2012 vs 2015 chassis

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desmotesta said:
No offense but 99.5% of riders wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the two chassis on the "snake"...... if they can, its a phenomenon called Placebo

On a closed course, may be higher percentage of rider would be able to tell for sure

Congrats to the .5%..by that math they belong in WSBK if not in MotoGP

:)
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I doubt that. No offense but Im tired of people saying you can only tell on a track. That is pure BS. I use to be a Track elitest but try taking the Snake at 45MPH seems easy right? 100% of people would tell the difference. I'm not condoning breaking laws but it is what it is out here. Do the speed limt and sure you wont notice the difference.

You statement is like saying take a hyper or a multi and you wont notice the difference.
 
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If the 899 and the 1199 is pretty much the same chassis wise, it's a completely different animal. I haven't tried the 1199 though, but I have done a back to back comparison between a 899 and my own 1299..
 
You would only notice the -4mm swingarm pivot change if you were at the limit of traction with the prior 0mm setting on acceleration. When I tried it on mine on the track, it was an immediately obvious difference with the bike hooking up better. That was shown in the telemetry data as well with less wheel slip on the graph.
 
jarelj said:
You would only notice the -4mm swingarm pivot change if you were at the limit of traction with the prior 0mm setting on acceleration. When I tried it on mine on the track, it was an immediately obvious difference with the bike hooking up better. That was shown in the telemetry data as well with less wheel slip on the graph.
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Exactly! key words "limit of traction' this doesnt mean you have to be going 100+MPH on a track to notice it. You could be doing 45MPH in a 25 MPH turn and reach the limit of traction at that specific condition. There is a lot of conditions such as Temp, camber of the road, degree of turn, decreasing radius, lean angle, late or early turn in, on throttle etc. You dont have to be on a track to break traction. Hell JLo probably doesnt even notice it on the track as smooth as he ride but the above said 95.5% will because they are not as smooth/consistant as JLO on the tract or the street. The faster you go the more traction you will have.
 
I think it's more apparent on high-speed corner exits where you'd be getting a significant amount of throttle. In a 25mph corner exit, you'd be nowhere near full throttle, and the limit would be the wheelie factor rather than the tire sliding. It takes a lot to get the back end really loaded up on such a powerful bike.
 
i dont get the bashing of scrapper on this one. guy has been here forever, posts regularly with good input and has had plenty of seat time on the 1199 AND the 1299 so he is the perfect guy to ask. now he states what he has felt and its not good enough or you doubt him. the snake or whatever it is called, is probably a tough ride. im from ny and i road down in va and the road had a natural corkscrew in one area. is it a racetrack no but it was a damn hard ride where you had to pay attention and focus.

its funny when i had my m3 and then my 335is back to back and i said the 335is was a better street car than m3 and the guys on the forum bashed me. some had one or the other. i had both and you can tune the 335is you couldnt really tune the m3 at the time it was a v8. i was like dude i owned both back to back have you ever drove the 335 is. answer was no so he was going by magazines or hear say or whatever .

my point is if scrapper says he can tell the difference i am sure he can tell the difference. guy had a ridiculous 1199 and now a 1299 and he answered the question.
 
mark419ny said:
i dont get the bashing of scrapper on this one. guy has been here forever, posts regularly with good input and has had plenty of seat time on the 1199 AND the 1299 so he is the perfect guy to ask. now he states what he has felt and its not good enough or you doubt him. the snake or whatever it is called, is probably a tough ride. im from ny and i road down in va and the road had a natural corkscrew in one area. is it a racetrack no but it was a damn hard ride where you had to pay attention and focus.

its funny when i had my m3 and then my 335is back to back and i said the 335is was a better street car than m3 and the guys on the forum bashed me. some had one or the other. i had both and you can tune the 335is you couldnt really tune the m3 at the time it was a v8. i was like dude i owned both back to back have you ever drove the 335 is. answer was no so he was going by magazines or hear say or whatever .

my point is if scrapper says he can tell the difference i am sure he can tell the difference. guy had a ridiculous 1199 and now a 1299 and he answered the question.
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I had no idea he had a ridiculous 1199 . Must be true then;)
 
mark419ny said:
i dont get the bashing of scrapper on this one. guy has been here forever, posts regularly with good input and has had plenty of seat time on the 1199 AND the 1299 so he is the perfect guy to ask. now he states what he has felt and its not good enough or you doubt him. the snake or whatever it is called, is probably a tough ride. im from ny and i road down in va and the road had a natural corkscrew in one area. is it a racetrack no but it was a damn hard ride where you had to pay attention and focus.

its funny when i had my m3 and then my 335is back to back and i said the 335is was a better street car than m3 and the guys on the forum bashed me. some had one or the other. i had both and you can tune the 335is you couldnt really tune the m3 at the time it was a v8. i was like dude i owned both back to back have you ever drove the 335 is. answer was no so he was going by magazines or hear say or whatever .

my point is if scrapper says he can tell the difference i am sure he can tell the difference. guy had a ridiculous 1199 and now a 1299 and he answered the question.
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Mark Thank you, but its all good though. I get a kick from these young track elitest who think making small adjustments on geometry can only be felt on a track or the people who think you have to be a MotoGP rider to feel the effect. That just tells me that they havent been riding very long or not very experience not to feel the difference. I used to be one of those guys who believed the track was the only place for these bikes until I was introduced to the caynons in California. Totally different riding than a safe track and totally different bike setup.
 
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Second trackday on the 1299, 2 different tracks, one is a 2:10 ish lap, the other 1:50. Immediately 3 and respectively 2 seconds faster with the 12. Front end feels lighter on turn-in, rear hooks up waay better, power is more linear and makes for better drive. On straightaways where I'd barely empty 4th gear I can go quite a bit in 5th now. DTC is much better with smoother intervention and lets the rear step out nicely without making you hit the windscreen. Cornering ABS is crap though, way too much intervention and gets in the way of trailbraking.
 
fireman1251 said:
Second trackday on the 1299, 2 different tracks, one is a 2:10 ish lap, the other 1:50. Immediately 3 and respectively 2 seconds faster with the 12. Front end feels lighter on turn-in, rear hooks up waay better, power is more linear and makes for better drive. On straightaways where I'd barely empty 4th gear I can go quite a bit in 5th now. DTC is much better with smoother intervention and lets the rear step out nicely without making you hit the windscreen. Cornering ABS is crap though, way too much intervention and gets in the way of trailbraking.
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Do you think you would notice the difference as a street bike talking chassis only ? What setting did you have the ABS on I actually found I'm going in much deeper on the brakes without trail braking being compromised . I have upgraded the pads .
The electronics I have found are amazing . I have my DTC set on 4 and DWC on 4 as well the best thing yet is the down shift .
I have been trying to push hard to find a decent set up and the bike seems to be really working for me .
 
I think a change in rake is more immediately obvious to "most" riders than a swingarm pivot change. Steering "feel" is quite different from bike to bike due to differences in rake/trail and weight balance. .
 
ScrapperX said:
I get a kick from these young track elitest who think making small adjustments on geometry can only be felt on a track or the people who think you have to be a MotoGP rider to feel the effect. That just tells me that they havent been riding very long or not very experience not to feel the difference.
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Who exactly are you referring to with those comments?
 
fireman1251 said:
Second trackday on the 1299, 2 different tracks, one is a 2:10 ish lap, the other 1:50. Immediately 3 and respectively 2 seconds faster with the 12. Front end feels lighter on turn-in, rear hooks up waay better, power is more linear and makes for better drive. On straightaways where I'd barely empty 4th gear I can go quite a bit in 5th now. DTC is much better with smoother intervention and lets the rear step out nicely without making you hit the windscreen. Cornering ABS is crap though, way too much intervention and gets in the way of trailbraking.
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I would definitely turn off the ABS if you're a "fast" track rider.
 
jarelj said:
I would definitely turn off the ABS if you're a "fast" track rider.
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I have never found the ABS set in the race setting as front only to be nothing but excellent . At most tracks I am about 4 seconds off track record and a B grade road racer on a National level . I consider myself fastish .
Most guys I race with I the Panigale have never done anything different . Do you just turn it off or get rid of it all together ?
 
wilkson said:
Do you think you would notice the difference as a street bike talking chassis only ? What setting did you have the ABS on I actually found I'm going in much deeper on the brakes without trail braking being compromised . I have upgraded the pads .
The electronics I have found are amazing . I have my DTC set on 4 and DWC on 4 as well the best thing yet is the down shift .
I have been trying to push hard to find a decent set up and the bike seems to be really working for me .
Click to expand...

Tried the 1299 as a street bike on a demo ride and immediately noticed the better front end.

First I had ABS on 2 because I thought the cornering ABS would be cool, now ABS on 1, front only. Has saved my ass once with the 1199 when I was forced off the track.

Had DTC on 3 and am down to 2 right now. DWC on 2. Running SCX slicks on the rear and SC1 up front.
 
jarelj said:
I would definitely turn off the ABS if you're a "fast" track rider.
Click to expand...

ABS on 1 saved me a wreck once, was forced off the track by someone who fell and managed to stay upright through damp grass. Only had it intervene during normal riding on a crest where the bike would get light and it was very subtle.
 
fireman1251 said:
Tried the 1299 as a street bike on a demo ride and immediately noticed the better front end.

First I had ABS on 2 because I thought the cornering ABS would be cool, now ABS on 1, front only. Has saved my ass once with the 1199 when I was forced off the track.

Had DTC on 3 and am down to 2 right now. DWC on 2. Running SCX slicks on the rear and SC1 up front.
Click to expand...

I used to run 2 on my R but am enjoying backing off a little and going WOT more often without it really compromising my corner exits .
I had a decent high side at Phillip Island on setting 2 . I must admit I'm not finding too many grip issues on this bike but have not improved lap times of yet but feel confident I will .
 
The biggest difference I noticed from changing my R swingarm from 0 to -4mm was in the DDA. When analyzing data my TC would intervene tremendously when set to level 1 with 0 pivot setting, even with new sc slicks. After changing pivot to -4mm and analyzing data the TC barely intervenes. I could not feel much difference but my lap times were dropping (partly because of learning track). I can see why they would choose to lower pivot.
 

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