Trade my Panigale in for a Vespa?

Ducati Forum

Help Support Ducati Forum:

Ok, so I just got off the phone with Ducati's HQ in Cupertino. First off, they are doing everything they can. That's not me quoting what they said, that's my summary after our call(s). (The Pope and the four horsemen of the apocalypse were mentioned as being involved....)

In any case, guy who spent all day with my bike on Saturday is a Ducati Jedi from HQ. The diagnosis: Rings and Pistons.

I've heard of bad rings causing high idle on a two stroke, but only a rough idle on a four stroke engine. However, it's possible that the electronics compensate for idle anarchy. But I'm not the guru so I'm not going to speculate.

AND - Before everyone goes nuts thinking the 1199 only has 30,000 miles before a rebuild is necessary, keep in mind that a prior dealer who I won't name did not seal the airbox properly when they put the tank back on during a service. Unfiltered air into the engine does things like pits valves and destroy rings. As long as your airbox seals are tight, I highly doubt any of you have to worry. (Jeez, I hope my cylinders aren't scored, too.)

Parts should arrive by the end of the week or beginning of next. Thanks everyone who reached out to me with suggestions and recommendations and offers both on and offline.
 
AntiHero said:
Ok, so I just got off the phone with Ducati's HQ in Cupertino. First off, they are doing everything they can. That's not me quoting what they said, that's my summary after our call(s). (The Pope and the four horsemen of the apocalypse were mentioned as being involved....)

In any case, guy who spent all day with my bike on Saturday is a Ducati Jedi from HQ. The diagnosis: Rings and Pistons.

I've heard of bad rings causing high idle on a two stroke, but only a rough idle on a four stroke engine. However, it's possible that the electronics compensate for idle anarchy. But I'm not the guru so I'm not going to speculate.

AND - Before everyone goes nuts thinking the 1199 only has 30,000 miles before a rebuild is necessary, keep in mind that a prior dealer who I won't name did not seal the airbox properly when they put the tank back on during a service. Unfiltered air into the engine does things like pits valves and destroy rings. As long as your airbox seals are tight, I highly doubt any of you have to worry. (Jeez, I hope my cylinders aren't scored, too.)

Parts should arrive by the end of the week or beginning of next. Thanks everyone who reached out to me with suggestions and recommendations and offers both on and offline.
Click to expand...

I wonder who the Ducati Jedi was...Maybe someone from the Corse team? Hope the fix goes well I'm pulling for yah!
 
OK, I lost with my network cable bet then :)
But, didn't the Not To Be Mentioned dealer change the heads because of the very same symptom?
 
AntiHero said:
Ok, so I just got off the phone with Ducati's HQ in Cupertino. First off, they are doing everything they can. That's not me quoting what they said, that's my summary after our call(s). (The Pope and the four horsemen of the apocalypse were mentioned as being involved....)

In any case, guy who spent all day with my bike on Saturday is a Ducati Jedi from HQ. The diagnosis: Rings and Pistons.

I've heard of bad rings causing high idle on a two stroke, but only a rough idle on a four stroke engine. However, it's possible that the electronics compensate for idle anarchy. But I'm not the guru so I'm not going to speculate.

AND - Before everyone goes nuts thinking the 1199 only has 30,000 miles before a rebuild is necessary, keep in mind that a prior dealer who I won't name did not seal the airbox properly when they put the tank back on during a service. Unfiltered air into the engine does things like pits valves and destroy rings. As long as your airbox seals are tight, I highly doubt any of you have to worry. (Jeez, I hope my cylinders aren't scored, too.)

Parts should arrive by the end of the week or beginning of next. Thanks everyone who reached out to me with suggestions and recommendations and offers both on and offline.
Click to expand...

They must have done a leak-down test.
Probably even looked in the cylinders with a Borescope.

If your rings are damaged, they will be doing the cylinder sleeves as well.
It's the only way to put it all right;)
It's a simple thing to do since the heads are off, and you'll be in the best possible place.

Enjoy the trip:)
 
HotIce said:
OK, I lost with my network cable bet then :)
But, didn't the Not To Be Mentioned dealer change the heads because of the very same symptom?
Click to expand...

Ducati Newport Beach changed out the heads--they were not the ones responsible for the airbox seal-issue. An engine tuner buddy of mine at the time the heads were replaced actually said, 'if it pitted the valves, the rings are probably shot, too'. Looks like he was right.

As for the engineer tasked with the fix--I know he's worked on factory WSBK bikes before, so who knows, maybe I'll even pick up another 40 horsepower when it's all said and done. :)
 
Well Dennis, hopefully this is the fix you've been waiting for. I'm looking forward to hearing some good news from you sometime later next week. Then you can put this behind you and focus on the important stuff. Your trip around the world! Fingers crossed I hope everything works out.
 
Glad they found the problem. Looking forward to your round the world trip. Ask Ducati if the could put in some high compression pistons in with some light weight Ti con rods for your troubles and maybe throw in some racing cams. That way could get through your round the world trip really really fast:D
 
AntiHero said:
Ducati Newport Beach changed out the heads--they were not the ones responsible for the airbox seal-issue. An engine tuner buddy of mine at the time the heads were replaced actually said, 'if it pitted the valves, the rings are probably shot, too'. Looks like he was right.
Click to expand...
I might be lost in this drama, so help me in the chronology of the events :)

1) You had unstable idle issues.
2) They changed the heads and sleeves in trying to fix. bike ran fine for 1000 miles.
3) Somehow the airbox seal did not end up being sealed correctly.
4) You ended up with the same idle issues again because of dirty air fscking up the rings.

Is that close to the facts?


As for the engineer tasked with the fix--I know he's worked on factory WSBK bikes before, so who knows, maybe I'll even pick up another 40 horsepower when it's all said and done. :)
Click to expand...
:D
 
HotIce said:
I might be lost in this drama, so help me in the chronology of the events :)

1) You had unstable idle issues.
2) They changed the heads and sleeves in trying to fix. bike ran fine for 1000 miles.
3) Somehow the airbox seal did not end up being sealed correctly.
4) You ended up with the same idle issues again because of dirty air fscking up the rings.

Is that close to the facts?


:D
Click to expand...
In this order:
Coughing/popping exhaust at idle
Then high idle
I removed the Charcoal Canister. No dice.
Dealer replaced exhaust thinking CATs were clogged. At the time they also replaced the heat shield (I asked for just the side covers, not the new heat shield), but they put it all on, which involved removing the tank.
Drove another 4k miles.
Took it in several times, but they couldn't replicate the problem.
I replaced TPS. No dice.
I pulled the tank off to see if there were any vacuum leaks. Found the airbox hadn't been sealed, found one vacuum line hadn't been connected and discovered the fuel overflow lines hadn't been connected, either. Fixed it all, but again, no dice.
Let Ducati know about the seal. They did a leakdown test and replaced the heads and ECU. Bike was ok for 1k miles.
Took it in again. They couldn't replicate problem.
Drove it to the shop while it was doing it a week or so later. Ducati regional technical director happened to be onsite. (Yes!)
Thought they found the issue with a valve in the exhaust. Fixed, but no dice.
More big guns spend a couple days with it and now the verdict is: rings/pistons.
 
Last edited:
AntiHero said:
In this order:
Coughing/popping exhaust at idle
Then high idle
I removed the Charcoal Canister. No dice.
Dealer replaced exhaust thinking CATs were clogged. At the time they also replaced the heat shield (I asked for just the side covers, not the new heat shield), but they put it all on, which involved removing the tank.
Drove another 4k miles.
Took it in several times, but they couldn't replicate the problem.
I replaced TPS. No dice.
I pulled the tank off to see if there were any vacuum leaks. Found the airbox hadn't been sealed, found one vacuum line hadn't been connected and discovered the fuel overflow lines hadn't been connected, either. Fixed it all, but again, no dice.
Let Ducati know about the seal. They did a leakdown test and replaced the heads and ECU. Bike was ok for 1k miles.
Took it in again. They couldn't replicate problem.
Drove it to the shop while it was doing it a week or so later. Ducati regional technical director happened to be onsite. (Yes!)
Thought they found the issue with a valve in the exhaust. Fixed, but no dice.
More big guns spend a couple days with it and now the verdict is: rings/pistons.
Click to expand...

Duh, thanks.
Somehow, in my head, "heads" meant the whole upper end (sleeves, pistons, head), instead of what "head" *really* means. Head :rolleyes:
This was what got me confused, thinking that pistons, sleeves and rings had been already replaced before.

This should teach you something though. Stay out of the gravel roads in your trips :D
 
Ya mean stay out of gravel and dirt roads when air is allowed to bypass the air fliter!

I saw way too many incredible things while cruising around on unpaved roads.

il_570xN.583866760_pvc3.jpg


I know there will be times on my upcoming trip that I'll regret not being on a more capable off-road bike, but I know I'd regret not being on the Panigale while on pavement. Maybe a multi - or a "TerraCorsa Monster" will be my weapons of choice for RTW trip #2. :D
 
Last edited:
How did you notice that the air box hadn't been sealed properly? Just by the dust inside the air box or something else?
 
When you pull the tank the seal stays in place. Instead of bilateral symmetry, a portion of the seal on the right side of the bike had been squashed in. So much so that even after I pulled the seal off it remained in that squashed position. Happened to be in exactly the place you wedge your hand in when reconnecting the fuel quick release, indicating that the last mechanic reconnected the fuel lines, he pushed the rubber over and into the airbox, snapped the connector, then pulled his hand out and left the seal down where it wasn't supposed to be.

I cleaned out dust and even some leaf particles. Wasn't like the whole interior was covered in filth, but there was debris, which most certainly should not be in there.
 
AntiHero said:
When you pull the tank the seal stays in place. Instead of bilateral symmetry, a portion of the seal on the right side of the bike had been squashed in. So much so that even after I pulled the seal off it remained in that squashed position. Happened to be in exactly the place you wedge your hand in when reconnecting the fuel quick release, indicating that the last mechanic reconnected the fuel lines, he pushed the rubber over and into the airbox, snapped the connector, then pulled his hand out and left the seal down where it wasn't supposed to be.

I cleaned out dust and even some leaf particles. Wasn't like the whole interior was covered in filth, but there was debris, which most certainly should not be in there.
Click to expand...

have your cylinder bores checked for scoring
 
One step ahead of you Steve. Planned on having those checked when she's apart, but sleeves? I didn't think modern bikes had sleeves anymore....
 

Similar threads

J
Exhaust Help
Replies
17
Views
536
Jaapanese
J
General13
Panigale V2 2024 Improvements
Replies
2
Views
203
General13
General13
mayhan1980
Panigale to Streetfighter?
Replies
7
Views
480
baggerman
B
ManfredTokyo
Commuting through the winter
Replies
5
Views
208
ManfredTokyo
ManfredTokyo
S
My many Panigale V4's Past and Present
Replies
0
Views
64
Sustainable Triumphs
S

Register CTA

Register on Ducati Forum! This sidebar will go away, and you will see fewer ads.

Recent Discussions

Back
Top