change/bearings/etc every 2500 km
 
panibadboy said:
The question is not really correct, all depends on the engine. I would stick with 300v in V4/R engines. 7100 is more than enough for Pikes Peak.
Click to expand...

Ducati recommend Shell Advance Pretty sure 7100 is at least as good, I gather the main differences to racing oils like 300v are compatibility with catalytic converters and the inclusion of detergents to extend oil life.. If I was tracking most of the time I'd use 300V as the advice I've had is that unless you are max revs most of the time it's overkill,but I stand to be corrected. Currently using Bel-Ray EXP Synthetic Ester Blend in the PP.



1712999428274.png
 
VYRUS said:
Please accept this as help for the group to better understand the very complex oil specifications. For more detailed information, I would recommend the “Lubrizol” website.
- JASO MA & MB: Ducati wet clutch owners should only use oil with the JASO MA approval. MB is for scooters with centrifugal clutches. JASO MA can also be used in a dry clutch engine with no harm.
- Motorcycle specific oils are significantly different & better for motorcycle engines. Motorcycle oil is more complicated and more expensive than automotive oil. It’s not a gimmick to steal your money. Other than the JASO MA approval, there is no other official approval for motorcycle dry clutch engines. You’ll have to trust the oil manufacturer’s reputation and statements of approval for motorcycle engines. If the oil doesn’t say specifically that it’s intended for motorcycles, you should assume it does NOT have special additive packages for motorcycles. Motorcycle oil has “gear boosters” to protect the gears inside a motorcycle engine from pitting. Additives to prevent foaming in high RPM motorcycle engines are different from high RPM race car engines.
- Ester synthetic oil has numerous advantages for high performance motorcycle engines. Superior evaporation loss (NOACK Volatility) at high temperatures. HTHS (high temperature high shear) is typically double most “synthetic” oils. Straight cut gears inhigh performance motorcycle engines can rip car oil apart in no time. Ester is also used as an additive to soften oil seals and prevent leaks. Ester molecules are attracted to metal and don’t drain away when the engine is off. Ect ect
- The newest motorcycle oil standards are designed to meet emissions standards and protect the catalytic converter. If you don’t have a catalytic converter, older motorcycle oil standards are superior. Most of the common motorcycle oils are a blend of API Group 4 (PAO) and Easter. They’re decent oils, but not what I think most Ducati owners on this forum are looking for. Europe has more Ester synthetic oil choices. America is limited to Red Line (Power Sport) or Motul 300V (motorcycle oil). If you’re still using the catalytic converter, verify the oil is compatible.
- Real racing oil is typically lower viscosity for less resistance inside the engine. That’s where the new Ducati Race oil gets the extra power. Lower viscosity also has higher wear. Real race engines are overhauled frequently.
- Oil leaks typically come from a warped surface due to extreme heat or poor assembly. Chemical “stop leaks” won’t work. Split or nicked O-rings are another common leak. Normally poor assembly. Gaskets and sealants normally fail from heat cycles over time. Sealants come in a wide range of qualities. You get what you pay for. Pay extra for the highest quality high temperature, and chemical resistance. You won’t find these in any Parts Store. If you’re searching for an oil leak, the old school leak tracer spray still works great. It sprays on like spray powder.
Click to expand...

I would like to clarify and add additional information to my original post. If you look closely at the labels on Motul 300V “Road Racing” and their “off road” oils, you’ll notice a change in the Road Racing 300V. It now says “Organic Base”. The off road 300V still says “Ester base”. This is a big difference. Ester base oil is superior to organic base oil. I’ve noticed Motul’s automotive 300V oils also changed to the “organic” verbiage. I suspect the reason is so that Motul can get the API certification for their higher selling automotive and street motorcycle oil. Off road does not need to comply with emissions regulations.
I’m not feeling as warm and fussy about Motul these days. It’s still excellent oil, but I’m interested in the absolute best oil for our motorcycles. I know there are lots of options, but I prefer to stick with a more factual approach. One oil I forgot to mention, is Maxima “Extra”. This is a API Group 5 Ester synthetic oil that comes in all the usual viscosities. Their 10W/60 and 15W/50 would be the most common for our use. What really stands out on their Technical Data Sheet is the VI (Viscosity Index). The VI is well over 210 for both of these oils. VI tells you how fast the oil shears down. Or, how well does the oil maintain its original viscosity. Straight cut gears in high performance motorcycle engines is very hard on the oil. That’s one reason automotive oil is not good in a dry clutch motorcycle. Automotive oils shear down very quickly in a motorcycle. The lower the VI, the faster the oil breaks down. Motul 300V is about 180. Mobil One motorcycle oils are about 160. Maxima “Extra” has the highest VI I can find. Oil companies often don’t publish all of their technical data. That means the consumer must infer things from the data they do publish. In order to have a VI above 210, the oil must also have very high quality in other important areas. The HTHS and NOACK volatility must also be very good. Maxima Extra will also have double the zinc. The only other high zinc ester Synthetic motorcycle oil is Red Line Power Sport. If you want to continue with 300V, I would use the off road version.
One last thing, Maxima Extra is the most expensive of all these oils. Ester base stocks are very expensive, but also the highest quality.
 
VYRUS said:
I would like to clarify and add additional information to my original post. If you look closely at the labels on Motul 300V “Road Racing” and their “off road” oils, you’ll notice a change in the Road Racing 300V. It now says “Organic Base”. The off road 300V still says “Ester base”. This is a big difference. Ester base oil is superior to organic base oil. I’ve noticed Motul’s automotive 300V oils also changed to the “organic” verbiage. I suspect the reason is so that Motul can get the API certification for their higher selling automotive and street motorcycle oil. Off road does not need to comply with emissions regulations.
I’m not feeling as warm and fussy about Motul these days. It’s still excellent oil, but I’m interested in the absolute best oil for our motorcycles. I know there are lots of options, but I prefer to stick with a more factual approach. One oil I forgot to mention, is Maxima “Extra”. This is a API Group 5 Ester synthetic oil that comes in all the usual viscosities. Their 10W/60 and 15W/50 would be the most common for our use. What really stands out on their Technical Data Sheet is the VI (Viscosity Index). The VI is well over 210 for both of these oils. VI tells you how fast the oil shears down. Or, how well does the oil maintain its original viscosity. Straight cut gears in high performance motorcycle engines is very hard on the oil. That’s one reason automotive oil is not good in a dry clutch motorcycle. Automotive oils shear down very quickly in a motorcycle. The lower the VI, the faster the oil breaks down. Motul 300V is about 180. Mobil One motorcycle oils are about 160. Maxima “Extra” has the highest VI I can find. Oil companies often don’t publish all of their technical data. That means the consumer must infer things from the data they do publish. In order to have a VI above 210, the oil must also have very high quality in other important areas. The HTHS and NOACK volatility must also be very good. Maxima Extra will also have double the zinc. The only other high zinc ester Synthetic motorcycle oil is Red Line Power Sport. If you want to continue with 300V, I would use the off road version.
One last thing, Maxima Extra is the most expensive of all these oils. Ester base stocks are very expensive, but also the highest quality.
Click to expand...

How about Eneos?
 
craig bush said:
How about Eneos?
Click to expand...

Eneos GP4 10w/50 motorcycle oil is API Group 4. It is not ester based. Its VI is 167. It’s actually close to the Motul 300V with the organic base stock. Their automotive top level oil is an ester PAO blend. It has VI of 197, but it’s not for motorcycles. This is a good example of how you can be fooled if you don’t clearly understand the basic differences in oils. You can use a motorcycle oil in a gas car or truck with no problem. Except for emissions, and I don’t let that bother me. I use Red Line Power Sport in my truck.
Oil companies are sneaky. They make significant changes and make them sound very innocuous. If you want a real eye opener, read the fine print in some of their legal disclaimers. That’s where they sometimes tell you their advertising is BS.
 

Similar threads

NYCV4S
V4 owners - 15w50 oil reports with testing - Motul 300v / Redline Power Sports / Motul 7100 - Part 1
6 7 8
Replies
145
Views
6K
SuperDomestique
SuperDomestique
F
2018 Panigale V4S bits of gold in oil, some questions on next steps
Replies
19
Views
504
shade
shade
V
Problems and Performance Over Engine Life - v4r and v4s
2
Replies
26
Views
2K
SuperDomestique
SuperDomestique
V
Severe issues with 2023 Panigale V4R. Need help.
6 7 8
Replies
156
Views
8K
Lefty
Lefty
duc
2025 Ducati Panigale V4: Aerodynamics Enhanced by CFD Analysis
Replies
1
Views
501
duc
duc

Register CTA

Register on Ducati Forum! This sidebar will go away, and you will see fewer ads.

Recent Discussions

Back
Top