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b9009b · Mar 12, 2015

BigBoost said:
WHAT.... On both my 1199's (my Tri & SL), as soon as the tires were warm enough, I beat them both right off the dealership lot.

These motors do NOT like to be babied....

Lol

Well Im not arguing with Mr Ferracci nor ignoring him lol. Few more days ill be ready for the service. Then im flogging it.

Stw · Mar 12, 2015

b9009b said:
Lol

Well Im not arguing with Mr Ferracci nor ignoring him lol. Few more days ill be ready for the service. Then im flogging it.

Cylinders will have a nice glaze on them then....

Phl · Mar 12, 2015

yup, look up all the break-in threads.

b9009b · Mar 12, 2015

Stw said:
Cylinders will have a nice glaze on them then....

hoping thats a good thing.

Stw · Mar 12, 2015

b9009b said:
hoping thats a good thing.

Cylinder bore glazing results from prolonged light load running, particularly during the running-in process, and leads to the formation of a surface coating or skin derived from chemicals present in the oil and fuel. If glazed cylinder bores are examined, it is not unusual to see the honed crosshatch markings beneath a super-smooth, highly polished, varnish-like layer. Bore glazing occurs at low speed and light load operations, particularly resulting from blow-by in new engines. Exhaust gases passing piston rings in newly built or re-built bores can react with oil and wear products, forming a golden-coloured varnish glaze. Most engine manufacturers warn against the potential problem. Sabb and Lister-Petter are in surprising agreement on the subject, as shown in their operator's handbooks. In each case the wording is identical: “Long periods of light or no-load running early in the engine's life may lead to cylinder bore glazing and high lub oil consumption.” Cummins, Perkins and MAN all have issued directives limiting the run time at idle to prevent bore glazing.

b9009b · Mar 12, 2015

Stw said:
Depends who you ask... to me it isn't

Crap. So ill flog it half the time. thx boss

Phl · Mar 12, 2015

my can of worms here:

Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power

Charliem90 · Mar 12, 2015

b9009b said:
Crap. So ill flog it half the time. thx boss

Yah, better to follow some annonymous posting on the internet than what's written in your owner's handbook. I mean, what the fck would the manufacturer know about it....

Stw · Mar 12, 2015

Charliem90 said:
Yah, better to follow some annonymous posting on the internet than what's written in your owner's handbook. I mean, what the fck would the manufacturer know about it....

I quote...

Yeah - But ...
the owner's manual says to break it in easy ...

Notice that this technique isn't "beating" on the engine, but rather taking a purposeful, methodical approach to sealing the rings. The logic to this method is sound. However, some will have a hard time with this approach, since it seems to "go against the grain".

The argument for an easy break-in is usually: "that's what the manual says" ....

Or more specifically: "there are tight parts in the engine and you might do damage or even seize it if you run it hard."

Consider this:
Due to the vastly improved metal casting and machining technologies which are now used, tight parts in new engines are not normal. A manufacturing mistake causing a tight clearance is an extremely rare occurrence these days. But, if there is something wrong with the engine clearances from the factory, no amount of gentle running will fix the problem.

The real reason ???
So why do all the owner's manuals say to take it easy for the first
thousand miles ???

This is a good question ...

Trauma · Mar 12, 2015

Back in the day, speedos would have maximum RPM on them for XXX miles printed on a removable sticker. I used to try to follows those, at least for the first week or so

I don't know why people would argue the guy who built their bike - just say they prefer a harder breakin, not try to convince everyone it's better.

b9009b · Mar 12, 2015

Charlie that is true by flog i dont mean red line every gear. i already have revved up to 7k then back down in 1-3rd gear so it sounds as if ive done that without breaking the manual.

Phil thats exactly what the dealer said to do just dont go above 7.5k but i was taking "break in" as "babying" the bike, not running her in as it says. Thx for the link boss. Shes seating good. after 600 mile service im revving the crap out of her. Lol

Phl · Mar 12, 2015

The key is to put load on it. The cylinder has to see pressure, not revs... So the best would be uphill, heavy weight and then all gears ... Plenty of revs, but no redlining. That will get the piston rings seated and the surfaces matched.

IMHO

Buliwyf · Mar 12, 2015

No breakin needed. Just follow the manual. And if you miss a shift when the box is still stiff, no worries.

That's the factory proof testing the ABS, DQS, and DTC. Guess what's next? Hint: It involves straps.

You ain't seating the rings for jack riding an 80% race engine up a hill. Besides, you aren't even getting full stroke at 6000rpm. Rods stretch yo! LOLz.

b9009b · Mar 12, 2015

Thanks fEllas for the info. Noted.

Buliwyf · Mar 12, 2015

Linky:
Inside the Ducati factory: Building the 1199 Panigale from the ground up

Explains the build process.

-electric Cold rolled for a few minutes at 3000 rpm. Checking flow, power,and oil pressure.
-front wheel test
-Dyno test. Repeated 195hp runs.
-Emissions programming (this is what gets fixed during your first service)

And it explains why these things are so much more reliable, out of the box, than our 996's were. Mine only had 1 vendor fault. Wiring harness warranty replacement. And the reflash, charcoal delete.

Marmoot · Mar 12, 2015

Don't forget that there is the element of liability to motorcycle manufacturers. Careful running in is also designed to get the new owners used to being on the bike, learning the different handling characteristics, etc. Having most of their new owners ending up in coffins because they decided to whack the throttle open and crashing at the first corner they come to is not good publicity (and may cost heaps in litigation).

Buliwyf · Mar 13, 2015

Yeah, they don't want you going 150mph at 9000rpm when the bolts, that need re-torqued, on your 1st service fall off.

It's just a chance to get all the flashing, metal, and dust caught in the filter, not pumped throughout the engine. Gives all the vendor components a chance to burn in as well. Chains, screen, harness, suspension, ECM, etc. etc.

Then they get to check it all out at the 600 mile service.

b9009b · Mar 13, 2015

Buli - Are you serious that the stroke isn't at max at 6k? I thought regardless of the rmp they stroke maxed out on every up/down?

Buliwyf · Mar 13, 2015

Giant pistons going 10,000+ rpm.

Many engines can have as much as 0.8mm of extra rod/piston stretch/flex travel on the beginning of the intake stroke around 10,000 rpm. Likely 1500+ pounds of force on the wrist pin. And the piston can flex as well. If the SL has Ti rods, then there's even more there. Ti is very elastic, at least the version of Ti alloy used for rods. They actually have to account for the rods wrist pin holes shape when it ovals out.

On a new engine you can see it. Crank the engine over by hand and the piston ring didn't go all the way up to the wear marks. I was like "Wth, check this out".

And the master tech race engine builder laughed at me.

Generally, the best place to read about this stuff on the net is F1 forums:
http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9346

b9009b · Mar 13, 2015

Thanks Buli. The amount of engineering and metal working that goes into these things is off the charts.

So how can I load the engine without going over 7.5k rpm and adding more weight to it?

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