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Electronics are difficult get right and easy to get wrong. Sounds like too much work and added complexity for marginal gains for a track bike. If this was a race bike, go for it.
New Panigale V4 is ugly?
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Electronics are difficult get right and easy to get wrong. Sounds like too much work and added complexity for marginal gains for a track bike. If this was a race bike, go for it.
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That’s the whole thing with HRC software, it’s actually intuitive to use. Also, I think too much emphasis with this kind of thing gets put on ‘will it make you faster or not’, I think that’s the wrong emphasis altogether for non-elite riders. The real question should be: “Does it make you feel better riding the bike?”
Did you gather up gobs of seconds when you adjusted you geometry? Or did it just make you more comfortable on the bike which will PRESUMABLY/EVENTUALLY lead to faster lap times?
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Wasn’t able to fully assess. Bike decided to not play ball
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Pumping water is overrated
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Interestingly I think I’m probably going to get the new V4 as I kind of think through everything out loud in these threads. But for sure I’m also getting the FIREBLADE too. I’ll have the KTM RC 8C as my middle weight TRACK ONLY scalpel, and the Fireblade as my liter bike TRACK ONLY ripper.
And have the Ducati be what it is, the street bike Ferrari of bikes.
There’s no question that off the shelf the Fireblade is built to turn into a better track bike for less money than a Ducati V4…Honda is building their Halo street bike specifically to be the best Superstock 1000 bike in the world where you can’t change much but the tune on the bike to compete in that class, and they are dominating every race series around the world in that class. It’s a bike specifically built to convert easily and cheaply to the best liter track weapon on the market.
Ducati on the other hand is making the sexiest bike in the world with rider aids that will help you go fast without killing their client base while “Exciting all the senses”. But it’s absurdly expensive to turn into a track bike that’s not as good as the purpose built Fireblade.
The Ducati has a sexiness too it though, like driving a Ferrari, everything about it just feels good to ride. They aren’t lying in their marketing materials when they say they want to build a bike with a FEELING to that ‘excites all the senses’.
It’s a Ferrari plain and simple…only if you are REALLY wealthy are you going to track a Ferrari…and there are better options out there for that. But you will (if you have the cheddar) ride a Ferrari around everyday feeling like king of the world while REALLY enjoying the driving experience.
So I’ll likely do what each bike is actually intended for. Cheaply and easily convert the Fireblade to just about the best track weapon available on the market in a liter bike…and between track days when I want to ride go out on my Ducati that excites all the senses that way, and is purpose built for that.
And have the Ducati be what it is, the street bike Ferrari of bikes.
There’s no question that off the shelf the Fireblade is built to turn into a better track bike for less money than a Ducati V4…Honda is building their Halo street bike specifically to be the best Superstock 1000 bike in the world where you can’t change much but the tune on the bike to compete in that class, and they are dominating every race series around the world in that class. It’s a bike specifically built to convert easily and cheaply to the best liter track weapon on the market.
Ducati on the other hand is making the sexiest bike in the world with rider aids that will help you go fast without killing their client base while “Exciting all the senses”. But it’s absurdly expensive to turn into a track bike that’s not as good as the purpose built Fireblade.
The Ducati has a sexiness too it though, like driving a Ferrari, everything about it just feels good to ride. They aren’t lying in their marketing materials when they say they want to build a bike with a FEELING to that ‘excites all the senses’.
It’s a Ferrari plain and simple…only if you are REALLY wealthy are you going to track a Ferrari…and there are better options out there for that. But you will (if you have the cheddar) ride a Ferrari around everyday feeling like king of the world while REALLY enjoying the driving experience.
So I’ll likely do what each bike is actually intended for. Cheaply and easily convert the Fireblade to just about the best track weapon available on the market in a liter bike…and between track days when I want to ride go out on my Ducati that excites all the senses that way, and is purpose built for that.
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Your prices are unreal, with exception of exhaust.
V4S/R EVO3 is already at the level of HRC but without ability to tune stuff.
Oz Wheels are 2500 for both, rear sets same price. sutter clutch same monies
R comes with dry clutch already that is decent enough for
here few links before you start screaming
ADJUSTABLE REARSETS SPIDER WSBK SILVER DUCATI PANIGALE V4R
ADJUSTABLE REARSETS SPIDER SBK for Ducati PANIGALE V4R
SuterClutch Ducati Panigale V4R 19-22
The BTL (Back Torque Limiter) SuterClutch was specifically developed to improve lap times while reducing the physical effort required by the rider. It can be simply and easily adjusted to different conditions and rider styles. It reduces the strain on all components including the gearbox...
suterproducts.com
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Your prices are unreal, with exception of exhaust.
V4S/R EVO3 is already at the level of HRC but without ability to tune stuff.
Oz Wheels are 2500 for both, rear sets same price. sutter clutch same monies
R comes with dry clutch already that is decent enough for
here few links before you start screaming
ADJUSTABLE REARSETS SPIDER WSBK SILVER DUCATI PANIGALE V4R
ADJUSTABLE REARSETS SPIDER SBK for Ducati PANIGALE V4Rwww.desmo-racing.com
SuterClutch Ducati Panigale V4R 19-22
The BTL (Back Torque Limiter) SuterClutch was specifically developed to improve lap times while reducing the physical effort required by the rider. It can be simply and easily adjusted to different conditions and rider styles. It reduces the strain on all components including the gearbox...
Yeah and to add on, the specific wheel setup I want for the Fireblade is gunna be about $5k
Having said that, show me the spider rearsets for the 2025…they don’t exist, and when they do (if they ever do) they will be way more expensive than on previous bikes, because there are at least two to three models they will have to make. Each with a different configuration for the rear brake MC depending on exhaust type.
In any case, right now the only racing rearsets available for the 2025 Pani are $1900 in the US.
Not sure about prices yet but they do exist and will be shown at EICMA - two models, the same as DP have done. Both fixed pegs as far as I understand it. I think I mentioned this earlier in the thread.
There are a few videos showing it being used and it looks quite easy to use. It also looks like it does work with the SP as far as I can tell.
Don’t you think you’ll be tempted to find out what the Panigale is like on track? I don’t really think a Panigale makes much sense for the road, putting aside the feel-good vibes that you mentioned. I’ve not ridden my SP2 once this year - all my riding has been on track.
I assume you’ve ordered the base Fireblade. I’ll be interested to hear what parts you use and what you think of the bike.
For the V4 or the Fireblade I’m in two minds about going for a base or the S/SP - I suspect the third generation electronic suspension is very good and more than good enough for faster times than I’m likely to do. I do wonder if modifying the base is still the best way to go for anyone other than the fastest riders, considering improvements in electronic suspension.
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Stock being the operative word and BSB superstock is the fireblade cup
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For sure I’ll take the new Pani V4 out on the track for a spin, easy to through some slicks on and have a go, I’m just not gunna modify it specifically for track. I also do t ride on the street much but like to have a bike I can jump on and go fir a quick 20 or 30 minute romp on especially if there is a month or so between track days.
For the Fireblade SP I ordered the very 1st thing I’m going to do is lighten the rotating assemblies. I’ve got my eye on a set of BST GP Tek wheels and a CF sprocket carrier that go with the wheels. And take as much other weight as I can out of it like headlights, taillights, etc…then the HRC Race ECU and wiring loom, Ohlins GP shock and HRC has several shock linkages in their parts catalogue to choose from, I’ll let RoadracerX sort that for me. For the forks probably carts, but I have an eye on a set of 2nd hand WSBK forks that will fit the bike that are recently serviced and in good shape that aren’t even sold to the public that will fit the bike and look badass. We have to wait a bit for an exhaust, Sparks makes a full titanium setup for the Fireblade but like all the exhausts for it they are pre-split intake engines. You can’t use those on the current bike because must of the the headers combine 4 into 2 with cylinders 1 and 3 and 2 and 4 combining. For the new split throttle body set you need the headers from cylinders 1and2 and 3and4 combing for everything to work as intended. Oh BIKEHPS has a taller windscreen for the Fireblade too, that’s a must for me.
In the Ducati I’ll get the S, with the race cans not the full exhaust, a taller windscreen, rearsets when they come out. And probably not much else.
Who knows though. I may end up riding the V4S at track more than the Fireblade SP…because real life happens, and we haven’t risen either bike yet. Although RoadRacerX steered me right as rain with pushing me to get the RC 8C, so I think he’s doing the same thing now with the Fireblade for a liter track bike. He has every bike you can imagine except the 25 V4 obviously and tracks them all, and is the fastest non-pro rider I know. Who also use to be a pro-rider, he consults little independent race teams too.
I haven’t even sat on the Fireblade and there aren’t any nearby, whereas I have sat on the V4S and I immediately loved it. The tank felt great, it felt light and the throttle was excellent as well.
I have a feeling that a V4S with a half exhaust, TPMS, DDL, remove the lights and stick some protection on and some rearsets and it would be more than enough for an awesome track bike that would be capable of far more than I’m ever going to throw at it (some springs for my weight as well I expect). For the same money or probably quite a bit less I imagine you could have a very nicely tricked out Fireblade that would probably be better, although maybe not with me on board…
Do they not sell the base Fireblade in the US or did you go for the SP for other reasons? I don’t think you can get the base model in the UK but we do get it in the EU.
It may sound a bit ridiculous but I have a question in my mind. In Wsbk races all bikes are equipped with high-end components and usually 3 of the top 5 are Ducati, now that the situation is like this how can Honda be better than Ducati? The costs may be expensive but I still don't understand how it is faster 
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It may sound a bit ridiculous but I have a question in my mind. In Wsbk races all bikes are equipped with high-end components and usually 3 of the top 5 are Ducati, now that the situation is like this how can Honda be better than Ducati? The costs may be expensive but I still don't understand how it is faster
Because the differences are tiny but very important at the sharp end of the sport. That and the quality of the riders, crew chiefs etc. There are a lot of moving parts to a successful campaign, sure the Ducati is "better" but in the context of us here on the street and trackday scene its pretty much irrelevant. Get the bike that you like, that fits you and you can ride is about the sum of it. Any top of the line litrebike is going to be more than good enough for going fast, e.g. I spoke to a guy who just go his first Duc which was a 23 V4. He loved the looks and sound but he was more confident and faster on track with his older S1000RR.
I know a SP2 owner who was quicker and felt more confident on his RSV4.
It’s a good point you made about just getting the bike you want – all of them will be far more capable than 99% of us on the forum.
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It may sound a bit ridiculous but I have a question in my mind. In Wsbk races all bikes are equipped with high-end components and usually 3 of the top 5 are Ducati, now that the situation is like this how can Honda be better than Ducati? The costs may be expensive but I still don't understand how it is faster
1st, neither you nor I can get realistic access to the parts that make the Ducati faster in the WSBK race series…so the bikes that are winning races no one can buy.
You see there are multiple race series with different levels of modifications allowed.
The Superstock 1000 racing class is very easily attainable in terms of modifications for you and me…in that class of bike, that’s actually attainable by the average person, Ducati is no where to be seen. Honda Fireblades dominate that class with BMW 2nd and Yamaha 3rd.
Ducati doesn’t want to sell you an attainable race bike, they want to sell the Ferrari of road bikes and only spend money on the very highest levels of racing to sell you on a racing ‘heritage’ for your very fancy road bike, similar to Ferrari’s biz and marketing model. WSBK and Moto GP gets the most attention so they focus on those. In those racing classes you need professional race teams to manage the tech on the bike, tech that you can’t realistically buy.
So you and I, who do not have a team of professional race personnel, and access to the engines and suspension components and custom fabbed seats and tanks brakes and all the other stuff cannot simply buy the stuff needed to have a similar bike.
You can however fairly cheaply and with easy access buy the parts needed to win races in Superstock 1000’s…just not from Ducati
…has to be from Honda, BMW, or Yamaha. With Honda far and away being the leader of the pack.So if you want a very sexy bike that’s excited all your senses in a road bike, Ducati is your best choice. If you want a race bike Honda is your best choice.
If you want a bike that easy to learn to ride fast at the track then liter bikes in general are the wrong choice. But if your an experienced track day rider and fairly fast already and want a liter bike that’s the fastest you can get it’s probably a Honda right now. If you want the liter bike that’s the easiest of the liter bikes to ride fast but not as competitive at the very fastest levels of track day riding the 2025 Ducati looks like the best bet. But it’s also by far the most expensive way to get a bike that’s on par with other very fast liter bike options.
To be fair to Ducati though, the total package of the new 2025 bike will probably be the easiest liter bike to ride fast (though not the fastest) at the track day level.
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1st, neither you nor I can get realistic access to the parts that make the Ducati faster in the WSBK race series…so the bikes that are winning races no one can buy.
You see there are multiple race series with different levels of modifications allowed.
The Superstock 1000 racing class is very easily attainable in terms of modifications for you and me…in that class of bike, that’s actually attainable by the average person, Ducati is no where to be seen. Honda Fireblades dominate that class with BMW 2nd and Yamaha 3rd.
Ducati doesn’t want to sell you an attainable race bike, they want to sell the Ferrari of road bikes and only spend money on the very highest levels of racing to sell you on a racing ‘heritage’ for your very fancy road bike, similar to Ferrari’s biz and marketing model. WSBK and Moto GP gets the most attention so they focus on those. In those racing classes you need professional race teams to manage the tech on the bike, tech that you can’t realistically buy.
So you and I, who do not have a team of professional race personnel, and access to the engines and suspension components and custom fabbed seats and tanks brakes and all the other stuff cannot simply buy the stuff needed to have a similar bike.
You can however fairly cheaply and with easy access buy the parts needed to win races in Superstock 1000’s…just not from Ducati
So if you want a very sexy bike that’s excited all your senses in a road bike, Ducati is your best choice. If you want a race bike Honda is your best choice.
If you want a bike that easy to learn to ride fast at the track then liter bikes in general are the wrong choice. But if your an experienced track day rider and fairly fast already and want a liter bike that’s the fastest you can get it’s probably a Honda right now. If you want the liter bike that’s the easiest of the liter bikes to ride fast but not as competitive at the very fastest levels of track day riding the 2025 Ducati looks like the best bet. But it’s also by far the most expensive way to get a bike that’s on par with other very fast liter bike options.
To be fair to Ducati though, the total package of the new 2025 bike will probably be the easiest liter bike to ride fast (though not the fastest) at the track day level.
As I learned these, Ducati is no longer exciting for me
, Ducati, which is very beautiful but not fast, is very contrary to my understanding of Ducati.As I learned these, Ducati is no longer exciting for me
Not fast?
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Yep. You can tell an easy to ride bike by what's competitive in Superstock and EWC.
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