Severe issues with 2023 Panigale V4R. Need help.
- Thread starter v4rretard
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Understood, thanks for the reply. Sounds like a different issue than what this other V4r is experiencing.
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SG and A, and R&D are in the what the manufacturing guys call the true overhead. Manufacturing personal costs are in the COGs (cost of goods). So the 35% gross margin (man I hope they're getting 35% from Ducati) was turned into (spent into) a -1.6% net margin. If Akra is losing money they need to fire some part of the management. Most manufacturing firms actually require margins to be in the mid forties to cover the true overhead costs especially if you're spending much on R&D. And it takes deft management at that level of gross margins to get a black zero. I assumed Ducati was squeezing their nuts but would expect their blended gross margins to be in the at least high forties to be an ongoing concern. Maybe I'll take the time to look at their filings if they're public. The last year before I walked away we threw off 14 points net from 55% gross margins on 200 million turn over. These guys can tell me I'm full of .... all they want.
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I think you have a communication issue. The feedback you’ve received from others is that you communicate ambiguously. You clearly have some technical knowledge. You also undermine your credibility by reaching conclusions presumptively without acknowledging ahead of time that you’re speculating.
An example is when you advised a member it would be a good idea to send their motor to Mark Sutton (Duc Shop) for blueprinting. When asked if you had talked to Mark about that, you refused to answer directly and instead, gave a lecture on engine building. Only after being asked repeatedly, did you finally acknowledge that you had not talked to Mark about it, and didn’t even know if he was recommending that service for the pv4.
... Lots of energy and time into a passive aggressive statement
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Where did the -1.6% figure come from? I am genuinely curious.
I wasn’t able to find any financial statements or securities filings on line.
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You have much to learn of the google
https://www.emis.com/php/company-profile/SI/Akrapovich_Dd__Ivanchna_Gorica__en_1528389.html
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That’s quite amazing. It doesn’t seem to show up in some other locations I checked so perhaps just a UK offer by the look of it.
I was pleased to get mine for £4,875 delivered but at £1,500 you can’t imagine that anyone ordering a V4R now wouldn’t want one.
You have much to learn of the google
https://www.emis.com/php/company-profile/SI/Akrapovich_Dd__Ivanchna_Gorica__en_1528389.html
I saw this but wasn’t willing to pay $30 for the report. The site doesn’t provide any meaningful info without payment.
Took the bike on an empty road with a long stretch here. Bike leaked oil all over via the breather pipe, as well as it was throwing it everywhere on the frame via the airbox. Writing a mail to Ducati Italy. Lets see what happens. I have a stage 2 10r, which I rip much much harder than this, zero issues with it. Its very disappointing to see this from Ducati for such a premium motorcycle.
if my dealer told me, that was normal, I would walk out and find another dealer immediately. That’s the biggest crock of horseshit I’ve ever seen. I broke my bike in as specified here its 6k rpm, and have since tracked it four or five weekends. I am a track coach. I have never seen a drop of oil. There is definitely something wrong. And i fill mine to the upper marker. I believe Ducati has a European factory rep phone number in your owners manual. I would be calling it and I would have copies of every bit of work this dealership performed. What number do you have? I got mine last July #240. If this was ‘normal’ for a WSBK bike, there would be no WSBK.
What dealer are you dealing with? I'm familiar with India, and how it operates. I saw recently how Ducati Bangalore was committing fraud on buyers. Unfortunately, there are many places around the world that are either foolng you or unable to provide the service at the level it requires. Don't let your desire for something outweigh your critical thinking.
thanks. thats the next plan of action. waiting for a final update tomorrow. lets see
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Have you removed the heads to drain residual oil? It sounds like you over filled it to begin with and now you're trying to level the oil capacity.
On a standard drain you should refill with 2.5ish quarts. About half of your oil capacity is the sump and other half sits higher in the engine with the drivetrain/cam system. That portion of oil is never drained during a standard oil change.
What I'm thinking, is you've put in 3-4 quarts of oil, in addition to the residual oil left in the drive train. So when you're full throttle at 1st and 2nd the cams are throwing the excess oil along with high crankcase pressure, the excess oil is being picked up by the cyclone separator and being sent back into the airbox.
Have you had any leaks from the large black bolts located at the head? There's one right by the ABS pump and the other is on the back left near rear suspension. You shouldn't have any oil leaking from there.
I suggest you drain the bike to the lowest min setting, no higher than the lower bar. Start the bike and step through 1st and 2nd gear at high rpm. That will throw the excess oil left in the drivetrain/cam system upward, and allow it to settle back in the sump. After that ride you should have a higher oil level at the indicator. Now you know the excess oil in the head cavity has emptied. The oil level should be in line/spec at the visual window. If it's too high, just drain out the excess. It may take a few times doing this to to balance out the oil between the sump and drivetrain
On a standard drain you should refill with 2.5ish quarts. About half of your oil capacity is the sump and other half sits higher in the engine with the drivetrain/cam system. That portion of oil is never drained during a standard oil change.
What I'm thinking, is you've put in 3-4 quarts of oil, in addition to the residual oil left in the drive train. So when you're full throttle at 1st and 2nd the cams are throwing the excess oil along with high crankcase pressure, the excess oil is being picked up by the cyclone separator and being sent back into the airbox.
Have you had any leaks from the large black bolts located at the head? There's one right by the ABS pump and the other is on the back left near rear suspension. You shouldn't have any oil leaking from there.
I suggest you drain the bike to the lowest min setting, no higher than the lower bar. Start the bike and step through 1st and 2nd gear at high rpm. That will throw the excess oil left in the drivetrain/cam system upward, and allow it to settle back in the sump. After that ride you should have a higher oil level at the indicator. Now you know the excess oil in the head cavity has emptied. The oil level should be in line/spec at the visual window. If it's too high, just drain out the excess. It may take a few times doing this to to balance out the oil between the sump and drivetrain
Yes. This test was performed. Oil was fully drained from every hose and engine and refilled till minimum and riden again to see if it leaks. Their tests showed that the engine is having more blow by than expected, or the airbox was not properly sealed. I am getting the bike today in the next 4 hours and will take it to a nearby track for a test ride. I feel this might be a poor QC or a worn out piaton ring. In both cases, a new engine will be required or rebuilding will be needed
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You'd have more dirt/dust in the intake assembly if the airbox was not fully sealed. It would also need to be fully seated against the lower half of the airbox where the variable intake bolts down to. But you've only got excess oil, not dirt etc in the airbox.
If your airbox is 100%, it would be the piston ring. The only other path for oil to be there is overfilling and cyclone serpator blowby. If you've opened the head, you could verify piston diameters. Those diameters can be matched the the V4R maintenance manual.
Do you have a magnetic plug? On your first oil change, did you have some shavings etc as expected? Or did you have large slivers or hair like pieces would indicate the piston wear?
If your airbox is 100%, it would be the piston ring. The only other path for oil to be there is overfilling and cyclone serpator blowby. If you've opened the head, you could verify piston diameters. Those diameters can be matched the the V4R maintenance manual.
Do you have a magnetic plug? On your first oil change, did you have some shavings etc as expected? Or did you have large slivers or hair like pieces would indicate the piston wear?
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FYI, I had a brand new bike that would smoke from right exhaust pipe when fully up to temp. After the normal back and forth trips with “can’t duplicate” the problem, I parked it in their front door and revved it until it started to smoke heavily from right exhaust. The dealer finally pulled the head/cylinders and found #4 had no oil ring at all. Factory just missed it(?). After oil ring installed and reassembled it was perfect for several years before big-bore kit install.
That is an unusual factory fault, but not impossible.
That is an unusual factory fault, but not impossible.
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