Stock 2023 V4R front master cylinder

andyb said:

I’m looking for a measure…So how much does this 3 litres of oil weigh…

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Irrelevant. The oil that comes out gets weighed. Put the new oil in until you’ve used the same weight. It’s not complicated, takes seconds to do and I am not the only person who does it like that.

How long you letting it drain …?

If speed of change is the necessary like at a dealer I get it … but how many times have are you doing it one it, particularly where a speed if change was required? Once on your SP ?
Not touched the new one yet..,

Plus once you have done it a few times you get to know how much comes out and how much to put in it run it leave it before a final top up…

panibadboy said:

There was no claim. The bike was long outside of warranty and I'm the 3rd owner.

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Ah ok. This was still their failure unless someone else had been into it before. Factory defect.

And… because it’s getting changed so often I go to just above the bottom mark….

Weigh the oil, check it's volume after use WTF. Plug the plug and let it drain out. Underfill it a little bit and fire it off. Then let it set overnight and then adjust the level. Most of my ducati's use no oil visibly. But the oil is trapping water from combustion etc. all the time. Ain't much normally but there. So in reality the motors are using just a little oil. The V4's from looking at the cam profiles will probably pound the guides out after awhile so if one starts using oil it's probably down the guides. That nickasil stuff will hold a ring seal for a long time. Like Andy said change the oil a lot if you're mercilessly flogging the bike because the gearbox is chopping the oil up.

andyb said:

How long you letting it drain …?

If speed of change is the necessary like at a dealer I get it … but how many times have are you doing it one it, particularly where a speed if change was required? Once on your SP ?
Not touched the new one yet..,

Plus once you have done it a few times you get to know how much comes out and how much to put in it run it leave it before a final top up…

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Why does it matter? I don’t need to get to know… I know exactly because I’ve weighed it. No guessing, no estimation. Simple. If you think my method is probably faster then I’m not sure why it would be something to discuss or debate?.

Which master cylinder have you bought?

spooky said:

Why does it matter? I don’t need to get to know… I know exactly because I’ve weighed it. No guessing, no estimation. Simple. If you think my method is probably faster then I’m not sure why it would be something to discuss or debate?.

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Speed is not the important bit unless you need to clear the ramp and get the next bike on!

What is important is giving the bike time to drain completely…

How you arrive at how much goes back in and what method you employ is the irrelevant bit. .. and you’ll still not put it all back in in one go, you’ll get so far wait check and go bit by bit..

andyb said:

Speed is not the important bit unless you need to clear the ramp and get the next bike on!

What is important is giving the bike time to drain completely…

How you arrive at how much goes back in and what method you employ is the irrelevant bit. .. and you’ll still not put it all back in in one go, you’ll get so far wait check and go bit by bit..

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Sure, but once I’ve allowed it to drain as much as I want then I put exactly the same amount back in, so I don’t need to do the bit where you start the engine, let it warm a bit and go back a couple of hours later to see if the level is correct and top up if necessary.

So I get to the same end result as you do but I don’t need to do the last part. By putting in exactly what I’ve taken out I know that it will be where it needs to be. It does get put into the engine in one go, because I know it’s correct…

I’ve only needed to do an oil change on the SP2 twice and it’s been perfect both times. I also haven’t gone back to the bike two weeks later and found the level to be different, unlike some have found on a group that I’m in on Facebook. It’s immediately perfect and it remains perfect because I put back exactly what I took out…

I don’t see why it’s a point of discussion. If you thought it would end up with the wrong outcome then I’d get it, but it doesn’t and you know that so…

andyb said:

Which master cylinder have you bought?

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Still weighing it up.

See what I did there…

I had asked another person who preps bikes for race teams and for private clients and he came back saying definitely 19x18 if he was building a bike for himself for track days… I reckon 80% of the people I have asked have said the same thing.

I’ll probably give the billet 19x18 a go - it’s a significant difference to stock and if I don’t like it then I’ll know - if I go for the 17RCS and it still feels a bit soft then I’ll end up wanting to try 19x18 as well. If I try 19x18 and it’s a mistake then at least I’ll know exactly what to do and you get to say “I told you so”. It will be interesting regardless and the one thing I do know at this point is that I don’t want 16x21.

The list of other parts is pretty much finalised, although I’m waiting on Melotti to confirm something before I place the order. I do fancy the GP4-MS while I’m at it but my head’s telling me that there would be zero noticeable difference to the Stylema and that it would be pointless, other than looking cool, so I’ll probably stick with OEM calipers, which I think are very good for the money anyway. Then again, if I’ve had a couple of beers or so when I place an order then common sense could go out the window (and I’ve just come back from a lovely few pints in the sun with the dog).

All I really need are bars, controls and master cylinder, but ‘need’ isn’t all there is to life.

I’ll update my general bike thread once it’s progressed. It’s still about six weeks until my first track weekend of the year.

andyb said:

It’s a mute point
Was checking your decision making skills….

Which master cyl you bought.

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Moot, although mute is fine with me.

spooky said:

Why does it matter? I don’t need to get to know… I know exactly because I’ve weighed it. No guessing, no estimation. Simple. If you think my method is probably faster then I’m not sure why it would be something to discuss or debate?.

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It matters because the heads are actively scavenged by a stage in the oil pump. When you shut the motor down the heads are draining thru the clearances (not much) in the scavenge stage. Takes awhile to get the heads to drain so you really can't change the oil hot. So a couple of hours after it's shut off to be safe. Underfill it, fire it off to fill the oil filter let it sit overnight and adjust the level.

Spill chucker

baggerman said:

It matters because the heads are actively scavenged by a stage in the oil pump. When you shut the motor down the heads are draining thru the clearances (not much) in the scavenge stage. Takes awhile to get the heads to drain so you really can't change the oil hot. So a couple of hours after it's shut off to be safe. Underfill it, fire it off to fill the oil filter let it sit overnight and adjust the level.

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That’s got nothing to do with using weight to put back in what you’ve taken out. You’re talking about making sure it has plenty of time to drain. I get that and I understand why. This method being faster was not related to allowing less time to drain - it was about not needing to adjust levels after filling.

What exactly is wrong with putting back in exactly what you took out?

andyb said:

Spill chucker

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Is that one of those cute northern expressions? I’ve not heard it before.

Spell checker that’s been corrected keep up

spooky said:

Still weighing it up.

See what I did there…

I had asked another person who preps bikes for race teams and for private clients and he came back saying definitely 19x18 if he was building a bike for himself for track days… I reckon 80% of the people I have asked have said the same thing.

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just leaves a couple of sex workers in Prague to ask and that’s everyone!

andyb said:

just leaves a couple of ... workers in Prague to ask and that’s everyone!

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I did ask them - apparently they don’t see what difference 3mm is going to make. I tried to explain that it was all about the firmness and length of stroke but I don’t think they really cared.

One thing for sure you don't want to overfill these. The main scavenge section is on the downside of a screen that used to scrape oil off the counterweights. Really close. If you overfill them they'll froth the oil and bye bye rod bearings.

Man it feels good to have a warranty until Nov 2026… Might be the best track mod yet