AR Inconel Install

Ducati Forum

Help Support Ducati Forum:

AntiHero said:
We're still only talking about the results of one bike, right? I've been wrenching long enough to know that sometimes mistakes can be made during the process of tuning and wrenching that can very well affect the results. We're talking about a small sample and as much as I begin to form an opinion based on the original post, I do realize that the evidence supporting ARs claims are also valid (AR has a stellar reputation).

AR, unlike no other manufacturer, came to us and allowed us to be part of the product development and design and truly appreciated our feedback during the development cycle. That says a hell of a lot about them--namely that they care about what we think. I've seen enough from Rich product-wise and post-wise, to believe that there's no way he'd intentionally mislead us.

With all the effort Rich put into ARs exhaust I completely understand his defensive reaction. (I'm pretty sure he'll agree he went a little too far after drinking a cold beer, though.) I'm suspending any judgement--and suspect that after the dust clears a different picture will emerge.
Click to expand...

I agree.

I think we all need to drink a cold beer and see/observe the outcome. I hope we figure out this together (including AR folks, OP, and other that have questions) for the same interest of the love our bikes and amazing efforts like AR and to those who wants to know what they are buying. :D
 
wow..8 hrs and this got messy pretty quick.

I think what a lot of people are not seeing is that the absence of a performance differential between the ar system and termi is more than likely due to lack of experience in dyno tuning the paini..
both systems are showing similar numbers because the ecu is restricting power output. ( it's a self preservation thing)

it's a lot like saying a $500 huffy from Kmart is just as fast as a $5000 Cervelo because you put some random unfit Norm in the saddle. If you put an elite cyclist on both then you will quickly see the limitations of the huffy.
 
Last edited:
Jariva said:
Promising news. There is also interesting examples on their web site. I should ship my Diavel there for tuning!

BunburyDyno: Dyno Samples
Click to expand...

Please all reading this thread look at this link provided by Jariva earlier.

You will find pwr and torque results comparing std 1199s and 1199s with full term plus comparisons between prev model and Pani.

Look at the pwr 180 + std at the wheel and 193 full system at the wheel!!!!:eek:

You will find the four dyno results at the bottom of the Ducati section.
 
Last edited:
Stw said:
You are right sir.. I did indeed.. Are Vendors members in the true sense?? I own a 1199... To the best of my knowledge AR doesn't.. so yes I guess in a way I feel vendors are a sort of associate member.. Ok maybe facetious ..but when a vendor suggests I should be banned I get a little antsy..
Click to expand...

Agreed. It also seems that vendors would/should refrain from lashing out with name calling or heated rhetoric when it isn't necessary. I would expect a strong response with additional facts or new information when challenged with legitimate questions....but not name calling and calls for bans. Oh well, not a huge deal in the big picture. Oh, and I think Rich does have an 1199?
 
Stw said:
You are right sir.. I did indeed.. Are Vendors members in the true sense?? I own a 1199... To the best of my knowledge AR doesn't.. so yes I guess in a way I feel vendors are a sort of associate member.. Ok maybe facetious ..but when a vendor suggests I should be banned I get a little antsy..
Click to expand...
Point taken. However, Pani ownership is not a requirement for forum membership; only a love for the bike/brand is. I think it's safe to say Rich fits the bill whether he owns a Pani or not. Again, you insist that AR bashed other brands. Again, I don't see it that way. Reporting on test results, giving personal opinions and touting your own products performance does not constitute bashing. Having said that, in my line of work perception is reality. If you perceived AR's comments as bashing then to YOU and maybe some others it was. But like I said, personally I don't see it that way. :cool:
 
ttkarp said:
Agreed. It also seems that vendors would/should refrain from lashing out with name calling or heated rhetoric when it isn't necessary. I would expect a strong response with additional facts or new information when challenged with legitimate questions....but not name calling and calls for bans. Oh well, not a huge deal in the big picture. Oh, and I think Rich does have an 1199?
Click to expand...

Well cool if he does... But I feel he is here as a vendor not as a rider... and therefore yes I believe he should be held to a higher standard than regular members... No??
 
rm4two said:
Point taken. However, Pani ownership is not a requirement for forum membership; only a love for the bike/brand is. I think it's safe to say Rich fits the bill whether he owns a Pani or not. Again, you insist that AR bashed other brands. Again, I don't see it that way. Reporting on test results, giving personal opinions and touting your own products performance does not constitute bashing. Having said that, in my line of work perception is reality. If you perceived AR's comments as bashing then to YOU and maybe some others it was. But like I said, personally I don't see it that way. :cool:
Click to expand...

I couldn't remember exactly why or what comments specifically led me to this perception of bashing, so I went back yesterday and re-read the comments in the "Austin Racing Finished Product" thread. There are several comments that can be perceived as negative towards Termi by Rich. It's subtle, but when you combine that with the "facts" presented about the slip on vs. full Termi system testing, it becomes clear to me that there is an agenda. It's my opinion (and only that) that whether he meant to or not, Rich has created a negative perception about the Termi full system in an effort to better position his product. I may be sensitive to "bashing" as I'm in sales myself, and it's just never good business practice to do so.
 
I've read this thread from beginning to end. From the day it's started.

Personally, if I was AR, I'd tell all you know it all doubters to come up with legit facts yourselves instead of repeats this, repeats that.

Not one other manufacturer comes on this forum and gives info for free, helps point you in other directions nor openly welcomes discussions.

Say AR were Termi, the obvious choice of the Ducati proletariat.

Would you all be mouthing off....?

No.... I very much doubt it.

I have a lot of respect for all manufacturers. They spend an absolute fortune bringing it onto the market.

I can see why all the others don't bother coming on to forums like this just to get their balls busted.

This thread started with someone letting us know how things were going and ended up as "Lets kick the fuqq out of AR"

If I were you Rich I'd walk away and let them all spout bollox about how clever they are (Not everyone of course. Just the trolls)

Sell your product, help those that want it but do it in private.

It'll save you a lot of anxiety.

No wonder Termi, Akra, etc, etc don't come on here.

Shame on us we've probably shot ourselves in the foot.


.
 
rm4two said:
Point taken. However, Pani ownership is not a requirement for forum membership; only a love for the bike/brand is. I think it's safe to say Rich fits the bill whether he owns a Pani or not. Again, you insist that AR bashed other brands. Again, I don't see it that way. Reporting on test results, giving personal opinions and touting your own products performance does not constitute bashing. Having said that, in my line of work perception is reality. If you perceived AR's comments as bashing then to YOU and maybe some others it was. But like I said, personally I don't see it that way. :cool:
Click to expand...

Hmmm... Ok ... I am not the only one who perceived AR comments about Termi as bashing.. I seem to recall CaliDuc getting jumped on when he mentioned the fact that Termis existed and had quantifiable data with regards to performance and as of that time AR's didn't but they were still slagging the Termis... The most interesting thing about this thread is the polarization it has created... Its funny to me ... why so defensive?? Waf.. said hes very disappointed in the dyno results.. I would be after $4600 investment... and then AR says well you gotta have this gas..that fan speed and a piggyback fuel module etc to achieve results...... Look at their website and the claims made previously on this very forum and then have Wafs experience... How would you feel right now???
 
ttkarp said:
Why would it be Gavin's job to prove anything? That would fall on the manufacture wouldn't it? And there's only one manufacturer that I'm aware of claiming to have a superior product.
Click to expand...

At least get the correct and appropriate facts before accusing, we can all benefit, point i am making is that we dont have enough information to make relevant conclusions.
 
Keep flicking that bean you appear to be doing it quite well!

Other companies are not making outrageous claims at the expense of the competition as Rich has.
 
It's a bit funny (maybe not) but this thread could have gone 180 degrees in the opposite direction if WAF's dyno had been properly setup (assuming it wasn't). :) Strange how one simple post can change so much LOL.
 
kaido said:
This is very interesting, i have always been of the school that dyno is used as a tuning tool, rather than to show numbers.

Still 20hp is alot, i would say either one dyno is reading higher or one is reading lower ;)
Click to expand...


Well said . I'm actually finding the whole saga ridiculous now to be honest .
Get the bike off the Dyno take it for a ride let us know what you think .
Chasing HP numbers just for the sake of it is just plain bragging rights for the carpark or a marketing tool to suck in consumers .
Having a well tuned bike that performs to your liking is for a rider . Just start riding the thing FFS.
 
Last edited:
rm4two said:
It's a bit funny (maybe not) but this thread could have gone 180 degrees in the opposite direction if WAF's dyno had been properly setup (assuming it wasn't). :) Strange how one simple post can change so much LOL.
Click to expand...

That's a huge assumption dude....
 
Stw said:
Hmmm... Ok ... I am not the only one who perceived AR comments about Termi as bashing.. I seem to recall CaliDuc getting jumped on when he mentioned the fact that Termis existed and had quantifiable data with regards to performance and as of that time AR's didn't but they were still slagging the Termis... The most interesting thing about this thread is the polarization it has created... Its funny to me ... why so defensive?? Waf.. said hes very disappointed in the dyno results.. I would be after $4600 investment... and then AR says well you gotta have this gas..that fan speed and a piggyback fuel module etc to achieve results...... Look at their website and the claims made previously on this very forum and then have Wafs experience... How would you feel right now???
Click to expand...
Personally I wouldn't spend that kind of cash on and exhaust system, which is why I have slip-ons. $4600 in my neck of the woods buys a pretty nice track day or second bike lol. But if I did, I would go all in and get it properly tuned which I'm sure WAF will do, then we'll see. But that's just me. :rolleyes:
 
wilkson said:
Well said . I'm actually finding the whole saga ridiculous now to be honest .
Get the bike off the Dyno take it for a ride let us know what you think .
Chasing HP numbers just for the sake of it is just plain bragging rights for the carpark or a marketing tool to suck in consumers .
Having a well tuned bike that performs to your liking is for a rider . Just start riding the thing FFS.
Click to expand...




Hallelujah...! At last a realist..!



Well said.....


Lets get this effin thread back on track....................


.
 

Similar threads

Thadius
For Sale 2020 V4S F/S Colorado
Replies
6
Views
372
Thadius
Thadius
D
Help! 1299 doesn’t make power above 9500rpm
Replies
9
Views
649
Dark
D
M
A little shoutout to Ducati Omaha Parts Department
Replies
12
Views
476
SBK-SP
SBK-SP
Sheikh
Inexpensive power/rideability upgrade
2
Replies
20
Views
2K
Sheikh
Sheikh
A
Grey/Graphite colour material discovered oil change 1500miles (2500km)
Replies
11
Views
190
baggerman
B

Register CTA

Register on Ducati Forum! This sidebar will go away, and you will see fewer ads.

Recent Discussions

Back
Top