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The 2 guys I ride with that have them basically shrug their shoulders and let the bike do the talking.....
July 2013 Cycle World - BMWHP4 vs 1199R
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The 2 guys I ride with that have them basically shrug their shoulders and let the bike do the talking.....
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To me, HP4 looks like a blue shark from the sides.
From the front, looks like 1000RR got punched on one eye.
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- Overland Park, KS
this magazine is available thru zinio which is a pretty good app for vechicle magazines, it's $4,99 and there are always $5 (free) codes or credits various places online.
Don't really have to defend them. The only comments I've heard in person have been admiration or lust.
To me, it makes the bike distinctive. Walkkng down the street people know she's a BMW. They don't have to walk up to look for the manufacturer. The asymmetrical styling of the fairings just adds to it. BMW is basically reasserting "this bike is DIFFERENT". I like that.
Somebody in my area had an HP4 dynoed this weekend at a bike event and it put out a massive 175hp. I don't know if they had to set it up for the dyno like you do the Panigale but a plain stock base S1000rr dynoed soon after and it made 171hp. I have a slip-on and the tuneboy on my Panigale and also have a dynojet dyno that I used to tune the panigale. In the end the Panigale made 185hp. I am working on getting an HP4 on the dyno but most of the other guys with them around here won't get them dynoed. Even a plain S1000rr with a full pipe and tune would be nice to see the results on the same dyno. I guess I just don't believe the HP hype on these things with people claiming 195hp with full pipes and tuned. If that is true then they must be really detuned from the factory.
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- Joined
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- Manila Philippines
I'm sorry, but that view, and looking again at the Beemer's headlights made me laugh
IMHO, the 748-998, 848-1198's and the current Panigale are the best looking bikes there is compared to their respective competition. nothing comes close. Ducati is the reason why I started to ride.
But on the other hand as motorcycle enthusiast, we must also know what the competition is doing right. the s1000rr is selling quite well so they must have done something right. If Panigale Beats the crap out of the s1000rr in the looks department, the s10000rr can beat the Panigale in other areas. To think that the s1000rr is bmw's first serious try in the sport liter bike market, can't imagine what they would do on their next generation skrr.
But over all, If I were to keep only one bike, it will be the Panigale. the sound is amazing, it looks awesome, it is so light and handles very well. I just hate it when I encounter "stop and go"traffic. then again the bike is not initialy built for street use any way.
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For sure. Tried running the HP4 down one of my favourite roads today. Came up a bit short of the top speed that I would make on the Pani but was more confident powering through the sweepers. That said I think I've for the Pani set up so well its as stable as the BM at speed. No contest on sound though
I noticed the front amber reflectors, did the Pani have them in WA?
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No it's thankfully free of reflectors!
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the bikes to be compared are the HP4 and the R... those are the 2 top op the line versions.. when keeping the 2013 S , a comparison to the stock 1000RR is the better match.. or even more interesting: S, HP4 and R .. when at assen, a magazine was doing het same thing ... they said, ' well no dealer has one we can ride' ..
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I actually think this is where price becomes relevant. The HP4 standard is minus some of carbon and levers but has the mechanicals, race exhaust and lighter wheels of the competition version and here costs $30k, essentially the same a base Pani. So the comparison should really be between bikes of similar cost because in the real world (not a mag) that would be your choice. i.e. if I had $30k would I buy the High Performance model BM or the base level 1199. Price has to be a consideration to ensure a level playing field.
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that is if you're counting bang for the buck.. , not if you're gaging who's best.. when counting , Duc will always loose... you can have a beemer for racing purposes ( not prepped) and undone of the warranty for 18K ... nothing will beat that...
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Ye but surely its about more than 'bang for buck'. The S1000RR wasn't as captivating or as technologicaly advanced as the 1199S but for the HP4 is, and unless 'money is no object' then this is relevant.
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Not sure I'd take a HP4 over the 1199s. I did throw my legs over a HP4 and pondered it for a bit... but found the bimmer, just didn't grab me all that much. Not enough to swap the Pani for...
Mind you.. I don't think I'm as performance orientated as others on this forum. Fit and feel were very high on list when shortlisting the field.
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I was actually going to pick up a HP4 before I even thought about the pani. When I saw the HP4 in person I was like...."hmm just looks like a regular S1000rr to me really". Not that it's bad...but for the price I wanted something that looks as good as it performs. If the pani is a tad slower I'm cool with that....It's the one I find myself wanting to always go stare at in the garage. I never felt that way with my old s1000 as good of a bike as that was.
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Trauma...answering that question
So Trauma, you asked if I agree with this article. I've read it in full now (was quite a lightweight article considering how much stuffing around they did with the bikes) The sound trap/coasting thing would have created some BS lap times surely? So I'd expect the R to have been quicker right?
Anyway thing that stood out for me was the 'tail wagging' under brakes that both of them experience on the Panigale - exactly my experience exactly with my S model at the track. They say that they solved it by putting the EBC to its "most free-wheeling" setting but does that mean 3 so the EBC allows the wheels to spin with minimum intervention, or does it mean Off so its free from Intervention? I suspect its the former but I will have to experiment. The Pani is nervous at the track but its 'predictably and consistently nervous' so you get used to it and ultimately I don't think it hampers times.(I'm a novice though!)
He makes an incorrect point about the HP4 DDC (dynamic damping control) the front is also active (not static as stated) but in terms of adjustment it gives you an integrated adjustment (i.e. you cannot fine tune rebound & compression separately) from the dash, so its either harder or softer.
He doesn't really go into any other detail that's useful from what I can see. I haven't taken the HP4 to the track yet so no data there but I will say that it doesn't squat under acceleration like the Pani did before I swapped out the .85 rear spring, and overall my impressions of the BM is a bike that inspires confidence at speed through the bends.
I'm really still getting used to the BM but at the moment it feels less urgent/immediate than the Pani but the Pani was already lighter, and now with 7kg less exhaust and a much stronger tune , and it feels like its easier to spin up to high speed, but more nervous when it gets there. I'm still shy of cracking open the BM fully so its probably not a fair comparison at this stage.
From a day to day perspective I don't think the Pani will ever get ridden into town again! The HP4 is so much easier (and cooler) and street legal, so its the automatic choice for any short or urban blast. When it comes to a country weekend blast then its a much harder choice. For a long trip, a 2,000km+ ride, I reckon the BM would win me over (unless there was a track at the end of it). On the track I wait to see whether the more confidence inspiring suspension translates to faster times or more fun. (Not long to find out as I have a track day on the 22nd).
I stick to my comments though that if I had to choose only one of them, I would pick the Panigale. It's worth noting that if you had given me the HP4 when I was early in my Pani ownership it might have been a different story - when the suspension was still giving me grief. Good suspension setup was critical for me.
So Trauma, you asked if I agree with this article. I've read it in full now (was quite a lightweight article considering how much stuffing around they did with the bikes) The sound trap/coasting thing would have created some BS lap times surely? So I'd expect the R to have been quicker right?
Anyway thing that stood out for me was the 'tail wagging' under brakes that both of them experience on the Panigale - exactly my experience exactly with my S model at the track. They say that they solved it by putting the EBC to its "most free-wheeling" setting but does that mean 3 so the EBC allows the wheels to spin with minimum intervention, or does it mean Off so its free from Intervention? I suspect its the former but I will have to experiment. The Pani is nervous at the track but its 'predictably and consistently nervous' so you get used to it and ultimately I don't think it hampers times.(I'm a novice though!)
He makes an incorrect point about the HP4 DDC (dynamic damping control) the front is also active (not static as stated) but in terms of adjustment it gives you an integrated adjustment (i.e. you cannot fine tune rebound & compression separately) from the dash, so its either harder or softer.
He doesn't really go into any other detail that's useful from what I can see. I haven't taken the HP4 to the track yet so no data there but I will say that it doesn't squat under acceleration like the Pani did before I swapped out the .85 rear spring, and overall my impressions of the BM is a bike that inspires confidence at speed through the bends.
I'm really still getting used to the BM but at the moment it feels less urgent/immediate than the Pani but the Pani was already lighter, and now with 7kg less exhaust and a much stronger tune , and it feels like its easier to spin up to high speed, but more nervous when it gets there. I'm still shy of cracking open the BM fully so its probably not a fair comparison at this stage.
From a day to day perspective I don't think the Pani will ever get ridden into town again! The HP4 is so much easier (and cooler) and street legal, so its the automatic choice for any short or urban blast. When it comes to a country weekend blast then its a much harder choice. For a long trip, a 2,000km+ ride, I reckon the BM would win me over (unless there was a track at the end of it). On the track I wait to see whether the more confidence inspiring suspension translates to faster times or more fun. (Not long to find out as I have a track day on the 22nd).
I stick to my comments though that if I had to choose only one of them, I would pick the Panigale. It's worth noting that if you had given me the HP4 when I was early in my Pani ownership it might have been a different story - when the suspension was still giving me grief. Good suspension setup was critical for me.
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I have found with the Panigale it is a more "nervous" bike than the BMW for sure .
To me it is the trade off between a bike that turns in quick and is agile to a bike that is a little slower in turning in but more stable at speed .
The Panigale on the track feels small and more like a race bike to me . I also have the same experience with the tail wagging on the Pani but feels controled will try with EPC off as well .
I have not ridden a bike with dynamic damping contol but would be keen . A recent suspension school I did with suspension guru Dave Moss his thoughts was its the best suspension on the market .
The Pani feels like a race bike .
To me it is the trade off between a bike that turns in quick and is agile to a bike that is a little slower in turning in but more stable at speed .
The Panigale on the track feels small and more like a race bike to me . I also have the same experience with the tail wagging on the Pani but feels controled will try with EPC off as well .
I have not ridden a bike with dynamic damping contol but would be keen . A recent suspension school I did with suspension guru Dave Moss his thoughts was its the best suspension on the market .
The Pani feels like a race bike .
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- Apr 9, 2012
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- Perth, Western Australia
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