2023 V4R // 2023 SEASON

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SuperDomestique said:
Who was the organization running this alleged trackday at Laguna where there’s a 70 mph speed difference?

It’s not choose your own group at least w the orgs that I ride with. Rather it’s good consistent and predictable riding that gets you into more advanced groups. Lap times alone don’t get you bumped.

When I was riding in the A group with PTT at Laguna spinning 1m45-50s laps, I never ran into any problems with faster riders. No one in the group had any issue w my riding. Everyone was respectful and speed differences were mainly at corner apex to exit which is the safest time to pass.
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I don't want to put one organization down with Laguna example as this is a common problem with most organizations. They demoted that rider after 2 sessions of me complaining back to back.
I don't know you personally, haven't watched you riding either but if you're running 1:45-50, you should really take your time in B group no matter how predictable you are. There is no shame in being with the B group, and no pride of being an A rider. I just went to Chuckwalla for 2 days recently. I signed up A group for CCW direction, B group for CW direction. I've never done CW before and my pace was 8-9 seconds difference to CCW when I started lapping. At the end of the day I improved 5 seconds but my next one I will still do B group to take make sure I have my lines and markers down exactly to lap another 4-5 seconds faster to be adequate for A group. I was already the fastest guy in B group at the end of the day but what matters is that my lap times are still closer to fast B guys in CW.
 
mayhan1980 said:
I don't want to put one organization down with Laguna example as this is a common problem with most organizations. They demoted that rider after 2 sessions of me complaining back to back.
I don't know you personally, haven't watched you riding either but if you're running 1:45-50, you should really take your time in B group no matter how predictable you are. There is no shame in being with the B group, and no pride of being an A rider. I just went to Chuckwalla for 2 days recently. I signed up A group for CCW direction, B group for CW direction. I've never done CW before and my pace was 8-9 seconds difference to CCW when I started lapping. At the end of the day I improved 5 seconds but my next one I will still do B group to take make sure I have my lines and markers down exactly to lap another 4-5 seconds faster to be adequate for A group. I was already the fastest guy in B group at the end of the day but what matters is that my lap times are still closer to fast B guys in CW.
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Don’t mind riding in B’s. I think I honestly ride at a B+ level. Not fast, not slow. My thought is to always ride consistently and aim for good lines.

On this day, I asked to move up to A’s because I was significantly outpacing the B+ group (probably top 5 riders in a 30 rider group). I was even a bit trepidatious with this idea as I typically don’t ride A’s so I had a control rider ride with me in B+ and A’s. Got the green light and everyone in A’s was great to ride with despite being probably the slowest rider in the group. Also learned some good lines as I was mostly riding on my own in B+.

I’m also pretty sure this was a 90ish dB day so a lot of the faster riders stay away. I’ve ridden at a no dB limit day and the real fast guys come out of the wood work.
 
mayhan1980 said:
I don't want to put one organization down with Laguna example as this is a common problem with most organizations. They demoted that rider after 2 sessions of me complaining back to back.
I don't know you personally, haven't watched you riding either but if you're running 1:45-50, you should really take your time in B group no matter how predictable you are. There is no shame in being with the B group, and no pride of being an A rider. I just went to Chuckwalla for 2 days recently. I signed up A group for CCW direction, B group for CW direction. I've never done CW before and my pace was 8-9 seconds difference to CCW when I started lapping. At the end of the day I improved 5 seconds but my next one I will still do B group to take make sure I have my lines and markers down exactly to lap another 4-5 seconds faster to be adequate for A group. I was already the fastest guy in B group at the end of the day but what matters is that my lap times are still closer to fast B guys in CW.
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I agree. I currently run 2.25 in BW and 2.21 in Chuck on my zx4rr and the problem is that with my little law mower engine things get complicated. I run B group and that is typically pretty ok.
Unfortunately, often people sign up, mostly on big bikes with 200+ bhp.I can't keep up on the straights. But on the other hand, in corners they are just standing around.
Too many people, myself included, start riding trackdays with machines that are way over their head. I understand the casual rider that wants to feel his panigale out on the racetrack once a year and that's ok. Ducati revs and co should be there for you.
I pushed the reset button and jumped on the 400 and yes, it's for sure less zoom and ommp but the learning curve is so much higher. Around the LA area, there is not one single track where you'd need a track bike bigger than 600, unless you are a pro rider.
But I get the organizer, it's hard to bump people down, you want them to come back and spend money.
 
At Mugello the groups are assessed with live timing and you get moved if you are not in the time for that group. This occurs through the sessions and every morning you get a new sticker based on your times allocating you to a group. it worked well.
 
andyb said:
At Mugello the groups are assessed with live timing and you get moved if you are not in the time for that group. This occurs through the sessions and every morning you get a new sticker based on your times allocating you to a group. it worked well.
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The European organisers that I have used all do it like that.
 
chris838 said:
I agree. I currently run 2.25 in BW and 2.21 in Chuck on my zx4rr and the problem is that with my little law mower engine things get complicated. I run B group and that is typically pretty ok.
Unfortunately, often people sign up, mostly on big bikes with 200+ bhp.I can't keep up on the straights. But on the other hand, in corners they are just standing around.
Too many people, myself included, start riding trackdays with machines that are way over their head. I understand the casual rider that wants to feel his panigale out on the racetrack once a year and that's ok. Ducati revs and co should be there for you.
I pushed the reset button and jumped on the 400 and yes, it's for sure less zoom and ommp but the learning curve is so much higher. Around the LA area, there is not one single track where you'd need a track bike bigger than 600, unless you are a pro rider.
But I get the organizer, it's hard to bump people down, you want them to come back and spend money.
Click to expand...
ZX4RR is a great track bike, I'm sure you're grinning ear to ear inside your helmet.
We used to have AutoClub Speedway (Fontana) for stretching the legs of big CC bikes. :(
 
There are a couple of new providers that are starting to cater to lower hp bike. I know of one called Compact Octane that is growing and good guys. Most of them are former racers looking to have fun and not burn up a set of tires everyday.
 
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chris838 said:
I agree. I currently run 2.25 in BW and 2.21 in Chuck on my zx4rr and the problem is that with my little law mower engine things get complicated. I run B group and that is typically pretty ok.
Unfortunately, often people sign up, mostly on big bikes with 200+ bhp.I can't keep up on the straights. But on the other hand, in corners they are just standing around.
Too many people, myself included, start riding trackdays with machines that are way over their head. I understand the casual rider that wants to feel his panigale out on the racetrack once a year and that's ok. Ducati revs and co should be there for you.
I pushed the reset button and jumped on the 400 and yes, it's for sure less zoom and ommp but the learning curve is so much higher. Around the LA area, there is not one single track where you'd need a track bike bigger than 600, unless you are a pro rider.
But I get the organizer, it's hard to bump people down, you want them to come back and spend money.
Click to expand...
I find this discussion of the west coast tracks weird. When I left AFM the fast club guys were into 1 51's at Sears (now Sonoma). With the AFM chicane before turn one. This was a very long time ago. Over 25 years. Later, (2000's ?) they made the track safer, easier, repaved it and neutered 8 and 8A (they cut back the hillsides all over but on the original course you were looking at a hillside coming into 8A, really gnarly, bad place to crash). A group track day riders on the new track are doing 2.00's. WTF. The new tires alone have to be worth multiple seconds. The original track was 2.5 miles and I think the current motorcycle course is 2.3. I am totally confused by this. I seem to remember Ducati allowing Troy Corser to run an AMA after a Laguna superbike round and he ran low 1' 40's? With the AMA course change which squared off and slowed the entry into one. Weird.
 

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