Back in the shop

Kev242 said:

Steve from JSC is having his freshly Graves built ZX4-RR sent out to Chuck…..a little sweet talking and a milkshake or two and perhaps I can get a leg over it : )

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Man if you’re out there next Sunday I’ll let you take my RC 8C out for a bit ;-)


(Definitely in it for the milkshake though )

So this thread was epic, pretty much every go fast mod you can do to these bikes is covered in this thread

Now that I’m prepping it for sale I thought I’d make a wrap up post.

When I bought this bike I had never owned a sport bike, and had never been to a track with one, I bought it with the intention of it being a street bike that I took to the track occasionally.

But then Covid hit so it took awhile for me to get to the track, and I had nothing else to do so I just made my hobby modifying the bike.

When things started opening up I finally got to the track. And almost immediately fell in love with the track. My intentions change from it being a street bike with occasional track use to a track bike that was street legal for occasional street use, then it became a full on track spec track only bike.

Looking back on all the mods, and after 3 years with the bike as it transformed from street bike to track weapon I thought I’d summarize the best mods.

1st are the mods I loved the most, regardless of cost.

Reducing weight, especially rotating mass makes a huge difference on these bikes. So lighter wheels, lighter chain, lighter sprocket assembly, lighter rotors. Thysenkrupp CF wheels, OZ if you don’t like CF wheels but that’s just silly. Mag wheels will bend before good CF will break, and both are catastrophic events. Superlite 520 Sprockets and chain (Although V4Evo has a lighter setup) and by far the best mod I put on the bike period was the Sicom Rotors…they make the bike flick side to side like a race prepped 600cc bike. When I get the new bike other than upgrading the brake MC the only 1st mods I’ll do is lighten every rotating mass I can. Makes the bike feel more alive. These bikes respond really well to any weight reduction, but especially to rotating mass reduction.

An exhaust and a tune are big on these bikes too. I prefer the Sparks WSBK setup because they use Inconel headers that flow into titanium tubes, but any catless titanium system with a good tune serves these bikes well. Sheds a lot of weight, opens up mid-range power and torque. Duessen is the only tune I’d use for these bikes currently…Ze German takes a very German approach and knows his ...., in great detail, with no shortcuts in the tuning process.

Upgrade the Brake MC, USE A 17mm one not 19mm for the calipers on these bikes! I have a MotoGP level Brembo Brake MC but honestly any of the 17RCS Corsa Corta stuff is a great upgrade, more than that is over kill. And don’t bother upgrading the clutch MC.

For brake pads when not running the Sicom rotors and pads I prefer the Vesrah XX over the ubiquitous Z04 pads…the former has just as much stopping power as the Z04 but has a much more forgiving and progressive initial bite, easier to finesse.

Ohlins FKR Carts for the Forks, and the ubiquitous DU468 GP rear shock are the way to go…there are some Ktech DDS options that are phenomenal, but the average Joe needs a suspension tuner, which means it’s best to stay with Ohlins because there are good tuners for that stuff in almost every state with decent tracks to go to, not so much with Ktech and Bitubo etc, at least in the states.

And last of the best mods, get a thumb or index finger brake, and learn how to use it. I’ve had both the IMA stuff and the Discatiatti stuff…I go back and forth between thumb and index finger brakes but index finger is easier or what I’m more use too. The IMA stuff is higher quality than the Discatiatti stuff, but the latter costs less and has better ergo placement (which is critical for a rear brake mounted to the left clip on) so I use the Discatiatti stuff. Whatever you use, get the 16mm piston not the 14mm piston for these bikes, it provides enough pressure to shift the bikes weight but without locking up the rear, the 14mm requires too much effort to brake hard enough to shift the bikes weight, so it’s actually harder to finesse, requires too hard of a lever pull.

For clipons Woodcraft is the way to go, they have two sets of bolts on the collar that goes around forks so you can change them without removing the triple clamp…huge time saver when you need to change them. They have endless ergo options, and they are engineered REALLY well, for a very fair price, which is importsnt because if you lay your bike down the 1st thing you are replacing is your clipons…so a well engineer setup that doesn’t cost an arm and leg and has endless adjustability?…no brainer…Woodcraft

For rearsets: Attack Performance, solid, well made, with the most adjustability on the market. Especially best if you are tall. And they have the best foot peg design, huge spikes, your foot isn’t slipping off of them EVER.

2nd are the ‘no budget’ mods that are good but not really needed. Pierobon extended swingarm. Great upgrade, not needed unless you are very fast chasing 10ths. IMA triple clamps same things.

Titanium bolts and fasteners…replace the BIG bolts, don’t bother with all the little ones EXCEPT the ones you use alot like fairing screws, and for your brake and clutch MC etc…the big bolts like the brake calipers, the brake rotors bolts and sprocket bolts and nuts (rotating mass) swingarm pinch bolts, engine mount bolts etc are where you get pretty decent weight savings, all the smaller fasteners not so much, but change to titanium on the smaller screws you turn a lot because the OEM are made of clay.

Quick turn throttle, cool upgrade, worth doing, decent bang for the buck mod, not a ‘must do’ mod…go with JetPrime if you get one, most reliable version out there with the smallest footprint on the bar.

GP4-MS Calipers are great, I love em, but honestly the Stylema’s paired with better pads and an upgraded brake mc are very very good. So I’d classify the GP4-MS calipers as cool but not a huge difference maker for track days.

Don’t worry about ditching the ABS on later bikes, it actually works pretty well in the track setting and isn’t particularly intrusive.

Linear shock link is a must for a track only bike. But if you ride your bike on the street you won’t like it. Makes the rear the pump at the track and the rear end feels more stable, but for even moderate street use its harsh and will make you slower.

MotoCorse engine and shock mounts? Expensive, look cool, hard to get, makes zero difference when riding the bike…one of the mods I wish I had saved the money on lol

Upgrade clutch MC not useful either, just makes the clutch stiffer but no benefit to bike performance.

Titanium wheel nuts, decent reduction in rotating mass but it’s so close to the hub that it doesn’t make that much of a difference, but they are easy to get and not too expensive so I’m 50/50 on those.

For the rear subframe and seat MotoHolders with a RaceSeatIT seat and you save a lot of weight and improve ergos…Pierobon makes the best of the rear subframes though, but for the extra cheddar not that big of an improvement when actually riding the bike over a MotoHolders setup. Far and away the better rout to go is the RADE Garage Tank/Seat combo. Wider and longer seat, great tank hook in ergos…replace the rubber bushings with Delrin or it flexes too much though.

H20 Track Radiator WITH fan provision, is a very good mod for street or track on these bikes and will probably prolong your engine life. BUT not really needed. One of those more expensive mods you can live without, but if you have the budget worth doing…side note though, you can’t mount a side mounted steering damper with it.

Fitness, seat time, and coaching are always the best mods…but assuming you can walk and chew gum at the same time financially if you own a V4…Best overall mods to me were reducing overall weight especially rotating mass (grams everywhere add up but especially on all rotating parts), change the brake mc, cat less titanium exhaust with Deussen Tune. The rest do if you have the budget, otherwise save money for brake pads, tires, fluid changes, and track time/coaching and improve your fitness.

Will post more as I think of it.

If you wouldn’t mind putting an index together…

Out of curiosity, how does FKR compare with NPX that I have? Rear on mine is TTX36 (I think the suspension on my bike might be like the MotoE bikes are using).

Did you find the RADE tank a big improvement for ergonomics? The tank appears to be narrower. They are based half an hour down the road from me.

Excellent thread by the way and I’m sure we are all looking forward to the eventual R thread.

spooky said:

If you wouldn’t mind putting an index together…

Out of curiosity, how does FKR compare with NPX that I have? Rear on mine is TTX36 (I think the suspension on my bike might be like the MotoE bikes are using).

Did you find the RADE tank a big improvement for ergonomics? The tank appears to be narrower. They are based half an hour down the road from me.

Excellent thread by the way and I’m sure we are all looking forward to the eventual R thread.

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Because you don’t have to pay the $500 to ship it the RADE tank is worth it. It’s definately a huge improvement over the ergos of my 2020 bike, if you have a 2023 or newer it will still be an improvement but not as much. But yes, either way a huge improvement. It’s PERFECT for track riding, better than my RC 8C ergos.

The shock and forks on the R models are Very good…you get better FEEL of what the tires are doing with the FKR stuff but at our age and pace I think you are probably good with what you have. The level of improvement over what you have now is not huge, but was a big improvement over my electronic Nix30 stuff.

I’m actually working with MonkeyGripp’s to make me a custom tank extender to make my RC 8C feel more like the RADE tank/seat.

Steven31371 said:

Because you don’t have to pay the $500 to ship it the RADE tank is worth it. It’s definately a huge improvement over the ergos of my 2020 bike, if you have a 2023 or newer it will still be an improvement but not as much. But yes, either way a huge improvement. It’s PERFECT for track riding, better than my RC 8C ergos.

The shock and forks on the R models are Very good…you get better FEEL of what the tires are doing with the FKR stuff but at our age and pace I think you are probably good with what you have. The level of improvement over what you have now is not huge, but was a big improvement over my electronic Nix30 stuff.

I’m actually working with MonkeyGripp’s to make me a custom tank extender to make my RC 8C feel more like the RADE tank/seat.

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My track bike is the current V4R and the tank shape on that tank looks like it’s narrower, which could be of benefit. Perhaps not dissimilar to the shape on the new V4 at a cursory glance (I haven’t looked closely at either).

I don’t believe I would benefit at all from changing suspension and it’s not something I’m even remotely considering - it’s just an interesting topic. I do want to check the setup over the winter though - I would be surprised if I wouldn’t benefit from both ends being sprung for my weight, or at least the rear shock, and making sure it’s set up correctly for me. The only thing I actually need to improve is me - the bike is not, and never could be, a limiting factor. It’s interesting and fun to do these things though.

As I put more thought into both my development as a rider and the bikes development over the years the best and most important mod are rider mods…so coaching at 1st, to get the basics, and then seat time, this is a sport with sport related skills, so coaching won’t take you that far without seat time at the track to practice and lock in the skills you learn from coaching…BUT, once you have enough basic skills from coaching to not yeet yourself off the track, I would argue that the best rider mod is pictured below…because as you get faster the physical demands get higher. What you don’t want is to have frustrating days at the track where fitness keeps you from getting faster that day…fatigue will absolutely slow your progress on track times maybe more than anything else if you are lacking in that area….and try to be OVER fit, not just ‘fit enough’…because if you are just fit enough for the times you are running now, you want be fit enough at all when you are 1.5 to 2 seconds faster, and that lack of fitness will slow your progress substantially, even halt it.

I was 265 pounds the 1st track weekend.


Down to 210 now and still need more cardio to go faster.

Well said and well done!

Even though I am still slow, I’ve certainly noticed more effort is required as you go faster. You start to notice fatigue affecting concentration and making you go slower as a result.

I was 105+kg maybe three years ago. Around 88 kg now and over winter I expect to get to 80 kg, which should be enough. You have made amazing progress in that regard.

Great thread, and not just for the mods but also for sharing your journey.

Steven31371 said:

As I put more thought into both my development as a rider and the bikes development over the years the best and most important mod are rider mods…so coaching at 1st, to get the basics, and then seat time, this is a sport with sport related skills, so coaching won’t take you that far without seat time at the track to practice and lock in the skills you learn from coaching…BUT, once you have enough basic skills from coaching to not yeet yourself off the track, I would argue that the best rider mod is pictured below…because as you get faster the physical demands get higher. What you don’t want is to have frustrating days at the track where fitness keeps you from getting faster that day…fatigue will absolutely slow your progress on track times maybe more than anything else if you are lacking in that area….and try to be OVER fit, not just ‘fit enough’…because if you are just fit enough for the times you are running now, you want be fit enough at all when you are 1.5 to 2 seconds faster, and that lack of fitness will slow your progress substantially, even halt it.

I was 265 pounds the 1st track weekend.
View attachment 56841

Down to 210 now and still need more cardio to go faster.

View attachment 56842

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Enough with the pictures of your pool boy! Ride safe.

baggerman said:

Enough with the pictures of your pool boy! Ride safe.

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Nice pool though. He’s even got his rubber duck by the side of it.

I see similarities here although I find it extremely impressive to progress in such a short time. Well done Steven!
I ride motorcycles since 7 years now, approx 20k miles a year. Mostly on Harleys and touring but since 1.5 years street bikes. While weight and condition was never a limiting factor before on the Harleys it certainly is key to when it comes to this site of the motorcycle spectrum. I lost approx 20lb myself so far and can feel every bit immediately. After 15ish trackdays I would say that weight reduction was, next to California Superbike School, my biggest items that have improved my riding. Long before any technical mods on the bike.

spooky said:

Well said and well done!

Even though I am still slow, I’ve certainly noticed more effort is required as you go faster. You start to notice fatigue affecting concentration and making you go slower as a result.

I was 105+kg maybe three years ago. Around 88 kg now and over winter I expect to get to 80 kg, which should be enough. You have made amazing progress in that regard.

Great thread, and not just for the mods but also for sharing your journey.

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105k to 88 or 80k is epic man, great job, bet you feel way better.

If you have a passion for this it’s a great motivator to get in shape.

spooky said:

My track bike is the current V4R and the tank shape on that tank looks like it’s narrower, which could be of benefit. Perhaps not dissimilar to the shape on the new V4 at a cursory glance (I haven’t looked closely at either).

I don’t believe I would benefit at all from changing suspension and it’s not something I’m even remotely considering - it’s just an interesting topic. I do want to check the setup over the winter though - I would be surprised if I wouldn’t benefit from both ends being sprung for my weight, or at least the rear shock, and making sure it’s set up correctly for me. The only thing I actually need to improve is me - the bike is not, and never could be, a limiting factor. It’s interesting and fun to do these things though.

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I didn’t include getting the bike sprung for your weight in the summary of mods posts because that should be given, very 1st thing you should do to any sport bike whether you are using it for street or track. I tend to think like RoadracerX that stock geometry is great until you start getting fast, but getting spring rate, sag, compression and rebound at both ends right is mission critical #1 thing…makes a HUGE difference when it’s set up wrong.

And when you go from wrong setup to right setup it’s night and day.

Ozempic and testosterone are helluva drugs

SuperDomestique said:

Ozempic and testosterone are helluva drugs

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They are…but don’t get it twisted, you still have to workout and go into a calorie deficit to lose weight and build muscle. I don’t take steroids, I take just enough TRT to be at average levels. And Ozempic just makes you not crave food or think about it constantly, it doesn’t lose weight for you magically, ya still have to take in less calories than you burn and eat healthy, it just makes it a lot easier to do so. Most people who are over weight myself included, have a physical addiction to too much food or unhealthy food, Ozempic helps manage that addiction.

If you are an older man whose overweight, Semiglutide and TRT are easy to access with almost no downside when under medical supervision, while having huge upsides.

Either way, if you don’t discipline your diet and workout neither do much.

Semiglutide helps curb your motivation to over eat and TRT helps with motivation to workout…you still have to actually DO both.