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On the 1201 site they indicate how the components used on the SL will trickle down to other future models - this is, of course, why they do these things (develop and sell "special bikes") to be able to eventually have better components for everyone within their model line up (witness the desmosedici)

I am going through the site and can't see any indication of this.. maybe I am missing something.

My feeling was that with the EVO rules the motor parts like cylinders, pistons, crankshafts, camshaft, con rods and crank case are to be left as stock. With cost cutting being a factor too and if they plan to race the R, I am not sure if they can use the SL motor in it. My guess is only the SL suspension would replace what the R has. I could be wrong here though..
 
I am going through the site and can't see any indication of this.. maybe I am missing something.

My feeling was that with the EVO rules the motor parts like cylinders, pistons, crankshafts, camshaft, con rods and crank case are to be left as stock. With cost cutting being a factor too and if they plan to race the R, I am not sure if they can use the SL motor in it. My guess is only the SL suspension would replace what the R has. I could be wrong here though..

last paragraph of Design:

".......1199 super leggera sets new standards of motorcycle construction paving the way for the entire Superbike line up in Ducatis never ending quest to advance performance"
 
last paragraph of Design:

".......1199 super leggera sets new standards of motorcycle construction paving the way for the entire Superbike line up in Ducatis never ending quest to advance performance"

Good catch.. in that case looks like the Tungsten balanced crank and the SBK aluminium alloy piston would probably make its way just to the R to be able to run with the EVO rules changes for 2015.

As far as the suspension goes, my feeling is that the race suspension would probably be SL exclusive but they would fit those on an R with the SL motor in it and run that bike in the races as there is no limitation on suspensions.
 
I still do not understand why Ducati put the DES on the R...Surely that bike should have real Ohlins and maybe even something of an active/dynamic nature not the DES???
 
I still do not understand why Ducati put the DES on the R...Surely that bike should have real Ohlins and maybe even something of an active/dynamic nature not the DES???

the DEs are real Ohlins.. it just carries a little electric motor so you do not have to get out a screwdriver and count the clicks... it s all a des does...

i changed mine to normal buttons on the ttx rear...
 
I still do not understand why Ducati put the DES on the R...Surely that bike should have real Ohlins and maybe even something of an active/dynamic nature not the DES???

Because superbike rules allow the complete suspension to be swapped out, so there's no need to put real high end parts on the homologated bike, which has always been the purpose of the R. Ducati also has to commit to 2000 bikes. Super high end suspension drives cost up and could make selling 2000 bikes difficult.
 
What standard is that?

You were saying that suspension will get thrown away from this bike when its tracked... so I guess I am struggling to understand why they would fit this suspension.... why not fit the Ttx etc??? I know I can buy the FGRT and TTX for maybe $4000... After all the R is a track bike..Right??
 
My understanding of what Ducati will race in WSBK with the EVO rule changes will be essentially a Panigale R with the following parts taken from the SL design

1. Aluminium alloy pistons
2. Tungsten balanced crankshaft
3. Ohlins TTX Titanium rear shock
4. Ohlins FL916 front shock

As far as the homologation/2000 production model minimum requirement goes, they may make the 2015 R with just the motor parts swapped out and keep the same suspension that the current R has. Not sure how much of an increase in cost the motor parts will take but I am suspecting in the 35k to 40k range to try to maintain that cost barrier.
 
I think it's all about cost. I bet Ducati gets the DES Ohlins for dirt cheap, and it does pretty good for the typical owner. The stuff they use in WSBK is on a totally different level.
 
the Ti spring on the TTX is bling as there are almost no different strengths in TI .. Alstare runs/ran 140Kg (!!) springs so expect those springs to stick around for a while..

a wsbk FGR front including brakes/masters = 22K
 
Alstare and Ducati are parting ways so idk if the spring you're talking about is from them or from Ohlins..
 
Since the official Panigale Superleggera specs were released, many of us have contentiously discussed its value and whether Ducati’s heavy marketing, hyping, and high pricing of the Panigale SL are justified. Because of this, I’ve been interested in quantifying what value the Panigale SL offers over the next best Ducati offering (Panigale R) and comparing that to the value the Desmosedici RR offered over the next best Ducati bike of its time. Obviously the overall value someone attributes to a particular item is subjective, so for the purposes of this examination I attempted to quantify value based off pricing differentials and a very select set of performance characteristics: horsepower, torque, and kerb weight. Other factors that contribute to value by offering uniqueness or additional performance enhancing qualities (e.g., DTC, launch control, inclusion of exotic materials, number of units produced, etc.) were not factored but should certainly be separately considered.

The model I contrived to derive performance values is very simplistic. Each horsepower unit, lb-ft. of torque, and lb. of weight is equivalent to one point with advantageous differentials always being calculated in the positive and disadvantageous differentials always being calculated in the negative. Differentials between the bikes in each category are combined into an overall point total where they are then divided by the price differential and converted into a percentage. As differentials increase, total points correspondingly increase and must be weighed against the price differential to determine a value percentage. As value increases (performance advantage divided by cost to make the jump from the next best), so too does the performance value percentage.

The Desmosedici RR was announced in 2006 during the last year of reign for the highly successful 999R; however, production did not begin until 2007 and the first unit was not actually delivered until January 2008 - the same year the much touted 1098R was released. Due to this spread, performance value calculations for the Desmosedici were made using both the 999R and the 1098R for comparisons.

My findings were as follows:

Desmosedici Value Comparison:
  • Ducati 999R: 85.5 points with a price differential of $41,005 = .2085%
  • Ducati 1098R: 16.5 points with a price differential of $32,505 = 0.0507%

Panigale Superleggera Value Comparison:
  • Ducati 1199R: 32.5 points with a price differential of 35,005 = 0.0928%

Conclusion:
The Desmosedici RR was an extraordinary step above everything else at the time of its unveiling and offered a tremendous performance value compared to the 2006 999R, but by the time it was actually delivered and in the hands of the public, the performance value it offered over the next best performing bike (1098R) was considerably less. Based on these figures, the Panigale SL not only matches the performance value offered by the Desmosedici RR when it was finally delivered, but it nearly doubles it! Thus, it could be argued that if an argument could have been made for purchasing the Desmosedici based solely on its performance characteristics and price compared to the rest of the Ducati lineup at that time, then an equally strong, if not stronger, argument could be made to justify purchasing the Panigale SL for the same reasons.
 
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Since the official Panigale Superleggera specs were released, many of us have contentiously discussed its value and whether Ducati's heavy marketing, hyping, and high pricing of the Panigale SL are justified. Because of this, I've been interested in quantifying what value the Panigale SL offers over the next best Ducati offering (Panigale R) and comparing that to the value the Desmosedici RR offered over the next best Ducati bike of its time. Obviously the overall value someone attributes to a particular item is subjective, so for the purposes of this examination I attempted to quantify value based off pricing differentials and a very select set of performance characteristics: horsepower, torque, and kerb weight. Other factors that contribute to value by offering uniqueness or additional performance enhancing qualities (e.g., DTC, launch control, inclusion of exotic materials, number of units produced, etc.) were not factored but should certainly be separately considered.

The model I contrived to derive performance values is very simplistic. Each horsepower unit, lb-ft. of torque, and lb. of weight is equivalent to one point with advantageous differentials always being calculated in the positive and disadvantageous differentials always being calculated in the negative. Differentials between the bikes in each category are combined into an overall point total where they are then divided by the price differential and converted into a percentage. As differentials increase, total points correspondingly increase and must be weighed against the price differential to determine a value percentage. As value increases (performance advantage divided by cost to make the jump from the next best), so too does the performance value percentage.

The Desmosedici RR was announced in 2006 during the last year of reign for the highly successful 999R; however, production did not begin until 2007 and the first unit was not actually delivered until January 2008 - the same year the much touted 1098R was released. Due to this spread, performance value calculations for the Desmosedici were made using both the 999R and the 1098R for comparisons.

My findings were as follows:

Desmosedici Value Comparison:
  • Ducati 999R: 85.5 points with a price differential of $41,005 = .2085%
  • Ducati 1098R: 16.5 points with a price differential of $32,505 = 0.0507%

Panigale Superleggera Value Comparison:
  • Ducati 1199R: 32.5 points with a price differential of 35,005 = 0.0928%

Conclusion:
The Desmosedici RR was an extraordinary step above everything else at the time of its unveiling and offered a tremendous performance value compared to the 2006 999R, but by the time it was actually delivered and in the hands of the public, the performance value it offered over the next best performing bike (1098R) was considerably less. Based on these figures, the Panigale SL not only matches the performance value offered by the Desmosedici RR when it was finally delivered, but it nearly doubles it! Thus, it could be argued that if an argument could have been made for purchasing the Desmosedici based solely on its performance characteristics and price compared to the rest of the Ducati lineup at that time, then an equally strong, if not stronger, argument could be made to justify purchasing the Panigale SL for the same reasons.

Interesting theory. Don't let Billy Beane know where you live... LOL. A bad joke referring to the movie Moneyball where they quantify baseball talent. :D
 
the other point is the desmosedici required specially trained mechanics to service and parts cost were pretty significant


Since the official Panigale Superleggera specs were released, many of us have contentiously discussed its value and whether Ducati's heavy marketing, hyping, and high pricing of the Panigale SL are justified. Because of this, I've been interested in quantifying what value the Panigale SL offers over the next best Ducati offering (Panigale R) and comparing that to the value the Desmosedici RR offered over the next best Ducati bike of its time. Obviously the overall value someone attributes to a particular item is subjective, so for the purposes of this examination I attempted to quantify value based off pricing differentials and a very select set of performance characteristics: horsepower, torque, and kerb weight. Other factors that contribute to value by offering uniqueness or additional performance enhancing qualities (e.g., DTC, launch control, inclusion of exotic materials, number of units produced, etc.) were not factored but should certainly be separately considered.

The model I contrived to derive performance values is very simplistic. Each horsepower unit, lb-ft. of torque, and lb. of weight is equivalent to one point with advantageous differentials always being calculated in the positive and disadvantageous differentials always being calculated in the negative. Differentials between the bikes in each category are combined into an overall point total where they are then divided by the price differential and converted into a percentage. As differentials increase, total points correspondingly increase and must be weighed against the price differential to determine a value percentage. As value increases (performance advantage divided by cost to make the jump from the next best), so too does the performance value percentage.

The Desmosedici RR was announced in 2006 during the last year of reign for the highly successful 999R; however, production did not begin until 2007 and the first unit was not actually delivered until January 2008 - the same year the much touted 1098R was released. Due to this spread, performance value calculations for the Desmosedici were made using both the 999R and the 1098R for comparisons.

My findings were as follows:

Desmosedici Value Comparison:
  • Ducati 999R: 85.5 points with a price differential of $41,005 = .2085%
  • Ducati 1098R: 16.5 points with a price differential of $32,505 = 0.0507%

Panigale Superleggera Value Comparison:
  • Ducati 1199R: 32.5 points with a price differential of 35,005 = 0.0928%

Conclusion:
The Desmosedici RR was an extraordinary step above everything else at the time of its unveiling and offered a tremendous performance value compared to the 2006 999R, but by the time it was actually delivered and in the hands of the public, the performance value it offered over the next best performing bike (1098R) was considerably less. Based on these figures, the Panigale SL not only matches the performance value offered by the Desmosedici RR when it was finally delivered, but it nearly doubles it! Thus, it could be argued that if an argument could have been made for purchasing the Desmosedici based solely on its performance characteristics and price compared to the rest of the Ducati lineup at that time, then an equally strong, if not stronger, argument could be made to justify purchasing the Panigale SL for the same reasons.
 
With the value of a dollar continuing to take a dump, spending $70k in today's economy is a better bargain than spending $70k in 2008. Therefore, in my opinion, making the SL a better bargain in comparison to a Desmo but as stated above, Desmo was still a whole different beast compared to anything in the market whereas the SL is a higher end R. Maybe even what a 2014 R should have been released as. Bit of a stretch there but still.
 
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