New Panigale V4 is ugly?

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Is the New Panigale ugly?

  • I like the older look more

  • I like the new design best


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This.

I also find some of the innovation a little off putting. ABS and TC/SC/WC are one thing.because they can be tuned to save us from mistakes while not simply doing everything for us, but the auto rear brake strikes me as something else. To some extent at least, I want to hone my skill, not have the bike do everything for me.

What ideal are we pursuing - an entirely automated, risk free riding experience? Do we want to be able to just jump on a bike and run near- pro lap times without any skill? Do we want auto transmissions with launch control and a suite of electronic rider aids so sophisticated that all we have to do is whack the throttle wide open, grab the brakes at 100%, throw the bike into a corner at max lean, and let the nannies sort every aspect for us?

Is this the evolutionary course we’re on? Get on the bike with no skill, twist the throttle and get max acceleration with controlled slip, grab the brake and get and max braking with controlled lock, throw the bike into a corner and get auto max lean angle while the bike backs itself into the corner for us?

Not intending to speak definitively - juat thinking out loud. :)

I’m having the same thought process about the electronic improvements, especially the rear braking thing. I’ve been working on using that rear brake well for a year now and finally feel like I’m decent at it, or at least good enough at using it that I understand how useful and fun it is to use.

So the rear braking system on the new bike fascinates me but also weirds me out a bit. I mean I spent a year developing a skill and now the bike does it for you???

I’m also concerned about what happens to all these electronics if you want to upgrade the spec of the Ohlins to a true track or race spec carts and rear shock that’s manual not digital adjust…we’ll see I guess. Also how finicky is the electronics system in general to seeming innocuous changes, like running a 125 versus 120 tire on the front, or removing the headlights/taillights etc.

An then there’s what I call the Kramer affect for me personally. I bought the KTM RC 8C which is a MUCH more analogue bike than even my 2020 model year 25 Anniversario 916 specifically to become a better rider, and it’s working. I was a full 7 seconds faster at Chuckwallah this last weekend than I ever was on my V4. With 100 less HP to play with. Precisely because the lower power more analogue bike is giving me ‘space’ to improve my skill.

I 100% believe riders will be a little faster in the new bike, and almost as important the new bike will beat you up less on long track days which actually makes things more fun over the long run. But you aren’t gunna grab gobs of time improvement unless YOU really refine your riding, and I’m not sure yet if the new bike and its rider aids allow the ‘space’ within it it to do so.

I’m gunna get one for sure, especially if it’s true or likely true that it’ll be 2 years for the R to come out and that may be a smaller displacement R.

But I suspect that I’ll keep riding the RC 8C 90% of the time at track, or at least until I’m in the low 1:50’s at Chuck (and that’ll be awhile 😂😂😂) and wip out the Ducati when I want to set a lap time using the skill I gain on the RC 8C.
 
This.

I also find some of the innovation a little off putting. ABS and TC/SC/WC are one thing.because they can be tuned to save us from mistakes while not simply doing everything for us, but the auto rear brake strikes me as something else. To some extent at least, I want to hone my skill, not have the bike do everything for me.

What ideal are we pursuing - an entirely automated, risk free riding experience? Do we want to be able to just jump on a bike and run near- pro lap times without any skill? Do we want auto transmissions with launch control and a suite of electronic rider aids so sophisticated that all we have to do is whack the throttle wide open, grab the brakes at 100%, throw the bike into a corner at max lean, and let the nannies sort every aspect for us?

Is this the evolutionary course we’re on? Get on the bike with no skill, twist the throttle and get max acceleration with controlled slip, grab the brake and get and max braking with controlled lock, throw the bike into a corner and get auto max lean angle while the bike backs itself into the corner for us?

Not intending to speak definitively - juat thinking out loud. :)
We are being automated away. Everywhere. The electronics will become so prevalent that soon what? Squids in shorts with knee pucks (elbow)? The electronics when added to a decent skillset is a good thing. Added to no skillset? I like you struggle with this. Steven's comment is perfect, " I spent a year developing a skill the bike now does it for you".
 
I’d love to try the seamless if they release it. :)

I’m just wondering out loud - if you could jump on a bike at your current skill level, and the bike was so autonomous it would enable you to ride a second off Bagnaia’s pace, would you want that? I don’t think I would.

I would be grabbing the brakes and crying…

No matter what electronic aids there are, you’ve still got to ride the thing and overcome what’s between your ears, aside from technique, etc.
 
We are being automated away. Everywhere. The electronics will become so prevalent that soon what? Squids in shorts with knee pucks (elbow)? The electronics when added to a decent skillset is a good thing. Added to no skillset? I like you struggle with this. Steven's comment is perfect, " I spent a year developing a skill the bike now does it for you".

It probably does it better as well.
 
I’d love to try the seamless if they release it. :)

I’m just wondering out loud - if you could jump on a bike at your current skill level, and the bike was so autonomous it would enable you to ride a second off Bagnaia’s pace, would you want that? I don’t think I would.

Exactly, I mean the thrill aspect of riding these bikes at speed is cool and all, but what keeps me coming back track day after track day is the chasing of me doing it a little better each time.
 
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@Steven31371 That is an impressive time improvement.

It would be interesting to see how much of that transfers over when you are on a litre bike.

Yeah I was thinking about that too and am tempted to put my V4 back into track spec and see lol…but overall I’m still pretty slow in the grand scheme of things so I’ll wait.

Which by the way is why I took my V4 out of track spec, so I wouldn’t be tempted by it too easily and jump back on it…that power is addictive haha
 
Not by me but maybe by one of my customers

With the astronomical cost of the full exhaust these days, the option you are talking about can get some traction, but will need a proper post with the sound, weight saving and power before and after. If you can offer 80% of gains with decent sound at a fraction of the cost, market could be there.
 
@Steven31371 That is an impressive time improvement.

It would be interesting to see how much of that transfers over when you are on a litre bike.

Looking at the data alone I think I would be faster on the Ducati. The Ducati turns REALLY well, almost as good as the RC 8C, so I don’t think I’ll lose anything on roll speed through corners between the bikes…I think I’ll lose a 1/4 to 1/2 a second on each braking zone on the Ducati but gain 3/4 to a full second on most straights. I don’t think I’ll gain that much on acceleration off an apex on the Ducati I have, because while the Ducati has more power the RC 8C you can get much harder into the throttle way earlier. Although that’s where the electronics on the new Ducati will probably shine.

Also with regard to getting on throttle coming off a corner, on the RC 8C I find myself comfortable going just over the limits of traction with the rear tire, letting it spin just a tiny bit so I’m using more of the available power, whereas on my model year Ducati I was never REALLY comfortable spinning that back tire a tiny bit coming off a corner. But again the new electronics may inspire more confidence there.
 
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With the astronomical cost of the full exhaust these days, the option you are talking about can get some traction, but will need a proper post with the sound, weight saving and power before and after. If you can offer 80% of gains with decent sound at a fraction of the cost, market could be there.

The exhaust being more than one third of the price of the base bike is actually quite ridiculous.
 
I think Kramers are best suited for clubsport circuits with tighter layout and for those who do tons of track time and don't need it to be streetable. I never had a chance to ride a lightweight race bike, but I did find Panigale V4 way too much for smaller local circuits and could easily see than a smaller 600 or something like RC8C would have been a better bike for that. On a wider MotoGP circuit Panigale shines. I've never been too concerned with too much electronics and rider aids. You still need to be proper hero to ride a motorcycle fast. You inputs and all fundamentals have to be on point, not to mention your own shape and physical abilities. Pretty much all top bikes now have yaw angle controls both under acceleration and braking, but only fastest riders exploit that. But I do agree, when the brake is applied for the sake of faster lap time it is a bit of a new level of assist - something we didn't have before, but I want it.
 
This makes no sense. The “stock” S model can be run at MotoGP pace. Base will need suspension, wheels, labor.
wheels and suspension are quite easy to get, some people sell slightly used ones at less then retail, take a look at the classifieds
Good point on the labor $ tho, this kind of kit is pretty difficult to install.
 
What’s the word on the new R? I’m waiting to order one of those but hearing about a displacement change is not what I want to hear.
 

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