the death of the panigale?

Macattack said:

wsbk and motogp are apple and oranges.


I think the success had this year by ducati is partly due to the development direction rossi gave them . I think they were moving too slow for rossi .

and it is a v4 so not relevant to the death of the ltwin

IMO wsbk is mostly about the rider more so than motogp , because the bikes are so much closer

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development that rossi gave them do you even watch motogp. rossi set them back years. gigi changed the whole thing about 2.5 months ago and it had NOTHING TO DO WITH ROSSI INPUT.

Mark also remember Rossi barely had any say when he was on the GP Duc. Ducati even admitted that. That's why they split. Stoner also had almost no input either. If Stoner and Rossi had say in the bike and development they would have never been beat and Rossi would still be on a Duc, Stoner still would have retired probably lol. Also look what Rossi did upon arriving back at Yamaha will basically full input and development. The M1 didn't get itself there on it's own.


Now I know we will have an hour phone call after this

Rossi's input made Ducati realize how much their bike sucked, cuz they wouldn't believe Stoner, or Hayden, or Melandri. For Rossi to completely bail on the project, real eye opener.

Rossi didn't make the bike better, but his departure definitely led to some drastic changes in the DuAudi organization.

mark419ny said:

development that rossi gave them do you even watch motogp. rossi set them back years. gigi changed the whole thing about 2.5 months ago and it had NOTHING TO DO WITH ROSSI INPUT.

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calm down i watch the races I just don't follow all the inside stuff . And I didn't say development by itself I said partly due to the development direction he gave them Like a compass . with out the rossi debacle Ducati might still be going the wrong direction .


but either way your taking this thing way to serious and iirc its a wsbk /panigale topic nothing to do with Rossi .

Mark is just kicking up some dust because Rossi is currently doing better than his hero Marquez.

Macattack said:

wsbk and motogp are apple and oranges.


I think the success had this year by ducati is partly due to the development direction rossi gave them . I think they were moving too slow for rossi .

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1. yes, rossi's main if people actually remember, was that it was taking ducati too long to develop and make parts for them to test and improve with. It wasn't that he had no input into the development...that's basically why they brought him on...they thought that he, being the best, could help them develop the best bike. But as you'll hear with some riders, some are riders, and some are developers...
Such is why we hear so much bitchin' from Melandri. He's developing now, and doesn't want to.
Hayden did way better than Rossi did on the GP14.x and wasn't listed to anywhere near as much. And look at how the satellite teams are doing on the GP14's...Very good!!
This is due to the organization and engineering changes brought in by Gigi. Nothing to do with Rossi.
Especially the Pani which was in development before he even arrived.

b9009b said:

Mark also remember Rossi barely had any say when he was on the GP Duc. Ducati even admitted that. That's why they split. Stoner also had almost no input either. If Stoner and Rossi had say in the bike and development they would have never been beat and Rossi would still be on a Duc, Stoner still would have retired probably lol. Also look what Rossi did upon arriving back at Yamaha will basically full input and development. The M1 didn't get itself there on it's own.


Now I know we will have an hour phone call after this

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ok mike you prove my point if he had no say how did he develop the bike. second the m1 before rossi got there was the championship bike by jlo. (also won by rossi 09 and 08) he won the 2010 and 2012 world championship i think he had a little to do with the m1 develpment.

Eleven 99 said:

Mark is just kicking up some dust because Rossi is currently doing better than his hero Marquez.

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rossi is doing better than everyone right now. cant say he isnt. i actully enjoy his press conferences and find his demener very entertaining. never had a problem with the guy.

yes i like marquez and stoner much more than rossi because i think both are more talented riders.

the problem i have with rossi as i have said in the past are his fans are like ny jet fans. they dont stop no matter what and to listen to it drives me nuts. ive been hearing for 5 years hes back or how its never his fault now he won 5 races in 5 years and everything else is forgotten. if jlo or mm catch him then what will i hear?

anyway makes for a good season

marc is talented, stoner is talented but acts like a little girl all the time. Cant say how many times I thought he was going to cry on camera. Rossi is a living legend and continues to prove that. He's almost twice the age of Marc and is doing things not even Marc can do at the moment. Marcs age definitely shows. He's obviously a beast of a rider but he acts like a child. Rossi is showing his age too, his interviews he clearly is laughing at all the drama from the other guys and its great. He's consistent with starting at close to middle pack and gaining a podium. Marc is evvvvvverywhere. I understand its not all completely the rider but damn rossi is sure killing it right now.

mark419ny said:

rossi is doing better than everyone right now. cant say he isnt. i actully enjoy his press conferences and find his demener very entertaining. never had a problem with the guy.

yes i like marquez and stoner much more than rossi because i think both are more talented riders.

the problem i have with rossi as i have said in the past are his fans are like ny jet fans. they dont stop no matter what and to listen to it drives me nuts. ive been hearing for 5 years hes back or how its never his fault now he won 5 races in 5 years and everything else is forgotten. if jlo or mm catch him then what will i hear?

anyway makes for a good season

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So in response to some Rossi fans claiming nothing is his fault, you claim that Ducati's declining performance prior to Gigi was all Rossi's fault?

I interpret people saying "Rossi is back" to mean that he's able to fight for wins again. It doesn't mean that Rossi is going to run away with the championship, but he is a top contender again.

Jake213 said:

He's obviously a beast of a rider but he acts like a child. Marc is evvvvvverywhere. I understand its not all completely the rider but damn rossi is sure killing it right now.

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how so? I'm not a MM fan, but I don't see him doing anything wrong or stepping out of line. He's a stand up guy...and right now, he's the best. No one else has been able make/break so many records since he came into the series. Start mid pack and get the win... win from pole..get so many damn poles... he's done it all
He's a still in line for the championship again...This season only look down for him because he's not winning EVERY race like the did last year! But, ppl gotta realize, to win the first 11 races of the season is extremely abnormal!

Eleven 99 said:

but he is a top contender again.

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right, that's all he is. a contender. Marquez is on a climb back up, Dovi is still near the top...and you def can't count out Lorenzo yet...

If anything, I'm calling for Marc Marquez to take it again this year. I just think he's the best out there.
the ducati's are in the hunt, but still need some tweaking...

Jake213 said:

marc is talented, stoner is talented but acts like a little girl all the time. Cant say how many times I thought he was going to cry on camera. Rossi is a living legend and continues to prove that. He's almost twice the age of Marc and is doing things not even Marc can do at the moment. Marcs age definitely shows. He's obviously a beast of a rider but he acts like a child. Rossi is showing his age too, his interviews he clearly is laughing at all the drama from the other guys and its great. He's consistent with starting at close to middle pack and gaining a podium. Marc is evvvvvverywhere. I understand its not all completely the rider but damn rossi is sure killing it right now.

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and this is exactly what i am talking about. thought marc was going to cry his interviews are just as entertaining as rossi are quite funny. as a matter of fact marc models himself after VR to give interviews and make himself accessible. marc has also changed the way the gp class is racing with his ridding style. rossi has actually changed his style to mimic what marc is doing. so to say rossi is doing things that marc cant is just being ridiculous. what hasnt marc done lets see he is in the gp class 3 years now has won the last 2 championships and has one win out of 5 right now (rossi has 2) season is early. oh and lets not forget 4 world championships in 5 years as VR has 5 wins in 5 years.

next

krissrock said:

how so? I'm not a MM fan, but I don't see him doing anything wrong or stepping out of line. He's a stand up guy...and right now, he's the best. No one else has been able make/break so many records since he came into the series. Start mid pack and get the win... win from pole..get so many damn poles... he's done it all
He's a still in line for the championship again...This season only look down for him because he's not winning EVERY race like the did last year! But, ppl gotta realize, to win the first 11 races of the season is extremely abnormal!

right, that's all he is. a contender. Marquez is on a climb back up, Dovi is still near the top...and you def can't count out Lorenzo yet...

If anything, I'm calling for Marc Marquez to take it again this year. I just think he's the best out there.
the ducati's are in the hunt, but still need some tweaking...

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thank goodness for some reason

krissrock said:

right, that's all he is. a contender. Marquez is on a climb back up, Dovi is still near the top...and you def can't count out Lorenzo yet...

If anything, I'm calling for Marc Marquez to take it again this year. I just think he's the best out there.
the ducati's are in the hunt, but still need some tweaking...

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A contender is exactly what Rossi needs to be right now. He's the oldest in the field and he is riding very well. Rossi has a great shot at winning the championship this year. What more can he ask for?

Marc is obviously great, but he makes mistakes like anyone else and is not guaranteed anything.

Going to be one hell of a season, it's still early and it's already good.

Charliem90 said:

You'll know Audi is out to kill the brand when Ducati produces a 4-cyl.

If the next ones a 4cyl, Ducati will have gotten their last sport dollar from me.

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Why?

In the end of the day Ducati had to make changes within its Corse Dep't. Whilst it did very well up unto 2008 with only Stoner, Bayliss and Capirossi able to truelly ride it. You have to have 2 riders who can get the best out of it on Race Weekend. You only have to look at what TB21 did in Valencia 2006 and who backed him up? Why because he asked for certain people in his pits. Such as Ernesto, Davide Tardozzi and Ciabatti amongst them. Ducati couldn't continue the way it was going. Gigi has done an amazing job and the factory and the fans feel happy with his efforts and we are now seeing the fruits of his labour. A race team also requires a huge input from both riders and the riders expect a quick turnaround too. Again with a lead rider like Dovi for EG and Gigi you have 2 people who can drive a project forward and its now showing great results. A win or 2 would be the required achievements. However seeing Ducati fight for Podiums week in, week out, its become interesting again. Dovi is happy with the progress and Chaz is progressing well too tbh. Ianonne will get there and the jury is still out with DG. DG is a flawed talent, on his day he's mega, but when he's off he's nowhere.

Whichever way Ducati go, MGP & WSBK, needs to be defined and kept seperated. WSBK for road and MGP as a 1 off Proto-types. WTCC are road derived cars, but you can't buy F1 or Indy Cars of the peg in the same way can you? MGP & WSBK needs to be the same. Thought years ago when the 1098R was at its end of life a V4 Ducati was on the cards and often thought it would happen at some point. Whether it does or not doesn't worry me too much so long as Ducati has a good chance of winning in whichever category its entered.

Samieb said:

However seeing Ducati fight for Podiums week in, week out, its become interesting again.

Whichever way Ducati go, MGP & WSBK, needs to be defined and kept seperated. WSBK for road and MGP as a 1 off Proto-types.

Thought years ago when the 1098R was at its end of life a V4 Ducati was on the cards and often thought it would happen at some point. Whether it does or not doesn't worry me too much so long as Ducati has a good chance of winning in whichever category its entered.

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I wouldn't be mad about a v4 either. And to see Ducati on the top is really all I watch for. Hence why I don't bother watching AMA (whenever it does come on) it's nothing but yamahas!

i'm actually quite interested to see what Audi assists them with. We already see VW using Ducati engines... so Audi/Lamb/VW are definitely not interested in diluting the Ducati brand. IF anything, they're definitely helping them manage their money better...
am I correct that Wroom! didn't happen this year? how many millions of dollars stayed on the books because of that?

I know you guys may roast me for this, but when it comes to WSBK, i'd really like to see them allow the electrics join in the fray. If those companies can homolgate their bike and keep pace the 18-22 laps the WSBK's do, i'm all for seeing them compete.
and MotoGP, id' really like to see them do whatever they wanted. I understand the whole cost cutting thing...Maybe they should be allowed to make another no restriction race series...How else are they really going to innovate!

^^ good read.

Every acceleration out of the corners is agony, the power delivery is too brutal, the Panigale moves around too much and the riders are unable to push hard. That’s exactly the opposite of the Kawasaki, which when it comes out of the hairpins looks like it’s on rails, despite having a much more powerful engine.

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That's pretty much what I observed when I had my 1199 R and 10R. The Panigale's power delivery is brutal which makes it difficult to dial in exactly the amount of power you want coming out of corners. Let the revs drop too much and there's no power, but keep the engine in the powerband and it spits out massive power in a way that's difficult to control when you're on the edge of the tire. The 10R's power comes on very linear and smooth it's easier to ride fast.

I think Ducati should do like Yamaha did with the new R1 and focus on making their next superbike easy to ride.