Is the MWR filter worth it?

bronch said:

Nice Avatar btw. So, what do you think of Bazzaz or PC self-mapping units as opposed to other ECU flashes? (Rexxer, et al)

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I think a flash is better than a piggyback in all circumstances.

I don't know enough about a canned tune (flash) offered by the various companies to give a good opinion. I don't know what tuning methods they use to create the tunes. however, most bike mods are very minor....intake and exhaust changes. when you start changing cam profiles, reshaping heads, boring and stroking to change displacement, etc then proper tuning methods are much more critical. with that said, they are probably all decent. I will say if you are at a very different altitude or climate than the company that made the tune, you may be rich or lean after the flash. a custom tune close to home is best. there is nothing inherently wrong with tuneboy staying in open loop. I have had many a car I left in open loop but that was only because the cams were so big the closed loop system was nothing but confused. air pulses were so wide the o2 sensors had no idea what was happening. my opinion is that if you have a closed loop system, use it.

disable closed loop, tune it in open loop to perfection, reenable closed loop and let it adjust for minor changes like weather and altitude. best of both worlds.

ttkarp said:

So...I have Termi slips with the up map. Can I just drop this in and see benefits, or will it need additional tuning of some kind?

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I had the Termi slips and the up-map before I got the High Efficiency (not Race) MWR filter from Bellissimoto.

I had the bike in at the dealer for other things and had them install it. Thanks to another member on here and his tutorial, my tech said it took him 15 minutes to install start to finish and he said it slotted in perfectly.

He told me that there is some fuel adjustment in the ECU and that I should ride it a few miles so the bike can "learn" the new airflow.

I had a 35 mile ride home with no problems and of course I had a psychological effect that the bike was stronger with a more pleasant intake sound (louder also). I've ridden it for a few weeks now and about 1,000 miles after the filter install. It runs perfectly for me, I don't run the bike below 3500 rpm and don't find the revs below 5000 rpm to be too choppy at all. Above that the bike pulls very smoothly.

Wish I had done a before and after dyno but didn't. I want to have a run to check my AFR and will do so in the next month or so and post here.

So, in conclusion, I very much like my MWR High Efficiency filter. Considering the cost of many mods discussed here, I think it is worth it. I'm also somewhat cheap, as I went with the 14T front sprocket instead of the 41T rear as I considered getting a new sprocket and chain not worth the price difference.

Ok, so firstly, I'l like some clarification on if the claim is +6hp from the MWR alone, or +6hp for the MWR plus custom tune with a rapidbike. The MWR website seems to imply the results were obtain with a rapidbike, which makes the contribution from the filter far more difficult to access. Is it 4.5hp from the custom tune and 1.5hp from the MWR, or the other way around, or half and half, etc. If it's 4-6hp from the MWR alone, plus a louder intake noise, my vote is going to start leaning towards worth the price.

As far as engines failing or cracking due to the difference in air/power between cylinders... I'm going to lose a lot of faith in Ducati engineering if they didn't know there would be a difference and account for it ahead of time. Unless they are still designing by hand and napkin sketches, and haven't started using modern simulation software, there is no explaination for this. You just run some very simple CFD simulations, see that one cylinder is getting x% more air, and account for your design accordingly (or change the intake geometry to even it out). I'm sure due to the fact that the engine block is a load bearing member, there was extensive stress modeling (FEA) done on it. Implying that the engines are failing due to a power difference between cylinders is basically calling the Ducati engineers idiots and they should be embarrassed if that is infact the case.

BMC Race will do at half the price.

When it comes to "information" with regards to engine failures I think we have to consider the source.... MWR??? A manufacturer of this air filter.....Bellisimoto?? A reseller of this filter.... Hardly impartial are they???

Filter may provide better air flow and thusly more power..maybe....But improving engine longevity or even preventing its self destruction??? Hmmmm... Cannot quite believe that one...

i have this filter and i will say this. I am no engineer and if the filter sucked i would say so. i have a twin turbo bmw and changed the air filter box to get more air in. i changed it to a duel cone cold air filter. the car sounds and rides better said to have a 15 hp bump. i dont know if that is true but the car sounds great and runs better. so i wasnt afraid to give this a shot.
what scared me was the install as i had problems the first time that was fixed with the post on here by cobra. fast easy install.
my verdict. its worth it. the bike has a different sound (i have termi slips). the throttle response is better also. I did not have the bike tuned for the filter however ducatis run rich and I believe (just opinion) this filter fixes it.
this is just my 2 cents. ive had it a few months now not 1 problem.

mark419ny said:

i have this filter and i will say this. I am no engineer and if the filter sucked i would say so. i have a twin turbo bmw and changed the air filter box to get more air in. i changed it to a duel cone cold air filter. the car sounds and rides better said to have a 15 hp bump. i dont know if that is true but the car sounds great and runs better. so i wasnt afraid to give this a shot.
what scared me was the install as i had problems the first time that was fixed with the post on here by cobra. fast easy install.
my verdict. its worth it. the bike has a different sound (i have termi slips). the throttle response is better also. I did not have the bike tuned for the filter however ducatis run rich and I believe (just opinion) this filter fixes it.
this is just my 2 cents. ive had it a few months now not 1 problem.

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+1

IDK how they can supply a full race exhaust system with no replacement filter... think about.

From my point of view there are almost 2 threads in one here....

1.Does MWR provide better breathing/more power??

2.Does MWR prevent catastrophic engine failure??


It appears that the answer to #1 is possibly and it appears to improve the bikes "feel" and sound..I arrive at this conclusion given anecdotal evidence from members I respect...

The answer to #2 is what???? Randy has stated he knows of "many" instances of these failures as he "talks to dealers and owners".... Where are these people and why have we not heard more about something so serious??? This is something that should not be simply dropped into the middle of a thread almost as a throw away line.... Are we facing a serious issue here???

Stw said:

From my point of view there are almost 2 threads in one here....

1.Does MWR provide better breathing/more power??

2.Does MWR prevent catastrophic engine failure??


It appears that the answer to #1 is possibly and it appears to improve the bikes "feel" and sound..I arrive at this conclusion given anecdotal evidence from members I respect...

The answer to #2 is what???? Randy has stated he knows of "many" instances of these failures as he "talks to dealers and owners".... Where are these people and why have we not heard more about something so serious??? This is something that should not be simply dropped into the middle of a thread almost as a throw away line.... Are we facing a serious issue here???

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If increased airflow is blowing up engines, the fault lies with Ducati. It's not likely we're providing boost or anything.

TransNone13 said:

If increased airflow is blowing up engines, the fault lies with Ducati. It's not likely we're providing boost or anything.

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Kyle..

I think you maybe misunderstanding either me or Bellisimoto... They are claiming not using the MWR can cause failures...

Stw said:

Kyle..

I think you maybe misunderstanding either me or Bellisimoto... They are claiming not using the MWR can cause failures...

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Say whaaaaat?

BellissiMoto said:

Okay, nothing easy to copy and paste here, as it is roughly translated, but the Ducati Panigale has a serious issue with power differential between cylinders.

It's because the airbox has very low pressure compared to the size of the engine, and the air naturally flows into the vertical cylinder throttle body easier than the horizontal.

An 8.5-10% difference from vertical to horizontal power output.

This is BAD. This causes a couple problems; cracking engine cases (I know a customer who had 3 engines fail in 2400 miles)), and

MWR High Efficiency and Racing Air Filters for the Panigale dramatically increase airbox pressure, by changing the flow dynamics, which reduces the power differential by approximately 4-5%, and with the new adjustment kit (details soon to come), you can realize another 1-3 HP, and another 2-3% drop in power differential.

MWR has also just developed a larger intake snorkel, but it can only be used with track/race fairing stay.

Dyno figures on it will come soon.

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See above

mark419ny said:

. I did not have the bike tuned for the filter however ducatis run rich and I believe (just opinion) this filter fixes it.
this is just my 2 cents..

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"Ducatis run rich."

Could you please elaborate on this? What model are you speaking of?

Stw said:

See above

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I don't believe that would cause engine failure whatsoever.

oalvarez said:

"Ducatis run rich."

Could you please elaborate on this? What model are you speaking of?

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He means the AFR is running with more fuel than the ideal levels.

TransNone13 said:

He means the AFR is running with more fuel than the ideal levels.

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all this time i was under the impression that many of the modern day Ducatis ran lean due to the emissions restrictions. alas!

oalvarez said:

all this time i was under the impression that many of the modern day Ducatis ran lean due to the emissions restrictions. alas!

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The ends of my pipes are sooty.... This leads me to believe bike runs rich...

Stw said:

The ends of my pipes are sooty.... This leads me to believe bike runs rich...

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Do you think that is what causes the low rpm "surging/hesitation" found in many of today's Ducatis? The rich condition you point to specifically.

oalvarez said:

Do you think that is what causes the low rpm "surging/hesitation" found in many of today's Ducatis? The rich condition you point to specifically.

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I have no idea.... Fueling on the 1199 is the best of any Duc I have ever owned...so in truth I have no complaints.... I am sure it could be better with a specific tune but I think this can open a pandoras box of issues and a never ending journey to improve things... I accept the bike as is... not willing to chase perfection... I just wanna ride...

Stw said:

I have no idea....

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thanks.