A New Panigale Track Bike Build

Finally got a dry and fairly warm track weekend! Raceway Park of the Midlands again, track temps on Sunday were up in the low 100's so way better than we had all year so far. My rear Bridgestone V02 slick was about at the end of it's life after 6 track days, so grip was lacking, and it showed on the wheel slip graph. But still had a good time. I dropped a couple seconds down to a 1:45 lap time and the bike was much easier to ride and more stable on the throttle. I was using about 80% throttle in 4th/5th gear on the straight and it was only slightly unstable, whereas it was very unstable at 70% throttle before, so I'm pretty sure I'm going in the right direction.

Changes made for this test where:
1) Pulled 20mm of oil out of the front forks (that netted 15mm more dive)
2) Swapped to a 80Nm rear shock spring from an 85Nm to use more rear travel
3) Reprogrammed the electronics for the 14/41 gearing (forgot to do that last time, which explained why my TC wasn't kicking in as much as I was expecting)

Now that the bike is easier to ride, I can throw some new tires on it next time and push a little harder to see how it holds up. Still taking it very easy on the throttle, there is probably another few seconds to be dropped by using 100% throttle once I can get there without the bike trying to spit me off. It's getting better, I'm trying to make smaller changes now and assessing what effect they have.

Oh, and final highlight of the weekend was winning the Ninja 300 Cup race on my Unlimited-class Ninja 300! Only 7 secs/lap slower on a 2.3 mile 14-turn track on a Ninja 300 than I was on my 200hp superbike. How hard do you think I was pushing that Ninja 300!?!?

ALSO:
One note of caution to those of you tracking your Panigales, I'd recommend using a drilled front sprocket and safety-wiring it! The Superquadro sprocket is retained by just a bolt and washer, there is no more retaining washer like there used to be where you bent the tab over, or the ones that were slotted on the older bikes. So it's just torque holding the bolt in, and it's not supposed to back out. We put a new front sprocket on and torqued it to spec before the last track day. Guess what, it can back out! I got REALLY lucky that mine came off in a very low-key way and didn't cause damage to the bike, or cause a crash. I thought I broke a chain, had to coast to a stop off the track. Then got hauled back in on the crash truck and noticed after looking at the bike that the chain was still on but the front sprocket was no longer attached to the countershaft, the bolt and washer were gone! Here's what it looks like now:

Next test coming up on Monday, I got a new chain and stretched the wheelbase out to a swingarm length of 548mm, it was at 535 before so this is a big change. This is about the max with the 899 swingarm and we had to mill out the groove at the back of the swingarm to allow some room for adjustment for chain stretch. I got updated chassis specs from Mupo and they're specifying 548mm as minimum swingarm length so I'm right there now. Also set the rear ride height to 230mm (using the Kyle tool, which I think is a clone of the Corse tool), and put the 85Nm shock spring back in place of the 80Nm since I'll have more leverage on the shock now. Lowered the forks 5mm in the triples as well. We'll see what happens!



The chain is one of the new EK 3D 520GP chains, it's .15 lbs lighter than the DID chain that I took off.

Nice! Can't wait to hear how Monday goes

Awesome details. Great to read.

Are you posting any videos this year? Haven't seen any updated on Youtube.

How much cash do you need to drop to get that much data? I suspect it is a lot...

rdougan said:

Awesome details. Great to read.

Are you posting any videos this year? Haven't seen any updated on Youtube.

How much cash do you need to drop to get that much data? I suspect it is a lot...

Click to expand...

I don't have a camera hooked up right now, I sold my entire setup off of last year's bike with the AiM EVO4 logger and SmartyCam GP HD camera and haven't acquired another camera yet. You can get MOST of the data that I have by just using that AiM setup, which will set you back about $2500 including the camera. The Magnetti-Marelli system is a full wiring harness replacement so it controls the entire bike in addition to having an integrated data logger in it, so it's at a whole different level. By the time that's installed you'd looking at around $20,000.

Did another track test yesterday and WOW!!!! What a difference! That extra 13mm of swingarm length really did the trick, it's pretty much a completely different bike now and the best part is it feels like it's SUPPOSED to feel, i.e. just like my other Panigales. I dropped 4 seconds off my lap time by the end of the day. Still a hint of instability on the straight, but nothing like it was, and I could actually get to full throttle in 4th & 5th gears. I'm going to play around with ride height a little bit next time and see if I can get that last little bit of perfection dialed in. But overall the bike feels good now and I can ride it like I'm used to riding, instead of feeling like I'm on a bucking bronco that wants to throw me off. Corner entry and mid-corner are great, the Mupo suspension is dialed in pretty well now. It turned out there was nothing I could do with suspension settings to counteract the swingarm being too short, so that was the key to making the whole bike work.

Now that I'm riding harder, the electronics are really showing their value as well. The engine braking strategies on the Marelli system are very well-sorted. In order to use it properly you downshift immediately as soon as you get on the brakes using the downshift blipper and the system gives you a lot of engine braking to help slow the bike down, but varies it with rear wheel speed to keep the rear from chattering. You can brake REALLY late and it's rock-solid stable. If you watch the guys on TV and can't figure out how they brake so late and the bike isn't dancing all over the place, THIS is how they're doing it! Then as you start to tip the bike into the corner it eases up the engine braking to allow you to carry more corner speed in.

For the suspension/chassis geeks out there like me, here's the most fascinating information:

Prior shock setup: 80Nm spring with 9mm preload
New shock setup: 85Nm spring with 7m preload
Prior swingarm length: 535mm
New swingarm length: 548mm

The common sense assumption would be that with a stiffer shock spring on the bike, it would be riding higher in the rear end and not compressing (squatting) as much on acceleration. But that would be wrong. Due to the increased leverage provided by the 13mm longer swingarm, even with 1 rate stiffer spring on, the rear squat under acceleration increased by 4-5mm of shock length (about 8-10mm of ride height at the axle) everywhere on the track. Extension under braking was pretty much identical to the prior readings, so it's just overall getting a better weight transfer front/rear during acceleration which has helped the grip and stability.

Cool stuff, gotta keep learning, this chassis/suspension stuff is as much of an art as it is a science due to the rider being an important part of the setup, which I suppose is why the professional guys on the big race teams are very well paid!

Among my bikes, the 1199R is the toughest to ride hard. Was think of racing it but I'm having a tough time getting the geometry and setup right. Glad to know I'm not the only one on this boat of taming her to be competitive.

Keep the info coming Jarel. Thanks!

jamesz3 said:

Among my bikes, the 1199R is the toughest to ride hard. Was think of racing it but I'm having a tough time getting the geometry and setup right. Glad to know I'm not the only one on this boat of taming her to be competitive.

Keep the info coming Jarel. Thanks!

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There are several guys out here on the forum who have raced 1199R's so there should be some other brains to pick here too. I'm doing it more as a development project, so taking it slow and methodical with incremental changes and trying not to go faster by just riding harder like you'd do if you were racing. I'm trying to get it set up optimally first and then I can ride harder later. Otherwise it's tough for me to tell which improvements really made a difference, and which were just down to me getting more comfortable on the bike. I've been doing it long enough that I can run within a couple tenths from lap to lap, so this last change dropping 4 seconds a lap in one day was a very obvious and massive improvement in the bike, since I wasn't riding any harder (actually it was easier) than previously. I still have work to do, so I'll keep posting what I find that works.

Finally something new to try on the bike! Got a Race Seats carbon tank extension and carbon-pan race seat (Thanks @Thamer) and also SBS Dual Sintered race pads. Track days this weekend! Woot woot!

Are you trying the extension and seat to get you further back in the saddle I assume? I have been looking at ways to get further back in the saddle. it is hard at 6'3. the woodcraft one piece tail seat is sloped up toward the rear of the bike making it difficult to stay back away from the tank. that wears me out on the track more than anything else. loving this build and the info you are sharing. of all of the bikes i have ridden/raced on the track, the 1199R is the most finicky bitch by a fair margin. however, the harder you push it (exhausted after a few good hard laps) the better it reacts. you try to take a break out on the track and your on the couch for the night.

jarelj said:

Finally got a dry and fairly warm track weekend! Raceway Park of the Midlands again, track temps on Sunday were up in the low 100's so way better than we had all year so far. My rear Bridgestone V02 slick was about at the end of it's life after 6 track days, so grip was lacking, and it showed on the wheel slip graph. But still had a good time. I dropped a couple seconds down to a 1:45 lap time and the bike was much easier to ride and more stable on the throttle. I was using about 80% throttle in 4th/5th gear on the straight and it was only slightly unstable, whereas it was very unstable at 70% throttle before, so I'm pretty sure I'm going in the right direction.

Changes made for this test where:
1) Pulled 20mm of oil out of the front forks (that netted 15mm more dive)
2) Swapped to a 80Nm rear shock spring from an 85Nm to use more rear travel
3) Reprogrammed the electronics for the 14/41 gearing (forgot to do that last time, which explained why my TC wasn't kicking in as much as I was expecting)

Now that the bike is easier to ride, I can throw some new tires on it next time and push a little harder to see how it holds up. Still taking it very easy on the throttle, there is probably another few seconds to be dropped by using 100% throttle once I can get there without the bike trying to spit me off. It's getting better, I'm trying to make smaller changes now and assessing what effect they have.

Oh, and final highlight of the weekend was winning the Ninja 300 Cup race on my Unlimited-class Ninja 300! Only 7 secs/lap slower on a 2.3 mile 14-turn track on a Ninja 300 than I was on my 200hp superbike. How hard do you think I was pushing that Ninja 300!?!?

ALSO:
One note of caution to those of you tracking your Panigales, I'd recommend using a drilled front sprocket and safety-wiring it! The Superquadro sprocket is retained by just a bolt and washer, there is no more retaining washer like there used to be where you bent the tab over, or the ones that were slotted on the older bikes. So it's just torque holding the bolt in, and it's not supposed to back out. We put a new front sprocket on and torqued it to spec before the last track day. Guess what, it can back out! I got REALLY lucky that mine came off in a very low-key way and didn't cause damage to the bike, or cause a crash. I thought I broke a chain, had to coast to a stop off the track. Then got hauled back in on the crash truck and noticed after looking at the bike that the chain was still on but the front sprocket was no longer attached to the countershaft, the bolt and washer were gone! Here's what it looks like now:

Click to expand...

Concerning Front Sprocket:: Same thing happen to me last October going into turn #1 at Roebling. I was blessed and fortunate as well. Just coasted off the track thinking my chain had come off. Same deal, upon returning to my pits I noticed the sprocket was gone and it had carved a huge chunk in the "holder" under the front sprocket. I definitely have and recommend safety wiring that front sprocket.

weltonrk said:

Concerning Front Sprocket:: Same thing happen to me last October going into turn #1 at Roebling. I was blessed and fortunate as well. Just coasted off the track thinking my chain had come off. Same deal, upon returning to my pits I noticed the sprocket was gone and it had carved a huge chunk in the "holder" under the front sprocket. I definitely have and recommend safety wiring that front sprocket.

Click to expand...

For sure, I'll never run without it safety-wired again! Had you replaced your front sprocket before it came off or was it stock?

tack514 said:

Are you trying the extension and seat to get you further back in the saddle I assume? I have been looking at ways to get further back in the saddle. it is hard at 6'3. the woodcraft one piece tail seat is sloped up toward the rear of the bike making it difficult to stay back away from the tank. that wears me out on the track more than anything else. loving this build and the info you are sharing. of all of the bikes i have ridden/raced on the track, the 1199R is the most finicky bitch by a fair margin. however, the harder you push it (exhausted after a few good hard laps) the better it reacts. you try to take a break out on the track and your on the couch for the night.

Click to expand...

Yes, mainly looking for support under braking to keep my weight back without having to use my arms and knees squeezing against the side of the tank to hold myself back. I think the Panigale tank LOOKS awesome from the side profile, but functionally it's not as good as the 1198 tank was for the track where you could put your weight against it during braking.

jarelj said:

For sure, I'll never run without it safety-wired again! Had you replaced your front sprocket before it came off or was it stock?

Click to expand...

The first time I noticed it had back out a little was with the stock sprocket, but after replacing it with an after market it came out completely..........scary

jarelj said:

Finally something new to try on the bike! Got a Race Seats carbon tank extension and carbon-pan race seat (Thanks @Thamer) and also SBS Dual Sintered race pads. Track days this weekend! Woot woot!

Click to expand...

Track weekend complete, it was freakin' HOT all weekend, 100+ in the shade, track temps 130+. The two experiments were a half success. The SBS DS brake pads are awesome, that's my new pad now, I love them. Took my braking force at max braking down from 7-8 bar of pressure down to 5-6 bar. And didn't feel like I lost any feel at all, the release while trail-braking was great. I'm going to stick with this pad for the rest of the season. They're expensive, but I think they're worth it.

The tank extension/race seat was a failure until I modify it, I did two laps with it and came into the pits and put my old seat on. The seat is SO much taller that I couldn't deal with it, my outside foot was sliding off the peg in just about every turn. So I'm going to take the cover off the seat and cut the foam down a couple inches and then put it back on and try again.

Had a GREAT opportunity last weekend at the Laguna Seca World Superbike round to hang out in the Barni Racing pits and spend time with Luca, the team's Mupo Suspension tech! Learned a lot of new things, and some new approaches to setting up suspension than the "conventional" methods. For example, the team does not alter damping settings more than a click or two for any track, they only change spring rate, and they might change the spring rate several steps. Pretty interesting considering how tied conventional internet wisdom is on there being a "proper" spring rate for a rider. I got some great tips on altering oil level in the forks based upon fork telemetry data, which I'm going to try on my bike next weekend. We also discussed altering ride height/linkage ratios on the rear, and that was pretty eye-opening, more to come on that after I try it!

I want to know how to get my name inscribed on my Mupo shock now!

That might make for a difficult sale if u ever decide to part ways with it down the road for the next bike build. I can imagine u reporting a stolen shock. "Officer, I even have my name inscribed on the shock. Be on the look out for anyone selling my shock" lol

jarelj said:

Had a GREAT opportunity last weekend at the Laguna Seca World Superbike round to hang out in the Barni Racing pits and spend time with Luca, the team's Mupo Suspension tech! Learned a lot of new things, and some new approaches to setting up suspension than the "conventional" methods. For example, the team does not alter damping settings more than a click or two for any track, they only change spring rate, and they might change the spring rate several steps. Pretty interesting considering how tied conventional internet wisdom is on there being a "proper" spring rate for a rider. I got some great tips on altering oil level in the forks based upon fork telemetry data, which I'm going to try on my bike next weekend. We also discussed altering ride height/linkage ratios on the rear, and that was pretty eye-opening, more to come on that after I try it!

Click to expand...

Aww, I wish I knew you were there. I went to the race and would have loved to meet you!

DynastySS said:

Aww, I wish I knew you were there. I went to the race and would have loved to meet you!

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It was a last-minute deal, wasn't planning on going but was invited out by Mupo so I could talk directly with the technician instead of swapping poorly-translated e-mails back and forth. Got to see all my Ducati North America friends too, so that was cool. I had ridden on the track before, but never gone to a race there, it was very cool! I'll be back next year for sure.