Hard starting

RiverRoadWarrior said:

Just got mine this last weekend. Having the same issue. Typically after sitting more than a few minutes after riding. Letting sit for an hour, starts fine. 20-30 min, no start. Smell of fuel. Ambient temp doesn't seem to matter as it did the same thing at night as it did during the day while 20 degrees cooler outside. Anybody get a solution yet?

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My dealer removed the charcoal canister on mine, and it seemed to do the trick.

I had major hard start issues, but after the most recent up map it seems to be fine. BH Ducati guys reasoned it must have been flooding so the up map smoothed the ride and resolved hard start........all good!

SOULRIDER said:

My dealer removed the charcoal canister on mine, and it seemed to do the trick.

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GSXRs had this issue. When the charcoal canister heated up the fumes would 'flood' the motor. Removing the canister 'fixed' the issue.

Another thing to keep in mind is 1199 uses a smaller battery to save weight, because it has an engine decompression feature allowing for easier start up. But maybe the battery is just too small.

Heat also increases resistance to the starter. That's why in old cars when the starter is about to give out it would be very difficult to start when hot. Dump some cold water onto the starter helps.

Rhino said:

Can anyone answer whether the carbon cannister is ONLY on US models?

Is anyone in Aus having these starting problems?

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I'm from the Philippines. Our Panigales are Euro Versions... No Carbon Canisters on the Euro Versions. I have terrible hard starting issues. My Bike has Termi slip-ons and termi Flash Drive installed...hard starting still persist.

Had my dealer install new updated map...bike's torque at low rpm is much better with the new updated map, BUT hard starting is still there. I have informed my dealer about it...but they do not know what is causing this hard starting issue.

Just last Sunday Dec. 23...I was in my garage, suited up and ready to ride...when I turned on the ignition, waited for the pump cycle, hit the starter button, the bike didnt fire up. Did this 8 fakin times!!!!!! Then on the 9th attempt, the bike started!

I love everything about my Panigale "S" except for this hard start issue thats pissing me off. My Dealer cant pin-point the cure of the problem.

Dont know what to do!!!!!!

If they can't fix it, it's a lemon....period!

My original 999R was the same ....! Sucks that we pay premium for this crap. Some fan boy will jump in and say that 'every other bike have problems' yada yada. I have plenty of bikes, and only the ducati does this, and funny that only Ducatistis allow themselves to be raped like this.

I refused to pick up my bike if they can't fix it. They couldn't. I got a 999R xerox in its place.

The fuel pump fixed mine without issue. Up maps, charcoal cannisters and such not even considered. Replaced the pump and have not had an issue since.

I lifted my gas tank, inspected my gas tank's vent hose and it was kinked really badly. Replaced the kinked hose to a better one....I will ride the Pani tomorrow morning and check if the Vent hose can solve my hard starting issues....

Termi Slip-ons with UpMap didnt solve it
New Updated map didnt solve it either
and I dont have a charcoal canister being a Euro version model...it also didnt solve it...

So I hope this Kinked Vent hose under the tank on the right side will solve it....Crossing my fingers!

Picked mine up yesterday, the bike started up on first try but blew out a bit of smoke, thought that was odd, rode 2 miles down the road n stopped at the gas station to fill up the tank for the 1.5 hr ride home n couldn't start her back up!

Tried 6 times, n finally got her started by cracking a throttle a little. The outside temp is 48F.

Got to town, stopped by my friend's house to show him the bike.. Stayed for 20 min n then had the same issue with starting her up.. It's a 2012 Panigale S n she is brand new!! WTF? This is my 4th Duc, n I haven't had any starting issue b4. Wished I had seen this thread first n talked to the dealership abt it b4 I picked up my bike!!

SOULRIDER said:

My dealer removed the charcoal canister on mine, and it seemed to do the trick.

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Worked on mine. No trouble since.

Try this... Next time you ride the bike, let it idle for 30 seconds before shutting it off. Do NOT rev it and kill it.

bwaide said:

Anybody else having any issues with hard starts?

The bike starts up no problem when I first fire it up before I ride. Thing is, when I take a break it's tough too get started when the motor is hot. Been in the 90's since I picked up the bike last week and it always hovers around the 200+ mark unless I'm over 50. When I go to start it after a break it's in the 180-190 range and takes a good 5+ seconds to get the bike to start. Battery has plenty of juice and it isn't straining just seems like the bike doesn't want to turn over. Sounds almost like an older carbureted bike on a cold day is the best way to describe it.

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Try 10 minutes of chugging, hissing and not starting, This happened to me twice. I drive in fair weather, for over an hour. PArk it for about 30 minutes and that .... happens. Finally after trying and trying i just leave the key on for a few minutes then it started right up! MOTHER ...... that just pisses me off. less than 600 miles also! I have a video of this process and trying to start if anyone is interested ......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKJdTp-SGno

GET RID OF THE CHARCOAL CANISTER! I had the exact same issue, EXACTLY! Getting rid of the charcoal canister fixed it. Engine heat is causing vapor lock with the canister on. Get it removed.

RiverRoadWarrior said:

GET RID OF THE CHARCOAL CANISTER! I had the exact same issue, EXACTLY! Getting rid of the charcoal canister fixed it. Engine heat is causing vapor lock with the canister on. Get it removed.

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+1

MUNDMAN said:

+1

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+2

Like RiverRoadWarrior mentioned ditch the canister.

When it does happen give it a little gas, and she will fire up.

RiverRoadWarrior said:

GET RID OF THE CHARCOAL CANISTER! I had the exact same issue, EXACTLY! Getting rid of the charcoal canister fixed it. Engine heat is causing vapor lock with the canister on. Get it removed.

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what purpose did the canister originally serve? Is there any reason for it to begin with? Any side effects of taking it off? Also is this something easy to do on my own or do i need to get the dealer to do it?

SoutheastJay said:

what purpose did the canister originally serve? Is there any reason for it to begin with? Any side effects of taking it off? Also is this something easy to do on my own or do i need to get the dealer to do it?

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Emissions. Unless your moving to California I wouldn't worry.

A few of the members did it themselves. I believe there are some instructions posted in the thread.

SoutheastJay said:

what purpose did the canister originally serve? Is there any reason for it to begin with? Any side effects of taking it off? Also is this something easy to do on my own or do i need to get the dealer to do it?

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You can thank the EPA for emissions controls. Side effect? A little pollution.

I'm sure you could do it yourself, but I can't tell ya how. I don't know. Maybe someone else here can tell ya how. All I know is I haven't had the issue one single time since mine "fell off".

FUEL PUMP FUEL PUMP FUEL PUMP......I had the exact same problem. I still have my canister. You can try but the canister first but then warrant the SOB. Have the dealer call Ducati Austin and speak with Rory McGuire.

mavic said:

FUEL PUMP FUEL PUMP FUEL PUMP......I had the exact same problem. I still have my canister. You can try but the canister first but then warrant the SOB. Have the dealer call Ducati Austin and speak with Rory McGuire.

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was it just random for you also? its only happened twice so far...

It would appear random. But if you really focus on the events, you will likely find the common factors that you can try to reproduce and identify the vital few X's within the issue.
Here were the keys to make it reproducable for my situation:
Ride 15-30min and park in direct sunlight between 30min -1:15 with temps above 90 F. If the bike sat for greater than 2hrs the situation was much more intermittent. Once the dealer put the same conditions in place the bike failed 3 times. After the fuel pump replacement we never had a failure under the same or very similar conditions.

I tried opening the gas tank prior to starting and still experienced failure. I am not convinced of the Vapor lock theory from the canister. As vapor lock is best defined as fuel vaporized within a fuel line to which the canister system is not connected. The canister feeds directly into the intakes of the cylinders below the injectors. It is pure vapor. All raw fuel is captured within the canister due to runoff from the tank and it also relieves the pressure in the tank by recombusting the fuel vapors instead of allowing them to exhaust to the atmosphere. However, if the fuel pump is delivering lower than expected pressure it might not overcoming the vapor lock condition within the lines. That is pure speculation on my part in an attempt to identify the model behind the failure. All I know is that we replaced the pump and the last 9 months were hard start free and it was mighty hot in Texas over 6 of those months. Others have had luck with the canister, it is free and what the heck. Give it a shot but at least try to account of the amount of time you rode, what the environmental conditions were like and how long the bike sat each time you experience the issue and you might find the right combination to make it more repeatable. Good Luck!!

See the picture and part #9. You will see where it connects below the injection system.